Maul (L) is no longer meta and has passed

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025797" wrote:

"Olga;c-1025795" wrote:

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025792" wrote:

"Olga;c-1025746" wrote:
Zaul is still meta. Those Rex teams exist as a hard counter to Zaul.

I'm not so sure about the ultimate meta being 1 team; I'm running a team that can beat both Rex and maul led teams. It has it's own weakness, but 1st, no one prevails on Def but drops less than maul, 2nd, every team is probably designed by CG with a counter in mind. I think the 'meta' will be a group of complementary squads that you swap in and out depending on who you face.

Sure, Maul and Rex are both meta.

Are you certain there aren't more squads that can't be added to maul and Rex? Rock, Paper, scissors? So you have your rock and paper, but whose your scissors? Just thinking outoud, and not following the common idea that the ultimate meta is so limited.

The thing is, most Zaul squads can just swap Nihilus and Zaul's places and suddenly they have a Rex counter.

"Zooey;c-1025800" wrote:

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025797" wrote:

"Olga;c-1025795" wrote:

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025792" wrote:

"Olga;c-1025746" wrote:
Zaul is still meta. Those Rex teams exist as a hard counter to Zaul.

I'm not so sure about the ultimate meta being 1 team; I'm running a team that can beat both Rex and maul led teams. It has it's own weakness, but 1st, no one prevails on Def but drops less than maul, 2nd, every team is probably designed by CG with a counter in mind. I think the 'meta' will be a group of complementary squads that you swap in and out depending on who you face.

Sure, Maul and Rex are both meta.

Are you certain there aren't more squads that can't be added to maul and Rex? Rock, Paper, scissors? So you have your rock and paper, but whose your scissors? Just thinking outoud, and not following the common idea that the ultimate meta is so limited.

The thing is, most Zaul squads can just swap Nihilus and Zaul's places and suddenly they have a Rex counter.

I hear ya. But doesn't switching to a nihilus lead, force you out of the maul lead bonus everyone hates.

Zaul > Rex on defense.

Food for thought.

I currently run Zader(L), Zihilus, Zid, Zarris, Gk. I know, 4 zetas. But this team drops less than my Zaul(L), Sass, zihilus, Palps, gk squad did, and can man handle both Rex leads and maul leads. Maul is clearly not meta anymore, perhaps never was because maybe there isn't one squad to beat them all.

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025806" wrote:

"Zooey;c-1025800" wrote:

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025797" wrote:

"Olga;c-1025795" wrote:

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025792" wrote:

"Olga;c-1025746" wrote:
Zaul is still meta. Those Rex teams exist as a hard counter to Zaul.

I'm not so sure about the ultimate meta being 1 team; I'm running a team that can beat both Rex and maul led teams. It has it's own weakness, but 1st, no one prevails on Def but drops less than maul, 2nd, every team is probably designed by CG with a counter in mind. I think the 'meta' will be a group of complementary squads that you swap in and out depending on who you face.

Sure, Maul and Rex are both meta.

Are you certain there aren't more squads that can't be added to maul and Rex? Rock, Paper, scissors? So you have your rock and paper, but whose your scissors? Just thinking outoud, and not following the common idea that the ultimate meta is so limited.

The thing is, most Zaul squads can just swap Nihilus and Zaul's places and suddenly they have a Rex counter.

I hear ya. But doesn't switching to a nihilus lead, force you out of the maul lead bonus everyone hates.

I guess so. Personally though I think labeling metas by leaders is shortsighted since Chaze and DN are the most impactful drivers of the meta. Every top tier team is going to built around them in some way, and leaders are just one of the ways to amplify their strengths.

"Doitsuyama;c-1025736" wrote:

"M9silent;c-1025424" wrote:
@WompWompRat Thanks for the blessing hahahahahaha. I love my zQGJ Jedi team. Zoda as well. GK, Anakin and Ezra.

It's incredibly fun to use, and I hate dodge. Never used Old Ben or Dooku, won't use Zaul. Love using Jedi. The path of the Jedi is difficult, but rewarding.

No, you don't hate dodge. Foresight is nothing else than 100% dodge, bringing this tactics to a new extreme. Sith dodge is mild compared to Jedi, really.

