Re: Why do people hate blaster mains in hero modes?

@VetteC5RXIden is annoying AF tho with her alt fire, it recharges before your health starts regenerating so she can kill you from full hp that way

@AnakinVader34Annakin does, yes; but that’s not going to solely make up for all of the unblockables blasters have. The only other saber user who can “rightfully” bypass a block with their saber is Yodas dash but it’s damage was needed. Kylo “can” but that’s not a given that’s ONLY the final strike of Frenzy and only IF the opponent doesn’t dodge it so it’s really moot. 

Saber users have some passive crowd control that’s unblockable but not heavy damage dealing. Abilities like Rey & Obis Mind Tricks or Dookus Weakness don’t deal damage, they only aid the player in attempting to do damage but that can be countered by a good player. 

Annakin and Yoda are the only saber users who can bypass a block and deal actual damage whereas most blaster users can do this. Chewie is ridiculous. His bow caster shots can’t be deflected, do high damage per shot, his stun is unblockable, he has tank health, and his charge slam not only has a large AOE but it’s relatively easy to bug the hit detection with it and have it bypass block; or at the very least will wallop a saber users stam. 

that’s the other aspect people don’t think about. Yes saber users eat stam like blaster users overheat but blaster users can hit a cooling flush and keep shooting while saber users HAVE to wait for stam regen. Plus since most blaster users have unblockable damage abilities even if they do overheat they have a backup whereas a saber user is cooked if their stam is drained; not only can they not block but they can’t finish strike.

@AnakinVader34The passionate strike of Anakin is mostly garbage though because at least the second strike from overhead can be easily dodged by both saber and blaster heroes.

The animation window leaves enough time to let people know that they better nope out of the spot where they're standing right now.

It's best purpose is using it against other saber users who see that your stamina is low and keep spamming against your block to surprise them.

Or targets that won't fight back because they didn't realize that you're coming from behind or because they're immobilized by the magnet ability.

I don't and different people have different opinions and play styles 

Most of the younger people love to be a lightsaber users as we all did as kids and even  some adults 

The fact is most people just want to win with the best team combination possible. 

@VetteC5RXI agree Chewie is ridiculous not to mention Impervious which can give him like about 1200 health when combined with bonus health. That bowcaster is annoying AF though, true. He used to be a lot worse tho, remember 3-shotting Vader w/focused rage in 2018? I do. He's nowhere near as bad as he once was.

@ToddyRocket1  You’re 100% right! Given the nature of Star Wars people want to play with the characters they relate to or feel at the moment. 

the problem with all the imbalance is that the game penalizes you for this. Rather than balancing all characters to be fairly evenly matched against everyone else you have extreme highs and lows in overall capability so if one side stacks with OP characters you either have to do the same or get spanked. 

@AnakinVader34 There are hit issues with passionate strike. These issues are similar to Phasmas staff strikes. At times they’re precise but other times they fail to register. The AOE for the recognition is too small when compared to the higher mobility of the gameplay that we see now. The servers simply struggle to resolve all of the conditions and movement and as a result both abilities are easily dodge-able. Annakins passionate strike does have a pretty big Telegraph but given that it bypasses block that’s fair. 

The real elephant in the room IMO are the blaster users dodge hit detection nullification issue which makes saber strike hit detection problematic. 

for similar server reasons mentioned above the fact that blaster characters won’t detect a saber hit until momentarily after a dodge use means that it’s not only possible but easy to use dodge in such a way as to keep your character from taking a majority of strikes. The hit detection doesn’t follow the characters visual render. 

this is just my opinion but I think it’s valid and there are some other veterans who have game tested who can contribute here ... but .... IMO the game had too many arguments and conditions for the server to resolve with any regular accuracy and this contributes to a lot of the mechanics we see in game. Poor ability & hit detection, movement inaccuracies, input lag, etc. 

@AnakinVader34Then tell me why me and my opponents can dodge it so easily in a normal game at least. Am I hallucinating or...?

What @VetteC5RX said about it summarizes it quite well. Note that the registration and input stack problem isn't exclusive to the passionate strike either, just ask the rocket troopers who get killed over a second after taking off etc.

@TRlALON truth. Input stacking in this game is garbage! I don’t know why they implemented that. It would have been much better if the input code couldn’t execute that it be ignored and the player could try again at a more proper time ... but now “properly timed” executions are clumsy because of the stack and the server state. 

@VetteC5RXImagine, even Mario Kart does this better lol. A simple thing, a cooldown period where you're immune against any further item/ability stuns and stuff would be something to begin with.

@TRlALONWell tbh, sorry for slow reply, but particularly the final part tracks me loads. I do often have 3 bars though 😉 always makes tracking worse when that happens imo.
Could you comment?

@AnakinVader34Well, with a not-so great connection, nothing will be in your favour. Any lag or tracking issue will hit you harder then.

My internet connection really isn't the best either and I have to endure a lot of depressing stuff because of it.

@TRlALONHopefully battlefront 3 doesn't have poor online so we don't have to deal with that

@AnakinVader34 our biggest issue with any future BF title will be having it built in Frostbite.

the servers are always going to struggle with a title like BF written in this way and especially with so many conditions like BF 2 has.

@AnakinVader34  Frostbite is great for visuals and cinematics but awful for large scale map game mechanics. Frostbite is EA proprietary and rather than using an engine that’s better suited to that type of game coding they force the issue and what you end up with is a game that visually looks great but plays haphazardly. 

We saw aspects of this in BF 5 but to a lesser extent because Battlefield doesn’t have all the conditional variables that Battlefront does nor does Battlefront have the close quarters high mobility variables or input stacking resolutions that Battlefront has to deal with ... Frostbite just isn’t optimum for these titles. UE5 would be a much better choice. 

