Honesty regarding Pathfinder Nerf
Whether you are for or against the Pathfinder grappling hook nerf, you HAVE to agree that nerfing ANY one character attribute by 133% in one update is not the way to respect a portion of any playerba...
Forum Discussion
Or, you can do what I do, which is to make a clear concise statement and not play devil's advocate. If you want someone's opinion, ask them for it rather than running around in circles making vague statements in order to figure out what someone is thinking. This isn't person A trying to figure out if person B is a homophobe. This is a discussion board for a game, you should've explicitly expressed who or what you're referring to. You don't have to backtrack and say you're vagueing to see what OP's opinion is, because they've made their opinion. They don't like how the nerf was carried out. You made yours, you like how it was carried out.
OP's Opinion: "Whether you are for or against the Pathfinder grappling hook nerf, you HAVE to agree that nerfing ANY one character attribute by 133% in one update is not the way to respect a portion of any playerbase. I’m thinking they could have achieved this more gradually over time as opposed to dropping a bomb on Pathfinder mains. "
Yours: "Path was overdue a nerf for seasons now. All in one go now. Beautiful. No dilly dallying, just cut off the leg and be done with it style."
There's also a big difference between, "I'm confused and want you to elaborate more on this particular matter." and, "I don't understand who or what you're referring to as important context in this discussion." The former would have someone ask your for more information. The latter should've been expressed in the context of the post.
"Last I checked, this was a discussion board, not a complain one, so I don’t think these forums are for complaining, but discussing things. However, complaining might accompany them, but they’re not for that purpose." The complaints are the topic of the discussion, it has been ever since the game came out. Complaints about terrible teammates, the SBMM system, ranked cheaters, hit-reg issues, lag, unstable servers, etc. etc. have all been topics of discussion. Not a part OF A discussion, but THE discussion itself.
Perhaps if you were less vague this discussion would go more smoothly. As it stands, all the inferred tone I'm getting from you is a "holier than thou" attitude. I'm no stranger to microaggressions.
"As you said, you’re not a mind reader, so try asking for more details next time. It might work better."
@pastaclownSo... what I did in my post asking them what their stance was on a matter I find connected to the topic is not ‘asking them for it’? I asked the OP for it and you come with your inferrals and we have this nice discussion about something entirely different. So this was a person A wanting something about person B, but a person C pops up kinda situation. But that’s okay cause I like a good discussion. I asked my question to the person, so I did what you wanted me to do. The only thing I didn’t made clear is why I asked said question.
I haven’t backtracked at all. The OP gave his opinion about the Pathfinder nerf yes. That’s why I didn’t ask about that, but asked about other similar situations to see what he thinks about that so I can better understand it. People tend to answer questions more openly and thoroughly (more thinking involved) if you ask about similar experiences instead of asking directly why they think something about something because their mind is dead set on an answer already (just a lil detour I had to make).
The OP’s opinion was about the fact that the 133% was too harsh. My opinion only speaks about a nerf itself. I’m not talking about the 133% part. Like I said before, if I (dis)agreed with his standpoint, it could affect the way he interacts with me. If I ask more questions I could give my opinion on the severity of the matter more openly that can lead into a healthy discussion.
Can’t argue with your discussion comment. Right as reign. But that’s why they’re a part of it imo but it may differ for you. It never turns into a discussion if it’s about complaints. It’s just a back and forth of insults or counter complaints.
Nope, this discussion was set to go between me and the OP. You have an opinion on my tone which you may, but that was not what I wanted to discuss. I actually find the discussion running smoothly. Just sensing a little hostility since you don’t like the way I’m presenting myself, which is always good in a discussion in my book.
Lolz Well it’s certainly quite amazing if you get the ‘holier than thou’ feeling from a guy who’s neither religious nor condescending. But that might also be the case for me sensing hostility while you may say that you’re not at all hostile. We can’t help the way we feel.
For that last part my offer still stands. If you want to know more, just ask me. Or look at other threads regarding the pathfinder nerf to see what my stance is on the matter.
@Koochi-Q It's admirable you'd go to such lengths to keep things civil despite the possibility of having differing opinions. I understand the importance of opening people up to discussion rather than directly asking for an unwarranted opinion on things, and also the quality of answer you get from it. However I didn't feel it was necessary on (what seemed to me) a clear cut yes or no post, and thus had wrongly assumed you had taken a, "Well of COURSE it was 100% correct you idiot" stance. I'd like to apologize for that, it's hard to infer tone and context using only text.
I also want to address that my statement on inferred tone was not meant to be a point of discussion, but rather hoped you would assure me that there was no ill intent behind your post. There's a lot of people on the internet, and a ton of them hold that kind of, inflated ego, getting off on being superior, kind of mentality that irks me so. I've dealt with them, you've probably dealt with them too. I've never seen you in such light and was hoping that that wasn't how you were taking this discussion.
Lastly, it'd be a shame to end this without getting your actual opinion on whether or not the implementation was respectable to the community or not. My stance on the nerf itself is that it does feel a little heavy if you rely on it a lot, yet with my playstyle I've not noticed a difference. As for it's implementation, I don't believe that it was put forth in a way that would appease anyone had such a thing happened to their main character. It was unceremonious and without reasonable contextual evidence, quoting it "...muddied combat legibility..." yet did not address serious combat legibility concerns such as enemy character models not registering on screen until they shoot you, the continuous hit-reg errors we've had for multiple seasons, as well as the game-breaking audio issues that have persisted for a while.
What's your opinion on this issue?
I love this change. It was way overdue.
