Yoda gains bonus turn meter despite HK's zeta

I just fought a Yoda under Bastilla lead in GA with Drevan (L), Badstilla and HK and he still gained bonus turn meter from his special while having bonus prot from Bastilla Lead. It's definitely not WAI.

@Woodroward your comments don't bring anything in regard to the topic. Please move on or contribute positively.

"dominiQC;c-1820873" wrote:
I just fought a Yoda under Bastilla lead in GA with Drevan (L), Badstilla and HK and he still gained bonus turn meter from his special while having bonus prot from Bastilla Lead. It's definitely not WAI.

@Woodroward your comments don't bring anything in regard to the topic. Please move on or contribute positively.

I did contribute positively. I explained how their vernacular is consistently interpreted and explained that our perspective is not going to get them to rewrite their preferred vernacular because everyone else has already learned how theirs works. Changing it now to appease you would confuse myriads of other people. (although worded differently)

Consistency is key here. Learn their consistencies and you'll be fine.

I did contribute positively to this conversation. You liking what I had to say is not the determiner of that.

"dominiQC;c-1821683" wrote:


If you gain bonus TM at the start you would then be performing actions in between turns with a bar between 35 to 75% full, which makes no sense. Hence pointing out the "and then". Sorry you didn't understood on the first pass. Now you've been helped.

Also, your vision of the world is not necessarily the same as it appears to everyone, so you shouldn't be talking on other people behalf. If you think switching the TM sentence at the beginning would confuse anyone you are vastly underestimating every other player's intelligence which probably explain the arrogance in your comments. It's not only what you write that I don't like. I don't have any lessons to receive from someone like you.

You choosing not to learn how to interpret their wording is your own choice. That doesn't make what they are saying unclear. Nor is what I have pointed out to you "my view" it is THE understanding of these types of games that is consistent across basically every one of them. Go take a tour on the Magic the gathering website and talk about rules there for a bit. You should see that wording needs to be precise and consistent in and of itself rather than by outside sources' preferred vernacular (yours or mine).

Whether or not people would understand it at the start of the description or the end has no bearing on what I am saying. What I'm saying is that claiming that it being at the end of the sentence should make it last makes it sound like that's what the phrasing should mean, and if it did, it would confuse myriads of people who are well aware of THE understanding of vernacular that this game uses.

If he gains tm at the start of the ability it doesn't matter because every character is at 0 tm as soon as their action starts. They used it all up when they picked the action.

Now, please refrain from more quasi insulting posts that are detracting from the thread.

It's written in English and in English, that would mean it happens afterwards.
It's a multinational game, so more effort should be put into the wording and translations.

"Woodroward;c-1820112" wrote:

"dominiQC;c-1820109" wrote:
@slickdealer @crzydroid

His Battle Meditation ability description clearly states otherwise though.

No it doesn't. The only actions that are sequenced in that description is that he spreads buffs after he gives some to himself. The tm gain is a different sentence and there's no "and then" portion of that so by the description could take place before or after or at the same time as the protection up.

You are correct, but this absolutely needs to change. We are long past the time when kits are so complicated that order of operations is extremely important, and it’s essential that we know what comes first. Requiring testing to understand the order events trigger is poor game design when characters takes weeks/months to gear up.

I don't believe the game functions quite like "Magic the Gathering." We have seen several instances where the Order of Operations is very significant.

For example, when the Devs pushed a patch out and switched up the order of operations between Sion taunt and Traya debuff cleansing, and all of a sudden Traya mirror matches started to deal with taunting Sion, whereas before he wouldn't taunt - that was hugely significant, and was completely caused by a small order of operations change.

I don't think everything in a skill happens simultaneously - I think they all queue up and resolve individually, and the order is significant. Hopefully we will get clarity from the Devs on this scenario.

"dominiQC;c-1820652" wrote:
It would be normal to think you gain TM after performing actions from your turn, jot before. Then the action sequence in the description is clear, TM happens at the end. If they designed to happen first, then it should be written first in the description.

It wouldn't make sence to describe my day saying: I had dinner with my wife. I woke early. Unless they wanted to give a yoda RP touch to his ability.

This ^. Yoda is currently taking a turn to use his Battle Meditation. That means that his TM is full. It doesn’t makes sense to apply the TM gain first, before he uses his turn to cast the buffs because his TM is already full.

So he’s taking his turn, he casts Battle Meditation and spreads buffs, his TM is depleted from that action, then the rest of the ability kicks in to give/refill 35% of the TM he used to cast Battle Meditation

"Woodroward;c-1824595" wrote:
No, HK's zeta was created as a hard counter to 3p0.

Yep, I’m regularly struggling against 3PO teams giving massive amounts of turn meter to his galactic republic allies.

"Woodroward;c-1823666" wrote:

"Skiddlydiddly;c-1823560" wrote:
It's written in English and in English, that would mean it happens afterwards.
It's a multinational game, so more effort should be put into the wording and translations.

Learning how they word things is the way to go, not trying to push your meanings on them. And their parlance is also common and accurate in common English. It's your personal vernacular that has it means something other than what it does, not common English.

While I appreciate your insight on the mechanics, your interpretation that this is standard English is dubious.

Generally when events are described, it's the case that they take place in chronological order and each sentence precedes the next.

I went out with my friends. We had dinner. I came home.

The dog bit me. I went to the hospital.

It's by no means the norm that things occur simultaneously unless explicitly stated otherwise.

Issue is that some abilities are worded a similar way yet have a different order of priority.

As others have mentioned the increased complexity of abilities really does require them to start wording them in such a way that the order of priority is clear. This would remove all ambiguity and clearly inform players how abilities function.

Coincidently it might also help game devs as there has been a number of bugs recently confirmed where the order of priority and the ability description don’t match.