There is a difference. Foresight is something I can plan for -- I know that the next attack on X is going to miss (or I know that if I kill Y, X will gain foresight). Dodge is random -- I have no way of knowing if I will hit or not.

"JohnnySteelAlpha;c-1025482" wrote:
I will also say about GG - it really is lagging behind the viability of DN as a leader. 3% usage for DN is totally a representation of not having the right toons built yet by the masses to effectively use his lead. You can make comps that zDM teams have a hard time touching even on offense with DN. Vader and Wedge especially, shouldn't be ahead of DN.

Don't forget that swogh.gg is based on everyone registered, which includes plenty of people under level 85. That means that those individuals could be in level bracket where Wiggs is still meta.

"Zooey;c-1025813" wrote:

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025806" wrote:

"Zooey;c-1025800" wrote:

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025797" wrote:

"Olga;c-1025795" wrote:

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1025792" wrote:

"Olga;c-1025746" wrote:
Zaul is still meta. Those Rex teams exist as a hard counter to Zaul.

I'm not so sure about the ultimate meta being 1 team; I'm running a team that can beat both Rex and maul led teams. It has it's own weakness, but 1st, no one prevails on Def but drops less than maul, 2nd, every team is probably designed by CG with a counter in mind. I think the 'meta' will be a group of complementary squads that you swap in and out depending on who you face.

Sure, Maul and Rex are both meta.

Are you certain there aren't more squads that can't be added to maul and Rex? Rock, Paper, scissors? So you have your rock and paper, but whose your scissors? Just thinking outoud, and not following the common idea that the ultimate meta is so limited.

The thing is, most Zaul squads can just swap Nihilus and Zaul's places and suddenly they have a Rex counter.

I hear ya. But doesn't switching to a nihilus lead, force you out of the maul lead bonus everyone hates.

I guess so. Personally though I think labeling metas by leaders is shortsighted since Chaze and DN are the most impactful drivers of the meta. Every top tier team is going to built around them in some way, and leaders are just one of the ways to amplify their strengths.

Agree completely.

"Chewie_says_Aaarww;c-1025789" wrote:

"Smithie;c-1025784" wrote:
Rex Leads are just as weak as Zaul leads on defense vs other Zaul and Rex teams.

Little secret to counter Rex leads...
Drop Palpatine and make your Zaul the quickest on your team and faster than enemy Rex's.

Maul Daze - Nihilus Force Drain
Then throw in DT to increase another cooldown

Wow, so that's why people run DT :) thx for the tip! Maybe I should start working on DT....

Also Maul Dazes DT's basic stuns on Dazed opponents

Plus there is Deathmark too

"AidendeLeon;c-1025467" wrote:
If you've played anything with a changing meta that is even slightly balanced the trend is usually.

1. New Meta content release or update = few variations of best stats/mechanics
2. Response = As choices are formed to capture the top , the meta is solidified to a few prime choices and stragglers
3. "The Meta" = in response to the meta a counter meta is formed using choices which effectively counter the current meta due to being formed specifically around the vulnerability of the meta.
4. The back swing = choices which were previously meta capable or varitations of "the meta" appear to take advantage of these new counter meta choices due to their fragile nature (only good at one thing, countering the meta)
5. Balance before the new meta = as the counter meta is exposed and defeated "the meta" resurfacea and once again you have a mixed board of "the meta" , counter meta, and stragglers
6. Repeat

However, if one specific composition is too good for too long you hear the Nerf cries. Those are the best.

"Smithie;c-1025784" wrote:
Rex Leads are just as weak as Zaul leads on defense vs other Zaul and Rex teams.

Little secret to counter Rex leads...
Drop Palpatine and make your Zaul the quickest on your team and faster than enemy Rex's.

Maul Daze - Nihilus Force Drain
Then throw in DT to increase another cooldown

This is a good tip vs. Rex squads, but it has a drawback vs. other zDM squads in that you're much slower. You also have to do a lot of mod swapping for when it's time to raid. I take the lazy route and just switch to a DN lead and change a few spots on the team to include Savage and Dooku.