This may not be as big an issue on more mature shards, but I’m in a November shard where most are in the low 80s approaching 85 and just now getting zetas. Since no one in that recent a shard has JTR or even CLS, Empire teams are now ubiquitous in the top 20 of the arena. They destroy NS, and there is no real counter to them available once Palp gets his leader ability zeta. The problem is, this has made arena stale because whoever has the fastest Vader always wins. Go first, Force Crush, Cull, allies get 100 percent turn meter, game over.This feeds into a larger issue that I’m sure has been discussed as nauseum, but speed is seemingly the only stat that matters in arena, particularly with all the turn meter manipulation abilities. This game is in desperate need of some counter mechanics to speed. Passive abilities that punish toons who take frequent turns, abilities that boost evasion or other important stats scaling with opponent speed. Something. As it stands, it appears my shard will be “fastest Vader wins” for a few months. It’s a problem with the mature meta as well. This game desperately needs different ways to win to keep things from getting so stale.

Same story different characters.

"SoonerJBD;d-159426" wrote:This may not be as big an issue on more mature shards, but I’m in a November shard where most are in the low 80s approaching 85 and just now getting zetas. Since no one in that recent a shard has JTR or even CLS, Empire teams are now ubiquitous in the top 20 of the arena. They destroy NS, and there is no real counter to them available once Palp gets his leader ability zeta. The problem is, this has made arena stale because whoever has the fastest Vader always wins. Go first, Force Crush, Cull, allies get 100 percent turn meter, game over.This feeds into a larger issue that I’m sure has been discussed as nauseum, but speed is seemingly the only stat that matters in arena, particularly with all the turn meter manipulation abilities. This game is in desperate need of some counter mechanics to speed. Passive abilities that punish toons who take frequent turns, abilities that boost evasion or other important stats scaling with opponent speed. Something. As it stands, it appears my shard will be “fastest Vader wins” for a few months. It’s a problem with the mature meta as well. This game desperately needs different ways to win to keep things from getting so stale.Use rex lead mate.

"SoonerJBD;d-159426" wrote:The problem is, this has made arena stale because whoever has the fastest Vader always wins. Go first, Force Crush, Cull, allies get 100 percent turn meter, game over.You can still win if the other Vader goes first. I did yesterday, a few times. Yay for bad AI!This feeds into a larger issue that I’m sure has been discussed as nauseum, but speed is seemingly the only stat that matters in arena. Yes, speed is the most important, but speed alone does not win. I mean, TFP was supposed to be the chosen one, but he is mostly a nomad in search of a real home.Passive abilities that punish toons who take frequent turns ...Wouldn't that be something? Take massive damage just for taking a turn. Something like an undispellable Thermal Detonator stack, applied similar to Nihilus' Health Down debuff. Oh, you want to take a turn? Here's an automatic time bomb. If any stack reaches 3, all stacks on all enemy characters explode for double damage, ignoring protection. Slowest team wins. The only winning move is not to play.

Hahaha I can't wait for the upcoming Slow Meta.

Turn meter manipulation actually IS the counter mechanic to speed. Punishing characters that take frequent turns is something already present on the team you are running. Boosting evasion also exists - zMaul was meta for a while and many of us were miserable because evasion is awful.

Speed problem | EA Forums

29 Replies

emvedebe
8 years ago
rex and raid han have been making inferior teams win on offence for quite a while.
MetaSly
8 years ago
"leef;c-1468147" wrote:
rex and raid han have been making inferior teams win on offence for quite a while.

Rex with powerfull chars can counter Palp-Vader : each crits from Force Crush will give 15% TM to Rex so he'll have 100% TMat the same time as Vader if he's fast enough and with Tenacity Up the Sith and Epmpire are a lot less threatening
SWGOH_Anakin_S
8 years ago
Maybe thrawn lead can make up for speed. Palp lead against slower opponent, Thrawn lead against faster opponent.
Thrawn works perfectly fine at 5* G11

"SoonerJBD;d-159426" wrote:
This game is in desperate need of some counter mechanics to speed. Passive abilities that punish toons who take frequent turns, abilities that boost evasion or other important stats scaling with opponent speed. Something. As it stands, it appears my shard will be “fastest Vader wins” for a few months. It’s a problem with the mature meta as well. This game desperately needs different ways to win to keep things from getting so stale.

