Please do something about these GG nuke squads

"Nikoms565;c-1972514" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972504" wrote:

"CCyrilS;c-1972497" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972496" wrote:

"CCyrilS;c-1972493" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972488" wrote:

"Nikoms565;c-1972486" wrote:
I'm going to type really slow so the OP understands :

Teams that "belong" in the top 10 (or top 20...or whatever arbitrary dividing line you've made up in your mind) are the ones that either through their own synergy or the weaknesses of the teams they are defeating, can beat the teams in front of them. The GG "nuke" squad happens to do both very efficiently.

Good day, sir.

By your logic, if a new mechanic were discovered that allowed G4 Jawas to climb in arena, that would be totally OK and not in need of attention from the devs. Cool story, bro.

No, it only highlights the fact that what one person considers "good enough" to belong in arena, another might not.

Your opinion is just that.

I fully understand that crappy players who can’t be bothered to farm good mods or spend a dime to acquire anything in the game believe they should be entitled to climb to the top of arena without putting forth any effort. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. That does not mean everyone’s opinion is of equal value. The competitive balance of the game is harmed when these teams are able to climb. The devs have even mentioned this before when talking about how long they let metas go. And part of the problem is definitely that the last two Revan metas have been around for way too long. We desperately need a new meta.

Oh, I see the problem now. You think your opinion matters more.

I know we live during a moment in time when people think their uneducated, logically fallacious arguments are important and valuable, but that’s not actually the case.

That is precisely what several people are trying to tell you - and yet you insist on continuing to trot out your opinion that nothing that's as geared or modded as your team should be able to beat it and has no place in the top 10-15.

DR/Malak teams have a weakness - ferocity is a double edged sword. GG teams use it against them. Padme teams do as well. Sorry if you find hard counters confusing.

Ferocity doesn’t really even come into play that much, as was explained earlier in the convo. Not surprised you missed it since you seem to read like one of every five words posted.

"DarkHelmet1138;c-1972530" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972284" wrote:

"DarkHelmet1138;c-1972266" wrote:

"TVF;c-1972264" wrote:

"Cardiff0;c-1972247" wrote:
Tbh most of these comments are super unrelated to OPs point and unhelpful and that’s why he is having to say the same thing over and over.

People disagreeing that anything needs to be done /= unrelated comments

Either that or it's trolling. Because the op posts a "wah, I don't like this team post," we should all just echo it and demand a nerf.

The comments are unrelated because a bunch of you are using a straw man. My original point (which has been repeated many times now) was that people shouldn’t be able to climb with crappy mods and mostly G11 toons on their squad. Seriously, go back and read the first line of the original post. I would have no problem with this team if it required G12/13 on all the toons and maybe at least one competitive speed set. My problem is not that I can’t beat this team (I can) or that I fall out of the Top 20 now (I don’t) or whatever other made up nonsense you want to ascribe to me. My words have been very clear that my issue with this team is that it allows people to climb to top ranks with purple gear on three toons and without mods that would normally be required to be competitive.

so basically "wah I don't like this team"

Yes, straw man fallacy.

"SoonerJBD;c-1972362" wrote:

"TVF;c-1972337" wrote:
Ok. Still waiting.

If it was such nonsense that GG can take 1, why are so few people running it? And therefore, why does it even matter? If you aren't falling outside the top 20, who cares? How does it affect you in the slightest?

It affects me because I am one of the people who has put in the investment to routinely finish at the top. Those people who built their rosters, geared their toons and farmed competitive mods find that investment de-valued when someone with 2 or 3 million less GP can gear two toons, put on crap mods and climb to the top.

I don’t know how many of these squads you are seeing. Frankly, if I see one squad with three G11 toons in the Top 5, that’s too many. As it is, I’m seeing several each day and as many as a dozen or more reaching Top 15-20. I find it insulting to see those squads next to SE and Padme squads that are full g13 with relic investments on each toon.

If you take first everyday, you get the same rewards regardless of what others run. If you don't fall out of the top 20, you can climb to 1st with no refreshes. So if what you sayis true, it has no effect on your return on investment.

"SoonerJBD;c-1972477" wrote:

"Nikoms565;c-1972446" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972435" wrote:

"Nikoms565;c-1972424" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972399" wrote:
Honestly, you are only still arguing because you don’t want to admit you are wrong. There is no legitimate case to make that we should be seeing squads with three G11 toons in the Top 10 of arena.

Three quick points :
1) Rock, paper, scissors. Sorry your shiny scissors cost more than the GG-R7 rock.

2) Just because you're the only one still talking doesn't mean everyone (ir anyone, for that matter) agrees with you. It could just indicate that people are tired of arguing with you because you're convinced you're right.

3) Metas change. Money/investment gives you a short term advantage. That time is up.

1) I have the rock and paper too, and they are also better geared and modded.

