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tristkiss's avatar
10 years ago

The Plant Struggle Is Real

I don't know why, but over the past several days, where I have mostly been on plant teams during Turf take over, the plants can't seem to win. Not just losing the game, but rarely even making it past the first base. I can't tell you the last time I've even seen the end stage of Lunar base because whether I'm plants or zombies the game almost never gets that far. Again, it's usually halted on the very first map.  The problems the zombies had with the winter map (not being able to get past the first base) seems to have shifted to the plants now.

It got so bad, I even tried playing Turf take over on Zombie University map solo just to see if plants could take the first base when all players were "equal", that is no special abilities. To try and approximate human players I played 4 matches on craaazzzy and all 4 times the plants couldn't get past the first base. Then I played as Zombies on craaazy figuring defense should be equally as hard. But nope, it was easy as pie to defend the first base and Zombies won every time. I then switched to hard mode on the same map, and again, 3 out of 4 times the plants were stopped dead in their tracks. One of the times we got to the second base, but lost there.

Another thing that concerns me is the lack of team rotation. After one round, anyone who stays in the lobby should automatically switch sides, but that's not happening. More often than not, I end up on the same team as before. Which makes no sense. Gameplay wise, why would you expect a different outcome if the players in large part are going to be playing on the same team? You also don't give the losing team the opportunity to see if they can win when the roles are reversed, if you don't reverse the roles. Granted, I do see a couple of people ending up on the opposite side, but I don't know if they are manually switching or the game is doing it. But whatever the case, the game should swap everyone on the next game start.

46 Replies

  • Anonymous's avatar
    Anonymous
    10 years ago

    @Zaheen1337

    Just look at the size of your ego man. Look at how you reply to people that disagree. Are you always this right IRL?

    I'm just showing an average winrate across maps on turf takeover. There's nothing wrong with that at all. Devs would do it to see which sides are winning as a whole across their game and gametypes. Winrates over 47% in other games ARE considered balanced. For someone with, what was it again 97% A Level maths? (Not sure why you felt the need to inform people of that btw other than ego) please point out what's wrong with my method. BTW I didn't round it up to 47%. Not sure where you read that. 

    Maps clearly do play a massive part. In competitive play on the PC some maps are taken out of rotation due to imbalance. That's fact.

    People are making false claims like only winning 1 in 10 of their plant games, 200 assists per match, or that plants can's get boasts (*cough* looking at you *cough*). You know that's *.

    If that was true they'd have:

    1. Be really, really unlucky and always have zomburbia and moon base z in rotation.
    2. They aren't very good at the game and are part of the reason the side they are on loses
    3. Are good at the game kdr wise but don't realise they need to actually cap points to win.
    4. Just plain exaggerating their loss or lying.

    All this constant whining is reinforcing players opinion that they can't possibly expect to win as plants, which is a complete fallacy. You are part of the problem in that respect. 

    Seeing as you're so amazing in game, and life, I'd have thought that you'd have recognised that it is much more beneficial to try and explain to fellow players that it is still possible to win, how to counter them etc. You will only gain in skill playing against better (or OP) players. You should know that too from all your competitive play on the pc. Oh wait you didn't actually compete in anything despite your bluster. In comparison I have several thousand official, friendly and mixes under my belt. You know games under actual comp. rules in an enclosed environment. Not pub hero playtime. 

    An example of people needing to L2P.

    Zomburbia last night, unbalanced game 7 plants, 9 zombies. It placed me on zombies so I switched to plants to even it up. We had 4 cactus out of 8 players sat at spawn at the first cap. WTF was they thinking. How did they expect to counter the zombies attempting to rush our spawn with that sort of choice. They couldn't snipe from that position, only use their drones. Yet these are the kind of people that could potentially come on here, see your threads, and decide it's not their fault they lost, it's the game. Perfect Dunning-Kruger (look it up, like ad hominem you might learn something)

    I'm not claiming that zombies aren't OP. Far from it; but they only need minor nerfs, and most certainly not the ridiculous list of plant buffs you passed off as 'balanced' because you said so, and your opinion comes from god himself.


    @Zaheen1337 wrote:

    Even if the zombies team lose it isn't because the plants are balanced, it is probably because zombies were too busy farming kills from the spawn point to even care about the bloody objective! Rendering all your points invalid, sorry. 


    Seriously??? That's why plants win much more on the defensive maps? Where it suits their playstyle. Where they aren't even farming kills because they are too busy dying.  Yes right of course because otherwise you'd be wrong, and that can't possibly be so. You're an idiot. Rendering all my points invalid? There's that massive ego again.

     You know what baffles me the most about you? You somehow found the time from GW2's beta release to buy GW1 and level up to max. How could you possibly have all those hours free and still have the time to be so awesome, go to work on a very high wage because you're amazing, gifted and intelligent to boot and date all those hot women with that massive * of yours? Your life really is a shining example to us all. 

  • @InC0g

    Lol, where am I suppose to start with that?

    My maths trophy and A level results were to imply I'm not going to fall for some fabricated made up number, by you or anyone. You may win 100% of your games, where as Joe Bloggs may win only 30% of his. You cannot break down someone else's claims and add them to your own experience to make up a value, and then add more to that made up value and end up with 47%. I then stated that even if it was true, which it bloody isn't, it would be because zombies don't care about defending the objective because they want the plants to take it so they can farm MORE kills.

    I haven't lied about anything, I really did get 200 assists with the Welder, and I bet I could get very similar figures online as well because that class has as much splash as toxic pea if not more...

    My personal life or what I'm doing with my time right now isn't really any of your business. I've made the choice of taking a few months off work, the comments about ladies was from high school until now and it's not many, and that comment can't be taken back and it was in response to someone who was being pretty offensive. The reply above by me was made at someone else acting so ridiculous that I felt he needed to be put in his place, but that person wasn't you, was it? It's just you seem to like holding his hand which isn't my problem is it, it's your own.

