How about a simple change to make it so, IF you play forward you have to use a forward loadout and defense you have to use a defense loadout. So tired of seeing PMD on winger, and PWF on defense. It’s a simple change that would balance things out a bit. Especially because PMD is extremely OP.

The WOC class system as a whole needs to be rethought. I'm not sure there's a silver bullet but the current system where most of the player base ends up using more or less the same two or three builds because they're that much better than everything else is clearly not working as intended. And up front I want to say that I'm talking about how most of the player-base plays the game. Yes, a small amount of elite players can make non-meta builds work for them, but the vast, vast majority of players end up railroaded into the meta builds just to keep up. I'll also say that while having a meta play style is to be somewhat expected in video games, the build meta for WOC has been pretty much exactly the same for years without any meaningful balancing.Comparisons to real-life players probably isn't useful. It inevitably leads down the same rabbit hole: McDavid is big and super-fast so my WOC build should be able to do that. Ovechkin is big and can shoot so my build should be big, as fast as McDavid and shoot like Ovechkin. Lindros could hit so I should be able to have a build as big as Lindros that can hit, skate like McDavid, and shoot like Ovechkin. etc, etc, etc. Might as well just give everyone the same big, fast, hard-shooting, hard-hitting build. And who knows, maybe that would be the best thing for the mode. This is probably going to be considered blasphemous to a lot of people here, but for me one of the best post-NHL 15 year for builds ( not necessarily gameplay ) was NHL 16. Fixed builds and most importantly everyone had the same skating attributes. With no arms race to keep up with max speed builds people were free to run with a build that fit their style of play the best. I kind of miss it at times.But fixed builds are a thing of the past, everyone wants customization. And unless customization is just going to mean "I want to be good at everything" there needs to be trade-offs, which makes sense from a video-game/RPG perspective. This is where the EASHL custom build system has always failed. There are trade-offs, but there aren't meaningful trade-offs. Consider speed and acceleration ( ignoring the yearly "does acceleration do anything?" debate ). Almost every build I see completely strips the four shot attributes in order to pour everything into speed and acceleration. And why not? The skating attributes have a meaningful impact on the game while the difference between mid-80s shooting attributes and low-70s is so insignificant as to be unnoticeable. It's the same reason why people run with lightweight, short builds. The trade-off of balance, checking and strength don't matter enough to counter the upside of being fast and agile. It creeps into other areas too. Every year I start out trying a more defensively geared forward build for center. Usually TWF or Grinder. And every year I end up running some waif of a sniper because I don't notice a meaningful difference between high and low defensive awareness and stick checking attributes. So I end up going with the build that can best keep up with the other speedsters.And the list can go on. There's so many attributes in EASHL that don't seem to have enough impact to the average Joe that they aren't just fodder to be stripped and dumped into the handful of attributes that matter.I wish I could offer a perfect solution, but I don't think one exists. If the current system is going to continue I do have two suggestions. First, make attribute choices matter. If you max out in one area you should be equally terrible in another. And the downside needs to have as much in-game impact as the upside. Second, maybe don't have the system set up so the builds with the highest important attributes ( skating as things are now ) are also the builds with the highest base offensive attributes. As I write this I keep circling back to fixed builds in my head. I'd be really curious to see a WOC mode where everybody played with the exact same build. I wonder how that would play out?

@PlayoffErrorGreat write-up and so true. I feel a big problem is the superstar abilities require too little of points to activate.I've written some of the stuff how I would like to see it done going forward.Speed (built into size and weight)Balance (built into size and weight)Agility (built into size and weight)Acceleration (built into size and weight)Endurance (built into size and weight)Offensive Awareness (built into build)Defensive Awareness (built into build)Strength (built into size and weight)Durability (built into size and weight)Faceoffs (built into position) (If you are a center position lock it's 90 and the rest are 80)Fighting Skill (built into size and weight)(15pts per category, max improvement 8pts in 1 stat)1.)Wrist Shot AccWrist Shot PwrSlap Shot AccSlap Shot Pwr2.) Puck ControlPassingHand-EyeDeking3.) Body CheckingStick CheckingShot BlockingDisciplineOffensive Builds need moderate improvements to offensive side of stats, but moderate defensive statsDefensive Builds need moderate improvements to defensive side of stats, but moderate offensive statsTWF/TWD Builds need slight improvements in both areas ever so slightlyExample Offensive Build-PlaymakerWrist Shot Accuracy 82 --> 84Wrist Shot Power 78 --->82Slap Shot Accuracy 82-->84Slap Shot Power 79-82Puck Control 88--->88Passing 90--->90Hand-Eye 84--> 85Deking 83 ---> 85Body Checking 81---> 75Stick Checking 78---> 75Shot Blocking 78--->75Discipline 82--->78Example Defensive Build-GrinderWrist Shot Accuracy 80 --> 76Wrist Shot Power 82 ---> 80Slap Shot Accuracy 80 --->76Slap Shot Power 82--->80Puck Control 83 --->82Passing 80-->80Hand-Eye 86--->87Deking 75--->72Body Checking 83-->87Stick Checking 88-->90Shot Blocking 90-->90Discipline 88-->90Example Two-Way BuildTWFWrist Shot Accuracy 83--->83Wrist Shot Power 81-->82Slap Shot Accuracy 82-->82Slap Shot Power 81-->82Puck Control 84-->85Passing 85-->86Hand-Eye 83--> 85Deking 80--->80Body Checking 82-->83Stick Checking 85 -->87Shot Blocking 85 -->86Discipline 84-->87---------------------------------Then I believe we need to change the whole Zone Ability and Superstar Abilities up. They need to be tiered depending on points put into the stats required. We need a Bronze, Silver, and Gold. Bronze = .5% improvement to function, Silver = 1.5% improvement to function, and Gold = 3% improvement to a functionSo let's the way too popular build of Elite Edges.Bronze Requirements - 82 Agility and 82 AccelSilver Requirement - 85 Agility and 85 AccelGold - 88 agility and 88 AccelObviously these are just ideas but it's how I'd like the future of the WOC builds to go. Many of the stats should just be tied to your height and weight without anyway to change besides adding a boost. That might make more builds viable for the future.