2) I never said anyone agreed with me. But I will point out that I’ve still not seen anyone actually argue against my original point, which I’ve had to repeat ad nauseam because people like you keep trying to replace it with straw men like “scissors mad that it gets beat by rock.” Squads with three G11 toons don’t belong at the top of arena. Still waiting for someone to argue it is good or healthy for the game or whatever. People have argued diversity is good (I agree, but that’s not my point), that the GG team doesn’t work with G11 (false, only GG and T3 need G12 or 13) and a variety of other things that are entirely beside the point of my original post.

3) It gives you an advantage for the long term, not just the short term. I can move my mods to whatever the new meta happens to be. And I’m more prepared to acquire the new meta first time around because I gear my toons. Which is why you generally see the same people in the top 10 month after month.

Point 1 - the fact that you have them is irrelevant. Nothing holds on defense. Never has. That's by design.

People have argued point 2 - you just seem to think you get to decide what teams (and at what gear/mod levels) "belong" at the top of arena. Malak was at the top when he was 5 stars and indergeared too....but you probably had him, so weren't complaining. Sorry, you're not the sole arbiter of who "belongs" at the top of arena or for how long. Incidentally, look at the top of your fleet shard. I'm guessing you'll see many 5 star Negotiators - possibly with under-starred Ani along side.

On point 3, you are simply mistaken. I've been playing since launch. Money has always only bought a temporary advantage. I'm not sure when you started playing, but you joined the forums 2 years after me, so the fact that you're newer explains why you don't fully understand that yet.

I’ve been playing since a little after launch. I didn’t join the forums until later.

Oh, I also wanted to revisit this little gem you tossed out...and include your first post from February of 2018...

"SoonerJBD;d-159426" wrote:
This may not be as big an issue on more mature shards, but I’m in a November shard where most are in the low 80s approaching 85 and just now getting zetas. Since no one in that recent a shard has JTR or CLS...

The game launched in November of 2015. 2 years later (November of 2017 - when you started) is not "a little after launch."

A suggestion if you want to have intelligent conversations with adults. Don't lie.

I'm done. I don't have discussions with people who are dishonest.

"DarthSleeper;c-1972533" wrote:
Hey guys, I’m running a GG nuke team in arena, here are my team members :

R6 zzGG 212 speed, 202.5% cd, 83.61%cc, 134.7k hp
G12 zzT3M4 238 speed, 29k hp, 59k prot , I put mk12 stun gun on it.
G12 IG88 240 speed, 81.3% poten , 73.2%cc
G12 zzR2 253 speed, 34.7k hp, 48k prot
G12 BB8 264 speed

Before the Relic system come out, I always been the top one at my PO. But currently, the situation has changed. Because of Malak’s taunt, I can’t kill G13+BSF in the first round. Then a R5-7 DR can easily destory my t3 and r2 by a force storm. In the final versus, my r6 GG can hardly beat any G13+ Malak.

In fact, GG nuke team only works good against a non-R7 DR team, any other teams defeat nuke team easily.

If you have G12 zzTraya and DN, you can crush the top nuke team as an egg.

This is evidence of not having the right mods (at least partly). T3 needs to have around 130k combined H+P to live to the end of the match vs. reliced teams. T3 should go last before GG and have as little cc as possible if you don't use IPD to avoid triggering Malak taunt. That's harder with R2 in comp because he gives out more cc. R2 can be better than IPD but really only with extremely good mods.

Your 88 has potency too low though R2 might give him a fair amount. Still not enough to hit minimum resist. What about potency and cc on R2? I would also have stacked health on R2 to boost the amount he is giving to GG.

So modding is an extremely important part of this comp and this is evidence of why. Didn't have amazing mods so can't beat reliced teams.

"SoonerJBD;c-1972536" wrote:

"DarkHelmet1138;c-1972530" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972284" wrote:

"DarkHelmet1138;c-1972266" wrote:

"TVF;c-1972264" wrote:

"Cardiff0;c-1972247" wrote:
Tbh most of these comments are super unrelated to OPs point and unhelpful and that’s why he is having to say the same thing over and over.

People disagreeing that anything needs to be done /= unrelated comments

Either that or it's trolling. Because the op posts a "wah, I don't like this team post," we should all just echo it and demand a nerf.

The comments are unrelated because a bunch of you are using a straw man. My original point (which has been repeated many times now) was that people shouldn’t be able to climb with crappy mods and mostly G11 toons on their squad. Seriously, go back and read the first line of the original post. I would have no problem with this team if it required G12/13 on all the toons and maybe at least one competitive speed set. My problem is not that I can’t beat this team (I can) or that I fall out of the Top 20 now (I don’t) or whatever other made up nonsense you want to ascribe to me. My words have been very clear that my issue with this team is that it allows people to climb to top ranks with purple gear on three toons and without mods that would normally be required to be competitive.

so basically "wah I don't like this team"

Yes, straw man fallacy.

