Balance unkillable Air vehicles
No one should be able to go sixty and zero in battlefield. That is clearly the sign of a broken game mechanic, not good game design. It's absurd that air can pop a counter measure, fly off for ten se...
Forum Discussion
I play both sides of the games, the AA and the pilot side.
I can only tell you this there is a lot of misconception out there.
Most things get repeated over and over here in the forums.
The rocket and AA range is one of them.
But you are right, some, not most! casual gamers manage to rank up a high k/d.
But why? Because AA with its range is "harrassing" the sky. The 90 sec respawn time with the problem you could loose the plane slot.
In the old forums i had a quite long proposal to lower the rocket range, make it harder to aim with rockets (like a bullet drop) and lower the AA range but make it stronger in damage.
The "community" told me it is good as it is but didnt realize the problem gets bigger and bigger with every pilot who gets the "hang of it".
Most pilots dont "hunt" for enemy planes, because AA can reach most of the time 3/4 of the map. At least i dont do it anymore when i am without my squad in the sky.
Furthermore, the moment they changed the AA range, the FF damage and the planes the rendered most planes useless.
I see only the same P51D and G6.
As far as the planes in BF3 and 4 are concerned, the problem was always the same:
A pilot who was a good dogfighter will beat the enemy planes. Then the other team had to resort to ground to air weapons. But since most of these were lock on, the pilot just had to pop the ECM countermeasures and retreat out of range until he recovers.
This resulted in frustrating immortals who even if they did not made massive kills, they could still kill others but never be killed if someone could not out-fly them.
In BFV the initial issue was as some said, carpet bombing etc. But after all the nerfs the bombers turned into a bad joke (my video on the slow motion 4k bombs has almost 600k views now)
With the bombers having become a sub optimal choice, it was the time of the rocket planes to rise. G6, VB and that P51D.
As it was mentioned above, these rocket planes could accurately fire their payload and disengage before the AA can do enough damage to them.
I believe that what we should concern ourselves the most is the experiences from BF3/4 since once again the AA will be almost exclusively guided missiles that can be counter-measured.
Somehow there needs to be some way for the plane to get overwhelmed if enough people on the ground decided to focus their efforts against it.
The "AA invincibility window" of the ECM from BF3/4 should not be carried over to BF2042.
- @UP_Hawxxeye
It is difficult to compare BF3 / 4 with BF2042 with 64 potential Stingers on the ground + AA / MAA, when we also do not know how many planes / choppers there will be. I am in principle against EMC and dont want it to retur. BF3 jets were also very different from BF4. - @SirBobdk you always talk of this potential, yet in 20 years of BF I have not seen it once. Why is it only an issue for planes what about tanks.
BF1 was far from balanced Attack planes ruled until AA rocket was added, AA gun range changes and changes to planes. @SirBobdkHonestly, the max AA potential can never be fully realized outside of scripted performances. (seriously check that clip)
Most people will not care about the aircraft unless it did something to them and they want revenge. It is unlikely that the aircraft will ever have the attention of even 10 people let alone 64@UP_Hawxxeyethe problem of balance comes about when DICE leaves weaken single AA option only or lucky shots.
Take the Scout copter in BF4 for so long, it was to easy to repair on the go, counters and no short range lockon. Without MAA it ruled. Yet when mentioned all DICE heard was the SC was balanced and the MAA needed to be nerfed.
Let's not forget most aircraft had rockets and explosive bullets. Some of those rockets(not AA it Guide missiles) had no warning active lock-on.
Infantry AA is a joke in BF3/4 SOFLAM and Javelin, Stinger or IGLA. Range and Lock-on was the main issue.
You can't make an Infantry AA to handle planes and then it not dominate copters or handle copters and be useless to planes, if you stay with BF3/4 limits for lock-on or vehicle performance.
One option I can think of is for certain vehicles to have lock-on for long range between 300m to 600m and a manual guided under 300m.
The issue it could be manual guided against other targets.
- @DingoKillr
The problem of balance comes about when DICE leaves weaken single AA option only or lucky shots.
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Agree, but it's also because dice do stupid things, like monkey chopper, rocket spam, carpet bombing, fire bombs and canons. It should not be easy to farm infantry and it should have a long learning curve. Making planes/choppers strong against infantry and AA against planes/choppers just prevent any new pilot from trying. I dont like air to farm infantry but I also dont want to see any ny pilot stop trying because its to hard to fly due to AA. There must be a middle way. In bfv I think they got the AA about right on the Pacific maps. The placement of the AA on the earlier maps however left a lot to be desired.
Loitering around IGLA Stands but not in them until Jet Pilots 'checked' it was the key to Untouchable Jets in Play4free .
Very similar to BFV actually , but then BFV is better with its added 'Range Game' , where both the AAer and Flier know their limits .
High-altitude Scouts with Lock-Ons easily undoes BF4's Jet Untouchables .
One lone Laser Painter and a few with Fire-n-Forgets can be instrumental in quickly emptying BF4 maps of Enemy Vehicles .
With so many extra Players in 2042 freely arming themselves at will , Player Lifespan might be far shorter than one might prefer .
I say Bring it!
I genuinely dislike planes but they rarely matter in the outcome of games. Especially if the enemy gains air superiority and forces people to ground and pound flags. PTFO matters in BF and planes are so far outside the objective they rarely matter. Oh sure they can carpet bomb a flag...whoopppteeedo. Only take 1 or 2 medics to negate any casualties. BFV balance seems okay, you get the typical skilled pilot that can operate at the range they can't get killed effectively but I haven't seen it be the deciding factor in a game result. You can always tell why you lose by how many of your dots on the map are close to flags or not
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- @ninjapenquinuk That is when the also brought in Infantry AA, that fixed some problems.
This happens every DICE BF and it rude word.
- DICE launch BF. Aircraft are set to be OP so newbie can use and unlock/improve aircraft.
- DICE after about a year in, the planes get nerfs, improvement to AA to bring balance.What actual happens is past veteran pilots hog planes to unlock/improve. Even right post about stop people still their slot. So Newbie never get their chance. When the change occurs Veteran complain it is unfair to newbie and themselves getting weaker aircraft. Everyone whine about the lack of balance through out the entry game.
DICE needs to stop this mid game AA rebalance.
There is lots of issues.
If we are going to have jets, planes and copters the range of equipment that can counter, attack surface and attack air needs some better thinking as it allows to pick the targets the pilot wishes to hunt rather then a role.
When it is compared to ground vehicles option are limited to their roles. These limited roles impact ground vehicles performance unlike aircraft.Then there the argument that aircraft only dominate certain maps, well that is silly, nothing should automatically dominate a map that seem to be argument that a handful of players should have a right to control many others.
We don't need MAA if enough ground vehicles have access to AA weapons. Having creditable infantry(maybe stationary) AA weapons and counters to air weapons needs to be from the start.
Hopefully DICE will keep balancing everything by buffing it lol.
