New hero is absolutelly broken.
This thing is a free charged Sentinel you can have the whole game as third weapon. First shot is 50dmg, second bodyshot is 100 and if headshot its 130. Also much easier to hit than Sentinel or Kra...
Forum Discussion
@Balladalidila
I think removing any rounds would make her useless. Her ult is a huge risk huge reward. I could see some changes to bullet size tho, its very large so even behind cover you are still getting hit. In terms of plat+ ranked, stop peaking xD and you'll be fine. Don't run in a straight line, and don't stand still. I get how its played - more long range bunker down kinda thing, but that is where the ring will change that. So I don't think her ult is that broken.
I do understand about the passive. However, I think its worth it - for smoke. I have "targeted" people behind cover and such and I think that is a bit broken. But through smoke and caustic gas I think its fine. Just not behind trees and such like it currently does. Basically, it should be a mediocre digi threat sight. I say mediocre cause the "square" is too big to know exactly where the enemy is, you can guess and mostly get it, but I've missed a lot.
I think removing any rounds would make her useless. Her ult is a huge risk huge reward. I could see some changes to bullet size tho, its very large so even behind cover you are still getting hit. In terms of plat+ ranked, stop peaking xD and you'll be fine. Don't run in a straight line, and don't stand still. I get how its played - more long range bunker down kinda thing, but that is where the ring will change that. So I don't think her ult is that broken.
I do understand about the passive. However, I think its worth it - for smoke. I have "targeted" people behind cover and such and I think that is a bit broken. But through smoke and caustic gas I think its fine. Just not behind trees and such like it currently does. Basically, it should be a mediocre digi threat sight. I say mediocre cause the "square" is too big to know exactly where the enemy is, you can guess and mostly get it, but I've missed a lot.
How is the ult a BIG risk reward? Its basically a Sentinel but higher rate of fire that can three shot a full red armor on body shots. It even comes with a built in team buff. The only "risk" is if you stand stationary and use it as binoculars but if you arent low elo or just very confused and have a hard time spotting things, you dont need that to spot enemies that are in relevant range anyways (relevant as in to be worth taking shots at).
I think thats the main issue with this legend. Her kit is top 3 in all its niches but with very little draw backs: Not the best and most versatile "flying" movement but probably the best if we just consider vertical movement and still top 3-4 overall. Not the best "wall hack", but still very good and "resource free" (no cds). In ranked, the ability to see how many living in the squad and therefore spot solo rats can be so good. And her ult is basically a free third gun; a free, buffed up Sentinel
- @Balladalidila
Here's the risks:
- Using her ult immediately reveals your location
- Her ult will let you know if you're being aimed at
- Missing
- Extreme ADS slowdown
- Slow fire rate (if you hit someone with one shot, by the time you have rechambered the next round, they are most likely behind cover, if not, that is their fault and its not the ult that is op)
Rewards:
- Ult grants short damage buff for squad
- You "tag" them (not really that strong imo, I never know when my teammate tagged someone as I can't see it. Should be more like mad maggie's passive in highilighting the enemy)
I'm not against changes, but I don't think she's "broken and OP" like everyone claims.
And this whole "free third gun" argument is bs. If you want to go with that, then remove ramparts ult too. Nobody complains about that. Hell her ult can shoot through doors. * her ult is basically impossible to get away from.
Now, I could see some of the following changes to help balance this:
- Ult behaves just like ramparts: Cant use it until fully charged, must deplete fully before charging continues, make charging faster too then.
- Ult had reduced tag time (but maybe not, its not that bad)
I just don't see a huge problem with her. This game is not about playing it the same every time. Each legend needs to be dealt with differently. The second I see a laser from a vantage, I immediately find cover, run in a zig-zag random pattern, or honestly shoot back if I have a long range. I've knocked a vantage with my longbow/charge rifle already when she was using her ult. I took the first hit but knew I could get her before she had time to get off that second one. Yeah her squad didn't coordinate shots but that's their fault. Any squad that coordinates shots will always do better with or without a vantage legend on the team. If you keep dying to her ult, play differently.Lol you actually name "missing" and "ads slowdown" and "slow rate of fire" as "risks" which all just are basic properties of a sniper =) And honestly; your argument that calling her ult a third gun is "bs" is so strange. It IS a third gun and MUCH more so than Ramparts ult since you can literally take it out and holster it at will with just slightly longer ready-animation than other Snipers. How can you say otherwise? Yes, I would call Ramparts ult a third gun too but the difference is that the rest of Ramparts kit is balancing whatever advantages it is to have a third gun with the properties of Sheila. Thats why few complain about Ramparts ult. Its the balance of the entire kit that matters and right now, I think Vantage kits as a whole is a bit on the strong side since all her abilities are top 3 tier in its categories with little draw backs.
But lets agree to disagree.
"lol you actually name "missing" and "ads slowdown" and "slow rate of fire" as "risks" which all just are basic properties of a sniper =)"
- Not sure what you are trying to get at here. Her ult is a sniper? Why would it not have these risks? I feel like you're just trying to grasp at anything for an argument into why she's "broken". You say this as if it should not be listed as a risk, yet her ult is a sniper, so it has those risks.
"And honestly; your argument that calling her ult a third gun is "bs" is so strange. It IS a third gun and MUCH more so than Ramparts ult since you can literally take it out and holster it at will with just slightly longer ready-animation than other Snipers. How can you say otherwise?"
- Really don't see how this is any different than Rampart who literally pulls out the best LMG in the game at a slightly longer ready-animation than me pulling out a devotion. You can also take out and holster Sheila at will too. She can even PROVIDE the best LMG to other teammates too. Again, you don't provide much in terms of counter argument. All I see is someone who can't accept they may have had a biased opinion in the beginning. That is the point of conversation, so we can understand each other better.
"Yes, I would call Ramparts ult a third gun too but the difference is that the rest of Ramparts kit is balancing whatever advantages it is to have a third gun with the properties of Sheila"
- It is like you completely ignored all the things I had to say about changing Vantage's ult. I literally said fixing the threat detection, making her ult only usable once fully charged, making it so her ult doesn't recharge until fully depleted (like Rampart). These things will change and balance the "kit" as you say.
"I think Vantage kits as a whole is a bit on the strong side since all her abilities are top 3 tier in its categories with little draw backs."
- You have yet to explain HOW you think they have little drawbacks and are top 3 tier. Every time I provide a counter, you ignore it and come up with some other random thing completely irrelevant like "those aren't risks cause those apply to all snipers" which as stated before are still risks because guess what her ult is a sniper.
You gotta provide more than just these simple statements. I provide use case examples (ie revealing location, dont run in straight line, etc) to why I think she is not broken and too strong. Never once have you said "When I was vantage, I was able to wipe a whole squad with my ult alone" or something along those lines like "I was able to wall hack with her passive" (Which we've agreed to being broken, should only work in smoke/gas)
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