Rose isn't that bad

I would say Druid Rose is the second most powerful rose behind Party Rose... because her RoF is the fastest post-nerf of all roses. But you must be quite the player because Roses are never in any standings 95% of the matches I play in. And certainly never a vanquish master. 

But Rose is definitely weak. 

Rose didn't need the health nerf and Ice Rose is the only Rose that is really weak, pretty much useless now. She got the shaft big time.

When people say she is trash, or when I've said it in the past I'm making comparisons with like, every other class.

Stock Rose, Party and Druid variants are playable because you can spam the weapon and hope for the best. If your first proper experiences with her were after the patch, compared to the damage output on almost the other classes she's bad, really bad.

Look, you tell me one other class that was designed to be a ranged class that can't kill anything at range? The only thing she might be capable of doing is charging up her fire wand and hoping for a lucky hit, or killing someone afk. Ice one is even more trash...

Compared to every other class, look how slow the primary weapon travels?

The only reason she was nerfed so badly is because the majority of players are zombie lovers and they have to listen to their player base, this was evident when I made all my suggestions. Pre patch I didn't have an issue killing Roses, the issue was dealing with 3-4 of them at once all grouped in a small enclosure but I mean any class would have killed me just as bad.

There are players who can get top kills with Chomper too, but compared to most if the classes he is not a good class overall because EVERY zombie class has massive range, massive burst damage or a string of counters, for example.

• All Star can place shields down and block the burrow.
• Engineer is the counter
• Scientist has warps
• Soldier has rocket jump
• Super Brainz has massive spam able jumps and broken mechanics
• Imp/Mech destroys any Chomper, unless they can't aim?
• Pirate has two ability counters against burrowed Chompers and a Shotgun

The reason I'm talking about Chomper is because any new player could play Chomper and get more kills with it than Rose.

@llachie

You may get top assists with it, but unless you're stealing kills I doubt you'll be getting top kills. Also, you might not agree with this last comment but it's fact, if someone plays with a new class and it sucks they're not going to play it anymore, without upgrades she sucks.

Apologies for this by the way, I don't normally do this: 

-----

llachie wrote:
Rose destroys imps and there mechs - if your having issues with mechs then you need to work together as a term. If a group of imps run at you time snare them and use Druid rose to spread poison throughout them, if they get to close or use Impaka then finish anyone off by blasting them. Chemist isn't that bad but zoologist is so overused and is slightly op. I never see any toxic peas or rarely any peashooter a for that matter.

If your team had a balanced mix of plant classes then you can easily defend against anything. There have been some amazing plant groups that can manage to stop zombies at the first points.

Park rangers are a pain though. I'm actually surprised no one complains about roadie z (please don't) as when played aggressively it take down anything. An example was yesterday a group of champers constantly kept targeting me and my teleported however I rarely was killed. (9-1 with a high prestige unicorn Chomper so I ended up cross teaming with him)

-----

llachie wrote:
I'm probably one of those roadies. I get more kills defending my teleporters as a roadie than attacking the garden as an electrician.

I feel like PVZGW2 has added so many ways to cripple your opponents compared to GW1.

Ice variants
Goop
Spike weed
Stun mines/horn
Goatify
Time snare
EMPeach
Gravity grenade
New "stun variants" e.g Roadie Engineer
Super brains twister
(I think that's it)

-----

Given the fact you're mostly always playing Roadie Z, because he's great I doubt you'd be playing crappy Rose, also you're only beating the Unicorn Chomper 9-1 because it sucks, especially with Goop barely registering.

Even if you do play Rose, your statements about her poisoning everything and destroying Mechs with them aren't really accurate, her poison shots hit like 2s and 3s and you're going to need to fire and register 200 shots with her to kill a Mech, and if you can do that, or if you can outgun an Imp then clearly, they were facing the opposite direction and you shot them in the back.