"Passive abilities thay punish toons who take frequent turns." Guess what, you have it: Palpatine. Zader also qualifies for that.
emvedebe
8 years ago
"Mobewan;c-1466564" wrote:

There is no counter to speed.
If you have two turn manipulation teams, the faster tram wins.
If you have two evasion trams, the faster team wins.

Man, if only that were true i'd hold rank so much better. I was getting beat eventhough i was faster so gosh darn often. Currently i'm not even fast in comparisson, but i'm doing better than before.
Rex cheese woohoo
mobewan0527
8 years ago
@leef
I am talking about the same team composition. Of course a similar team that is slightly slower can beat you if they play smart, but not if they have +0 extra speed from mods.

If you run rex, try running fast rex.
You'll see what i mean.
Winning will become much easier and beating you will become much harder.

The real problem is that teams like jtr, ns, and now empure can beat the snot out of rex and cls teams with really bad mods....oh well.
But of those new meta teams get faster (+120 or +130 speed) they will become nearly unbeatable.
emvedebe
8 years ago
"Mobewan;c-1468673" wrote:
leef
I am talking about the same team composition. Of course a similar team that is slightly slower can beat you if they play smart, but not if they have +0 extra speed from mods.

If you run rex, try running fast rex.
You'll see what i mean.
Winning will become much easier and beating you will become much harder.

The real problem is that teams like jtr, ns, and now empure can beat the snot out of rex and cls teams with really bad mods....oh well.
But of those new meta teams get faster (+120 or +130 speed) they will become nearly unbeatable.

@Mobewan
Point is you can counter speed, wich doesn't mean that more speed isn't almost always beneficial. You can also counter crit dmg, but more crit dmg is still beter than less.
There are plenty of teams that don't need to be fast to win. Some teams do significantly worse when facing a mirror team with more speed, some teams only do slightly worse. AI is horrble though, so in most mirror matches the human controlled team wins, especially if it's a team that only does slightly better with more speed.
Rex cheese beats those +120/+130 teams btw. The only character with more than +100 on my team is rex (+110) and i'm doing fine, on offence aswell as on defence. Ofcourse the team will be even better with more speed, but i really dislike modswitching.
mobewan0527
8 years ago
@leef

Yes, any team will be even better with more speed.

Yes, some types of teams can beat other types of teams (even if they are faster) if their skills give them turn meter advantage.

We are in conplete agreement
BTTripleZero
8 years ago
Vet Chewy is actually an awesome example of a counter to speed. The slower he is the more powerful he is.

Unfortunately he has no synergy with top characters and alone (or with Han) just isn’t good enough to make an impact.
BMDean
8 years ago
"leef;c-1469162" wrote:
"Mobewan;c-1468673" wrote:
leef
I am talking about the same team composition. Of course a similar team that is slightly slower can beat you if they play smart, but not if they have +0 extra speed from mods.

If you run rex, try running fast rex.
You'll see what i mean.
Winning will become much easier and beating you will become much harder.

The real problem is that teams like jtr, ns, and now empure can beat the snot out of rex and cls teams with really bad mods....oh well.
But of those new meta teams get faster (+120 or +130 speed) they will become nearly unbeatable.

@Mobewan
Point is you can counter speed, wich doesn't mean that more speed isn't almost always beneficial. You can also counter crit dmg, but more crit dmg is still beter than less.
There are plenty of teams that don't need to be fast to win. Some teams do significantly worse when facing a mirror team with more speed, some teams only do slightly worse. AI is horrble though, so in most mirror matches the human controlled team wins, especially if it's a team that only does slightly better with more speed.
Rex cheese beats those +120/+130 teams btw. The only character with more than +100 on my team is rex (+110) and i'm doing fine, on offence aswell as on defence. Ofcourse the team will be even better with more speed, but i really dislike modswitching.

There isn’t an arms race for mods with higher crit damage. A mod isn’t worthless in arena because it doesn’t have crit damage on it. Speed is far and away the stat that defines virtually every arena match.

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Speed problem

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