    Anyway man, I still disagree with your points. Primarily because you're wrong...you are however entitled to your own opinion, however wrong or right you think it is. 😉

    Bottom line is, plants have very little / next to no burst at all. The few bombs they do have can be blasted into space from what I've heard and well when trying to capture a base with classes that were designed to be defensive, you're going to struggle badly. When you're attacking classes that have over 5x the health you do, and 5x the damage output you do (Vampire Flower vs Mech) for example, you're up against impossible odds. Now please absorb this fact into your tiny little brain so we can agree on something and move on.

  • Anonymous's avatar
    Anonymous
    10 years ago

    @Zaheen1337 wrote:

    @InC0g

    Lol, where am I suppose to start with that?

    My maths trophy and A level results were to imply I'm not going to fall for some fabricated made up number, by you or anyone. You may win 100% of your games, where as Joe Bloggs may win only 30% of his. You cannot break down someone else's claims and add them to your own experience to make up a value, and then add more to that made up value and end up with 47%. I then stated that even if it was true, which it bloody isn't, it would be because zombies don't care about defending the objective because they want the plants to take it so they can farm MORE kills.


    Please quote me where I said plants win 47% of games. Go ahead. If the average win rate in this, or any game, is say roughly 50%, and you have a player winning 30% consistently then what does that show about the player? Oh, and before you assume I'm saying the win rate of plants is now 50% I'm not. Just to clarify my position.


    @Zaheen1337 wrote:

    @InC0g

    I then stated that even if it was true, which it bloody isn't, it would be because zombies don't care about defending the objective because they want the plants to take it so they can farm MORE kills.


    Try reading what I put next time. I said that when plants are defending they win more. I'm quite sure that if the zombies wanted to farm kills they would push the cap point. Maths might be your strong point but comprehension sure isn't. 

    So then according to you, when on attack, plants only win due to zombies allowing them to so they can farm more kills. Nice statement. Funny how on some games on certain maps, those pesky zombies don't seem to want the plants to pass the first one. Doesn't really fit your argument does it.


    @Zaheen1337 wrote:

    @InC0g

    I haven't lied about anything, I really did get 200 assists with the Welder, and I bet I could get very similar figures online as well because that class has as much splash as toxic pea if not more...


    Ok cupcake. You go get 200 assists online. Post the video. Should be interesting. Actually I'll make it easy for you; lets go with half that. 100 would be a great start.


    @Zaheen1337 wrote:

    @InC0g

    My personal life or what I'm doing with my time right now isn't really any of your business


    Indeed. So why do you keep feeling the need to tell everyone, in multiple threads, how awesome you are 🙂

  • @InC0g

    Listen pal, I'm using an iPad and it's not as easy as a PC to copy and paste, and I'm not prepared to waste 20 minutes of my time just to prove you wrong.

    Why don't you press the previous page or two and read what you wrote, and save yourself the embarrassment...

    How about that, hmm? 🙂

  • Anonymous's avatar
    Anonymous
    10 years ago

    @Zaheen1337

    Here you go. Now where exactly did I say plants win 47% of games?


    @InC0g wrote:
    @AlexP1980

    @AlexP1980 wrote:

    @InC0g wrote:

    @AlexP1980 wrote:
    The point is that if we pick average teams and we make them play 2 games, one with zombies and one with plants vs each other, the zombie team wins easily both games 90% of the time in turf takeover.

    No way in hell is that accurate. I'm winning way more than that as plants in that mode. Sure if you got stuck playing zomburbia (and Moon Base Z to a certain extent) all the time i'd agree with that, but on other maps plants can easily win too. 


    So you are saying that in 2 maps plants don't have a chance and the others (when defending) got 50%? It's 75% winning rate for zombies. If you feel it's ok...


    Well I've just taken you from winning 1 in 10 to a comparatively huge 1 in 4 without any effort on your part whatsoever. You can thank me later 🙂

    I can improve your odds even further if you take into account that plants tend to win Great White North and Seeds of Time more often than not (in my experience of course). I'd say they win those around 75% of the time.

    So now your at a 37.5% chance of winning, or just over 1 in 3.

    But wait it gets even better. They don't always lose Zomburbia and Moon Base Z either...

    Even if they only won a lowly 1 in 20 of those two you would now have a whopping 40% chance of winning.

    I'd say anything hovering around or over 46-7% win rates are getting as close to balanced as possible, as there will always be slight variation. Looking at it like that I don't really feel as if we're that far off it. A few more wins on the bad maps and you'd be there. Of course that is for Turf Takeover / Herbal Assault. Other modes / maps will be different. You have to think that Buffs / Nerfs in one gametype can have larger implications in others.

    On a final note; If you jump into MP and see Zomburbia and Moon Base Z load don't think "oh we're screwed, I can't be arsed with this", why not think "hey we've got a really good chance of winning if we can get past those couple of awkward cap points". If you go in with a defeatist attitude to start with it's as good as a loss from the outset. Besides it can only improve your gameplay to play something more challenging, whilst the ones having an easier time of it learn nothing at all.


    PS. When do you think you'll be able to show us all a video of you getting a measly 100 assists (I don't require the full 200) ?

  • EA_Andy's avatar
    EA_Andy
    Icon for EA Staff (Retired) rankEA Staff (Retired)
    10 years ago

    Locking this thread now.

    While we want you to openly discuss and provide your feedback on anything related to the game, this has to be done in a civil and constructive way.

    Resorting to insults isn't going to fly and any more threads where this happens will result in the same thing happening.

    - Andy -

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