New mod sets: defense!

"scuba;c-1634847" wrote:

"Acrofales;c-1633085" wrote:

"scuba;c-1632726" wrote:

"Acrofales;d-180127" wrote:
So there was recently quite an active thread on what the changes mean for offensive mods. I have a question about defensive mods!

The defense set gets quite a massive boost, from +5% to +25%. That means that there should now be quite a lot of tanks that benefit from running 3 defense sets (although I haven't done the math). From gg we see the top 10 toons ranked by armor:

CT-5555 "Fives" 717
Finn 602
First Order Stormtrooper 594
Sun Fac 592
Obi-Wan Kenobi (Old Ben) 569
Scarif Rebel Pathfinder 550
Paploo 547
Vandor Chewbacca 544
L3-37 538
K-2SO 533

Of these, Finn and 5s are debateable whether you want to run them with a purely defensive set, but the others are just big damage sponges, whose only consideration is how long you can make them survive (and of course, speed, because that is always relevant). Of these, Sun Fac might still benefit more from health, because of his health steal mechanics, but the rest all seem like prime targets for running with the new defense sets.

Now for my questions:
1. How do we calculate the tradeoff between health and defense sets. My first stab at it would be:
Let d be average incoming damage, a be (base) armor, h be max (base) health, and p be max prot, mh be the health modifier from mods, and ma be the defense modifier from mods, and finally fmh be the flat health modifier from unfinished gear levels, and fma be the flat defense modifier from gear and mods, then:
#hits til death = (h*mh + fmh + p)/(d/(1 - a*ma - fma))
or, in other words:
#hits til death = (h*mh + fmh + p)*(1 - a*ma - fma)/d
However, this ignores health steal, prot regen and other such effects, as well as using average damage rather than the real variability: for big damage abilities, armor does next to nothing, whereas for low damage abilities, armor can soak up a lot, relatively speaking. Moreover, it ignores the complicated diminishing return rule for defense, which, according to https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/67830/defense-armor-calculator is:
Damage Reduction % = Modded Defense / (Modded Defense + (level * 7.5))

2. For toons like SiT, who gets 100% bonus defense, are unique modifiers calculated after, or simultaneously with mods? In other words, would SiT get a boost of 175% or 250% over base armor from using defense sets?

Uniques, leads, buffs are after mods (happens in battle) and they don't normally compound.
So SiT with defense up in battle would get 150% defense not (defense x 2) x 1.5.

The calculator in the thread you linked to can also figure it out just plug modded armor/resistance from stats in and then use 100% as a mod, update the level to 85 ignore all others and that should give you the damage mitigation for for SiT while in battle without defense up.

You say they don't compound, but everybody else seems to think they do. I also headed over to gg to poke around in the mechanics.

SiT: Modify stat Armor by 100% (multiplicative)
Sion: Modify stat Armor by 100% (multiplicative)
Bossk lead: Modify stat Armor by 100% (multiplicative)

So these, at least are multiplicative. Presumably that means multiplicative with mods, so it will compound, meaning defense mods are just that much better for these toons.

I started making a list, but lets face it, almost all the taunting tanks are in there now. Notable exceptions are GK, who has fairly low base armor (but he has high resistance, so it might be worth it anyway), Kanan (would have to calculate, armor and resistance are low, and health is very high), Shoretrooper (because of healing), Nightsister Zombie (due to NS mechanics) and KRU (because you want him to crit) and Poe (because why the hell is he a taunting tank?!). Some of the tanks might also be better with speed sets, and some with potency, but it'll depend on your purpose and the team you put them in.

What I mean by they don't compound is the unique +100% defense won't compound with defense up.
SiT with defense up
will get
(modded_defense) + (modded_defense x 1) + (modded_defense x 0.5)
Or modded_defense x 2.5
Or +150% defense

not
(modded_defense) + (modded_defense x 1) + ((modded_defense) + (modded_defense x 1)) x 0.5
Or modded_defense x 3
Or +200% defense.

So yes the Uniques and buffs compound with mods but not usually with each other.

This is how I have seen it with stats that are easy to test in the past like health, although I haven't tested in a while.

This is how I suspect all multiplicative and also stacking bonus work. It adds the bonuses together first, then multiplies. For example, offense up plus 40% offense from a unique would be offense*1.9, not offense*1.5*1.4.

I haven't tested, but this is based off the conversation on EA Answers that Traya's -50% damage and Han's second shot -50% damage is actually -100% damage, instead of -75% like people would have thought.