@AnakinVader34 well .. yes & no.

Fallen Order has better detection namely because it has far fewer conditions to resolve at any one time than BF 2 does; Fallen Order isn’t a large scale multiplayer environment. There’s no net code in Fallen Order.

the combat mechanics are different in Fallen Order as well. One of the things I’ve been a bit critical on was their over-reliance on the parry mechanic. Battlefront 2 has no parry but in Fallen Order they made the combat revolve around that mechanic more than they needed to. 

Having parry is fine and if that’s a particular persons play style that’s great but they could have made the combat feel much more fluid by enabling players to strike from block in Fallen Order rather than forcing them to drop block to strike. It’s pretty clear that they didn’t do this because it would erode their idea of parry. In reality what it did was cause the combat to feel heavier than it needs to be. 

I played through Fallen Order on GM and truthfully i evaded FAR more than I ever chose to parry and found it to be more effective; especially since throughout most of the game you’re dealing with multiple enemies at once and in those scenarios parry isn’t the most effective strat. 

I, personally, wouldn’t develop a combat system that’s designed on boss fights and use that for a whole open world game but that’s me. I’d create a more flexible system. 

Fallen Order by design has an easier time processing because it’s less complex than BF 2. 

@VetteC5RXNot to mention that most of the special lightsaber (and force) skills in FO were rather useless and more than anything just opened a wide window for the opponent to sneak an attack in, all while every successful hit by an opponents meant that you got stunned/your animation cancelled.

I haven't played again since I finished the game shortly after launch and I know there were some updates, but this was what pissed me off the most about FO's combat mechanics.

Also these occasional stun locks where I died while still having 5 stimpacks left but no chance to use even one, god I hated this so much.

So most time through the game I just spent spamming the same special lightsaber attacks + parry + evade move pattern over and over again because most other stuff available to use was too likely to work against me and to result in a loss of HP and even more force energy while my tactis simply got the job done.

The worst scenario was the final fight because it was like forget everything you've learned previously as there was no way to wear Trilla's stamina down effectively.

Really, the lightsaber combat in BF II even feels better because you don't get stunned/interrupted by the softest standard attacks already and combat feels more dynamic overall with all movement required, even if that's largely attributed to the parry (and jump) exploit as well as dodging behind someone.

@TRlALON There isn’t actually a parry mechanic in BF 2 ... there is a counter strike but you can’t actually parry an opponent in BF 2.

I agree the combat in BF 2 is way smoother than FO. Truthfully if the Devs hadn’t fouled up the existing mechanics the way they did with TROS update we’d be far better. The game was in a better state before that update. 

Cal in FO just feels heavy and lunky in his overall movements and in combat that comes off feeling clumsy not smooth. I didn’t even bother trying to parry and I made out better. 

The update to FO was SUCH a let down. They added a “New +” game mode and a combat mode. ... now ... as an OG gamer I know what legacy “+” game modes are and this ISN’T it. In a “New Game +” the ONLY items you keep are ... appearance items!!! That’s right! After all that they Devs really thought there was replay value in starting over with nothing but some clothes! Yes, because a poncho creates a whole new gameplay experience?!? ... No, a proper New Game + sees your character starting new with EVERYTHING they collected from the previous play through! That’s the replay value! Experiencing the game with those abilities and unlocks from the go. ...

now I know some may be thinking .. “well that makes the game too easy” ... ok ... and? If someone thinks it’s too easy just don’t + game. 

as for the combat mode, again, they fall short. In this mode you can create custom battle scenarios against any opponent in a number of geographic environments. On the surface this sounds like a great idea ... and it would be ... if you weren’t limited to using ONLY the abilities you’ve unlocked in the gameplay up to that point. .... well that’s shenanigans; I can customize everything else about the battle scenario but I can’t customize my abilities? So this means that a fully kitted up Cal isn’t available for custom scenarios until near the end of the story by which point the battle scenario is nearly moot because you’ve fought them all anyway. 

... and on the subject of FO who’s idea was it for the collectible gems? I really hope the Devs read these threads because this is really for them .... news flash; NOBODY wants to back track for 10 minutes on Zeffo for a single silly bauble! Backtracking is a perfectly valid aspect to game design ... when done correctly. In the Metroid series, for example, you would backtrack through areas of the map multiple times but there was a gameplay advancing objective each time; not a trinket. ... Even worse if you are going to use back tracking make sure you open up shortcuts to bi-directional travel. FO has shortcuts that are one way only; meaning that if you do want to return to an area you’ll have to go the long way ... yeah, no thanks.

I’ve been gaming for 30 years, I’ve seen it all; literally. Ive offered to consult with EA on this franchise for free to help them get it right in terms of game logic. For the love of all things human I hope they learn for the next title. 

@AnakinVader34It would be a start if heroes actually had block animations upon blocking a lightsaber strike.

The defender's lightsaber being static all the time doesn't help to create a better choreography.

Overall I think the choreographies are fine, given that they were intended to simply highlight different styles of the characters.

The only one who hurts my eyes in HvH is Grievous, because even when not looking closely it just looks like he's about to passionately slay pillars or clone troopers who can't defend themselves from lightsaber strikes anyways. Means he doesn't need to circumvent any lightsaber block or back up for counterattacks. Looks great and brutal in Supremacy/GA, but really off in HvH.

Then again, the heroes were never made and balanced solely around HvH.

Let's not get started about how Grievous holds both lightsabers at head height to block but the only zone where he's never able to block blaster shots is... his head. #justbattlefrontthings

How far off-topic are we again? lol