@SuperDad440 I've asked for this for awhile. It speaks volumes that PMD needs nerfed if it's that viable and obviously one of the most played types across the board.

@SuperDad440That's more of a balancing issue between classes.The idea that certain player types should be restricted in specific attributes is outdated.Speed is tied to height/weight in game but McDavid is one of the fastest skaters at 6'1. Svechnikov is 6'2. Kyrou is 6'1.The last 3 fastest skater winners are 185lbs or more. The notion that you have to be 5'9 / 160lbs to be fast is unreasonable, as is the idea that you have to skate like a slug if you are a defensive player type.That applies to other attributes as well, that's simply the most glaring "video game balancing" example.Your player type should only affect your areas of expertise, or X-factors in this case, and things not linked to your athletic ability, like defensive awareness.Meanwhile your physical attributes should only create advantage/disadvantage outside of a "normal" range.

@PlayoffError I think we're on the same page here, just have a different idea of what a good solution would be.Even my OD on the wing has near base shooting with 93 speed. I get my gold one tee and still have some decent defense attributes this way but it's really no different of an approach to any build in this game. Speed trumps any advantage you may gain with a few extra points in shooting imo and that seems to be the popular consensus also. Attacking off the rush with speed and driving the net is always going to be a strong play if you have any sort of step on the defense but the emphasis on speed alone seems to have gone too far now.

Forward builds/ Defense Builds | EA Forums

14 Replies

KlariskraysNHL
Hero
2 years ago
@BabyPuncher525 Yeah but say you want gold one tee. I'm not sure how they work exactly but I would assume they modify the stat boost when the shot happens.

So say you have bronze you are only getting small boost where as investing all those points in the gold version probably puts you close to say 95 to 99 for max effectiveness.
Most people aren't looking to be average across the board they want to excel in areas. Instead of feeling like a 3rd shooter you can feel like MacKinnon, Stamkos, Ovechkin in their primes ripping a slapper almost guaranteeing a goal if set up right.
BabyPuncher525
Rising Vanguard
2 years ago
@KlariskraysNHL I don't see the point of trying to have that high of shooting unless you really shoot from the high slot and upper face off circles a lot, that's with how shooting attributes are currently weighted in eashl.

I don't think ea wants us having 99 anything which I can understand but I also say all the power to people who want a 99 shot or whatever attribute also. As it is currently 80 to mid 80s shooting imo is more than enough to be scoring from anywhere for the average player, especially if you combine that with a shooting perk.

Stats aren't weighted the same in eashl compared to hut or other modes anyways. There used to be a time when getting into the high 80s for a wrist shot seemed worth it but as it is currently I feel it's too much about the perk and not your actual shot Stat. Which is why I say get rid of the perks and weight the stats more effectively so it feels like your getting closer to that elite level shot the more you increase it.

The best players I've known tended to run low shooting and utilized their mobility and skill to get to the net and score in close. Despite players like you and me wanting to see more diversity in shooting, when it comes down to it the best have always gone the mobile dangling route. Pretty sure by nhl 13 shooting attributes had been hit pretty hard in online modes compared to nhl 10 or 11 and it was all twf's and grinders with no shots just getting in tight. That trend has continued to this day but I'm glad they brought the shooting back with perks to some extent because the whole drive to/dangle to the net thing is more than stale after a decade.
KlariskraysNHL
Hero
2 years ago
@BabyPuncher525 And that has been a problem with the series that will more than likely get worked on will be the underwhelming attributes that don't seem to matter. Also means shooting will more than likely get revamped also.
BabyPuncher525
Rising Vanguard
2 years ago
Guess that brings us back to the OPs complaint of seeing so many PMDs on wing, that build archetype in the right hands has been meta for over a decade now whether it's been the twf or grinder in their respective times. All mobility and defense to win puck battles and gain positioning to get to dangerous spots to pass or shoot in tight. I can't blame people for picking it the way the game is currently designed.

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Forward builds/ Defense Builds

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