The nerf does seem a bit overkill, If they had taken away low profile maybe then it would seem a little more balanced?
I can honestly say i've never noticed anybody demanding the grapple be nerfed.
Demands in the past to fix his hitbox, yes.
Demands to fix the crappy audio making his grapple silent,yes.
This nerf doesn't break the legend, it makes him harder to play well. He will likely continue to be the one of the most played legends despite all this.
With regards to the OP though, i think we CAN all agree the nerf was too steep. 25 seconds CD would have been fine as suggested by a number of people since the patch dropped last night.
With weapons in game that have around 200 DPS, 25 seconds is still gonna feel like a lifetime if you're getting lit up.
As for whether the nerf was respectful to a part of the community, Possibly....possibly not? I highly doubt they perceived it as a two's up to pathfinder mains and more as an acknowledgement of the difficulty of killing pathfinder due to his innate ability to run away when the going gets tough.
That whole post I put up didn't even go through? ☹️
Is there an auto save log that I can use or I have to type it again?
@apostolateofDOOM There should have been a "load text" option when you wrote that new message lol, i imagine its vanished into the ether now though so you'll have to re type. 😉
Edit: Your post is now visible for me....guess it just went through slowly?
EA_DavidCommunity Admin
A wild post appears.
Sorry about that @apostolateofDOOM, the post double-posted and was quite long, so our silly anti- spam bot picked it out for quarantine. I removed the duplicate and reinstated the main one.- @EA_David Thank you. You just saved my time and keyboard.
@pastaclownNo harm is done. When the other party is civil and I know them to be civil in discussions and give their side of the story I can be civil (yea you read that right forum dwellers :P). I’ve seen your other discussions with other people so I know you’re not one to easily take offense to a post and can come with actual opinions of your own instead of the rehashed ones that everyone used backed up with arguments.
I too apologize. I try to see things from all other ppl’s sides to which sometimes I look at my stuff like ‘this is 100% what I wanted to say’ and then ppl don’t understand exactly what I’m trying to say or even take it the wrong way (happens more when I’m direct) and figured, this was such a case, yet this time I did it on purpose, not to go ‘ha gotya’ but to have a discussion on the matter, as I’ve said before. So I can definitely see why you could take my post the wrong way. That’s the part of internet that’s not gonna change soon... how the text should be perceived. Do it with smileyfaces and emoticons/emojis like I usually do and people know/think you’re (somewhat) joking(ly) saying stuff. Work without them and you have no idea... damn internet
Lolz as you’ve said. You dealt with ‘em, I did as well. Heck, anybody worth their time online has dealt with ‘em. Nowadays ‘worth their time’ can be as much as 1 hour online and you already deal with ‘em. As I said before, this is why I kept it civil cause I know you were stating your case instead of character attacking me. But screwed up part about me is I like having a discussion. Even if I’m losing. I’m like a saiyan. If I’m beat, I’ll get stronger for the next fight :P
So yea my opinion on the nerf itself as you’ve seen is that I’m in favor of the nerf itself, yet the severity I found too high. Just as I did with Wraith’s. This is not even taking into account the 15 -> 35 part. Going 133% higher or lower definitely is a bad idea and I feel as a mobility character (they should really make new subclasses cause medic? Come on... same with Loba...) to have the sense of mobility taken away so dramatically is unjustified.
If you take into account that ppl are accustomed to having it ‘basically’ ready at all times to going to ‘come on, come on!’ is harsh. That said, I do not and have never seen Path as OP and likely never will, as a legend that is. Was he OP in the mobility department, definitely, if used correctly. You have wannabe spiderman’s who can’t swing from one end of the toilet to the other, but then you see one that can swing over the Burj Khalifa from ground level in one swing. Everytime you think you get close to your teammate he’s already 200m away and ends up being dead. But as a legend he was alright. Questionable hitbox, definitely.
This change however does warrant a new playstyle like others have said. If you couldn’t kill a path and he swings away you basically had to hope he didn’t know what he was doing, was really really low or had to have good aim cause if you were going after him, by the time you caught up, he’d almost always had shield back up or was already aiming at another surface to go-go-gadget his sling towards. Now they at least can’t do that.
So I think to have Path be viable to play again (cause that stupid skinny robody (trademarked it ppl!) of his still weird it seems) needs an adjustment. Either lower cooldown to 20-23 OR have some kind of weird limited version of his swing. Cause now to properly swing you just need to look the other way until you swing to get a boost. Lets say if you chain your grapple at full length, path is not allowed to fully contort himself to go as far as he could do now. If you grapple from shorter distance, you can do it to basically ‘ensure’ that you can still get away but that you’re not trying to fly up to the stratosphere or going mach 1 straightforward anymore?
Even I think the 2nd one is a bad idea but idea nonetheless. That way paths can keep the 15s cooldown cause they can’t leap into another dimension anymore and teammates can still somewhat keep up.
Thanks for asking my opinion on the matter.
@apostolateofDOOMHEY! What happened to your pic. I almost didn’t recognize you! Bad DOOM member, bad *smacks like Eric Cartman smacked that thing with a stick*. 2nd, they did it on purpose! @EA_David was certainly in cahoots with @MandatoryIDtag to not have you see your post! :P@Koochi-Q I like to mix it up each season and keep people on their toes! 🤫
I can believe it! @MandatoryIDtag hasn't said a word to me since the upgrade post but gave XP and laughed knowing I lost all my work and had to redo it. He really is nasty! As to whether @EA_David was collaborating, maybe he just wanted to first see me squirm before saving the day! 😛
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