Seriously though, if you are being 100% honest and getting the highest kills on Zombie dominating maps then what do you want me to reply with? That you're out gunning every Imp, Scientist and Super Brainz on the other team? Who in their right mind is going to believe that even if it were true, like what game mode are you talking about and was it even/full teams?

Highest assists is the only thing I believe, and that's because everyone else is getting kills. Of course she's playable, but aside from building a teleporter she's not worth playing at all. That's my opinion, and that's based on me trying her variants and especially Druid Rose online. I tried my very best, managed a K/D of 2.33 I think it was? Maybe 1.67 or something I can't bloody remember, but I think I finished on 13 kills and other players had like 60.

I spent half the game hiding behind walls and firing around them, Mechs everywhere, and when I recklessly tried to ambush one there was only ever going to be one outcome and believe me, everyone knows what outcome that is. I hope nothing in here offends you by the way, but she sucks and it isn't because I'm a bad player, she is just weak and reliant on every single ability just to juice a kill.

@zaheen I agree with you. If the TC is getting top kills then he's simply not on a good team and playing bad people. There's actually no way you'd get top kills over a sniper class, or a scientist, or even an imp. He has to be just stealing kills and getting lucky because there is nothing inherently strong at all about the rose in any way shape or form. It's weak damage, shot slowly, and even with druid rose, the DoT (poison) is a weak DoT. I don't really care how good you are with Rose, a player of the same skill level will be EVEN BETTER with other classes. It's a simple fact. 

I can get Vanquish Master as a Sunflower. But I know the Sunflower isn't one of the stronger classes in the game, at all. Just because I managed to get vanquish master means almost nothing because with my Iron Citron I can get Vanquish Master with so many more kills. I can run a match and get vanquish master with 30-50 kills with my sunflower. I HAVE had 70+ with Iron Citron. 77 kills is a match is my highest with him. I can't do that at all with a sunflower. Definitely not 70. As much as I love her, and even being my main class, 70 is not really doable unless I'm playing a team full of imps.....imps who are terrible.

@XMalakhX

You amuse me man, you actually read that? I just looked over my post and it's so long I can't even be bothered checking for errors, and you responded so fast I don't even want to edit it now lol.

But yeah, sure turning someone into a Goat is funny but they can run circles around Rose and none of the shots are fast enough to even hit you. That pretty much makes the ability useless?

In my opinion of course...

I really only agreed with you on the small part about Chompers being able to get vanquish master too. Because you're right. They can... But put that same skill in an actual good class and they do even better. I'm a good killer with the sunflower. I know the ins and outs of what I have to do to get kills. But when I play other classes, I'm even better. I can get so many more kills with the Scientist, the Imp, both sniper classes (Cactus, Captain), Soldier.

It's not like none of these characters are complete lumps of nothingness. All have the capability to get kills. But there is a tier of who can and who can't do things better. And classes like Rose and Sunflower are definitely classes that end up on the bottom of that tier list. 

@XMalakhX

That makes sense, and you don't need to justify it.

I heard someone say, "Sunflowers are fine because I saw someone with all the boasts with Fire Flower."

The funniest part about that guy was, he didn't even get the boasts himself? He based it on someone else getting them...sure any fire character is great because it ticks for 20 damage, and 25 with upgrades. It just means that, that player was bloody good and not the class is good. Just like if you're winning vanquish boasts with the weakest Citron you must be good yourself, and I'd love to watch a video or two sometime if you have any 🙂

You can't fully dismiss a class based soley on its ability to kill. That's pretty dumb. Sure you get many more kills as say a peashooter, but on defensive maps where would you be without the humble sunflower keeping your defence alive? Where would you be without Rose on offensive maps building teleporters, and disabling the defenders (if the game was balanced on those maps lol)?

BTW does anyone know for certain if goatify affects the ability of zombies to count as a defender when capping a point? It shouldn't imo, but if they still do then maybe that could be a (very) useful buff for her.

@InC0g

Would you or anyone play Engineer if all he had was stun and a jackhammer and a weapon on par with Rose? I doubt it man.