No just a summary of your arguements. You claim it doesn't affect you but just don't like it because it doesn't use all same faction team members and it works with a few toons not at max gear.

You got your time at the top with no counters. Malak reigned supreme for several months now. Relics introduced counters. Life moves on. It's only a matter of time before a new meta drops and it'll be hard to beat (it'll probably also work at lower gear vs the older teams). Then you can whale out and feel good about yourself again.

This thread rules.

"Nikoms565;c-1972539" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972477" wrote:

"Nikoms565;c-1972446" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972435" wrote:

"Nikoms565;c-1972424" wrote:

"SoonerJBD;c-1972399" wrote:
Honestly, you are only still arguing because you don’t want to admit you are wrong. There is no legitimate case to make that we should be seeing squads with three G11 toons in the Top 10 of arena.

Three quick points :
1) Rock, paper, scissors. Sorry your shiny scissors cost more than the GG-R7 rock.

2) Just because you're the only one still talking doesn't mean everyone (ir anyone, for that matter) agrees with you. It could just indicate that people are tired of arguing with you because you're convinced you're right.

3) Metas change. Money/investment gives you a short term advantage. That time is up.

1) I have the rock and paper too, and they are also better geared and modded.

2) I never said anyone agreed with me. But I will point out that I’ve still not seen anyone actually argue against my original point, which I’ve had to repeat ad nauseam because people like you keep trying to replace it with straw men like “scissors mad that it gets beat by rock.” Squads with three G11 toons don’t belong at the top of arena. Still waiting for someone to argue it is good or healthy for the game or whatever. People have argued diversity is good (I agree, but that’s not my point), that the GG team doesn’t work with G11 (false, only GG and T3 need G12 or 13) and a variety of other things that are entirely beside the point of my original post.

3) It gives you an advantage for the long term, not just the short term. I can move my mods to whatever the new meta happens to be. And I’m more prepared to acquire the new meta first time around because I gear my toons. Which is why you generally see the same people in the top 10 month after month.

Point 1 - the fact that you have them is irrelevant. Nothing holds on defense. Never has. That's by design.

People have argued point 2 - you just seem to think you get to decide what teams (and at what gear/mod levels) "belong" at the top of arena. Malak was at the top when he was 5 stars and indergeared too....but you probably had him, so weren't complaining. Sorry, you're not the sole arbiter of who "belongs" at the top of arena or for how long. Incidentally, look at the top of your fleet shard. I'm guessing you'll see many 5 star Negotiators - possibly with under-starred Ani along side.

On point 3, you are simply mistaken. I've been playing since launch. Money has always only bought a temporary advantage. I'm not sure when you started playing, but you joined the forums 2 years after me, so the fact that you're newer explains why you don't fully understand that yet.

I’ve been playing since a little after launch. I didn’t join the forums until later.

Oh, I also wanted to revisit this little gem you tossed out...and include your first post from February of 2018...

"SoonerJBD;d-159426" wrote:
This may not be as big an issue on more mature shards, but I’m in a November shard where most are in the low 80s approaching 85 and just now getting zetas. Since no one in that recent a shard has JTR or CLS...

The game launched in November of 2015. 2 years later (November of 2017 - when you started) is not "a little after launch."

A suggestion if you want to have intelligent conversations with adults. Don't lie.

I'm done. I don't have discussions with people who are dishonest.

To be fair "a little after launch" is his opinion, and if you recall from earlier, that's all that matters.

My god you guys hunt in packs.

Firstly my nuke team took about 15 minutes to mod. I didn’t even have to change GG’s mods I just built around it so I can use sep droids too. I have an average/not that good mod collection.

Also how is this a hard counter to Drevan? What does Drevan do that this counters in particular? Ferocity makes almost no difference. It’s just a strong team that beats darth revan, and other comps as far I can see.

And sorry but this team is clearly unintentional. It just came up as a result of a whole game of character kits being basically uncontrollable. I just think you guys are the ones protecting your investment, if anyone. You don’t want anyone nerfing your droid team. And don’t worry it will never happen so calm down.

You also want counters, which is very true there should be counters, but I don’t think there’s really meant to be counters apart from padme. They don’t care about game balance. For almost two years now the meta has been like 90% dominated by one team. They made that team OP and super dominant so whales would buy it. The clone squad and this GG team rely on one character with huge damage getting ticked off. Can’t you see the game is not in balance as a result of DR and relics? These are not healthy, direct counters to a team, the game is in a mess and relics only exacerbated that with insane damage, all types of battles are lasting like a minute with very little strategy. These are not good, healthy game mechanics like the rest of the game has. The game at the top level has become uncontrollable.

the gg nuke team reminds me of the zfinn team that was popular during the jkr meta.
I call it an unintended cheese team that may not be healthy for the game