So we all know of ways of killing sims (locking them in a room and deleting the door, etc). But actually doing it by the actions of another sim without going into buy/build mode is not easy. I decided to try using the door lock feature added in UL, and it worked... sort of.You see, I created a household of two of my CAS sims (Paul Bateman and Karla Horton, both with the Evil trait) and built them a house with some rooms in the basement. Then I got the university mascot to go into one of those rooms, and locked the door... but the mascot eventually teleported out.Second attempt: I added another sim to my household (another CAS sim, named Phoebe Lay). Again, I put Phoebe in one of the basement rooms and locked the door; eventually she starved to death (not before saying her own name a few times LOL). But Paul and Karla spent the next couple of days spontaneously bursting into tears (even though they had positive moodlets from "seeing sim suffer" that was outweighed by the "witnessing death" moodlet).I tried using the roommate feature instead (thinking that maybe there's less of an emotional bond between roommates than between full-on household members). And they starved, but again Paul and Karla are spontaneously crying over mere acquaintances, despite being evil. It's almost as if they feel guilty - or like EA wants to make you feel guilty for doing that.

EA: "Killing sims is bad...really bad..." Me: "Hasn't stopped me before." - there's mods for that.

Killing Sims is a personal choice. Some players enjoy killing their Sims, while others such as myself, could never cause them any harm let alone their demise; whether created by me or not. Personally, I don't think EA cares one way or another about how Simmers treat or mistreat their Sims. If you take a really close look at the content of this game you will see EA/Maxis is not innocent when it comes to 'not harming Sims'. If you have Late Night installed, well you have the makings for actual autonomous Sim to Sim murder. It's not even hidden.

You can, in Sims 4, unfortunately, this is Sims 3, and there is no pufferfish...though that would be rather amusing... It's too bad deathfish didn't have the same result if eaten raw for sims. What a missed opportunity.

"mw1525;c-17766122" wrote:If you have Late Night installed, well you have the makings for actual autonomous Sim to Sim murder. It's not even hidden.Whoa... autonomous sim on sim murder? As in, they'll kill each other without direction from the player?? What am I missing here?Although I'm not big on killing sims - honest! Heck, I'm usually in a hurry to get some Life Fruit growing so I can keep them from dying of old age. I'm very curious about this, though. So, just Late Night, with no mods?

Unaided Autonomous Murder Capabilities. Yes, the Sims can do it.Like most things which would raise the ratings in this game, EA/Maxis cannot come straight out and say this feature (if you want to call it that) is in their (Teen) Life Simulation game. However, they left a trail of breadcrumbs to be followed.The ability to kill came somewhere inside of the Late Night expansion pack coding. However, the ability to develop the desire and want to kill can be found in the pure base game in the form of jealousy. The jealousy algorithm has been a hard thing for EA/Maxis to control, so they began building moodlets (small programming) to try to slow it down or deter it. Somewhere, between the base game and the release of World Adventure they saw Sim jealousy was a problem. In update v1.5/1.6 in the section of gameplay changes, they included "Autonomous interactions based on Sim's jealousy have been balanced." This may have been making reference to the two new moodlets included in the expansion 'No Jealousy' and 'Stone Heart'. These are odd new lifetime rewards to add to a travel expansion pack, don't you think? But, the new coding wasn't enough to alter Sim 'thinking'. When Late Night came out with it's Lifetime Reward 'Master of Seduction' and the ability for Sims to kill, things became worst. I do believe the Lifetime Reward 'Clean Slate' and 'Above Reproach' which came with the Generations expansion were added to help with the Late Night Sim reaction. However, in my opinion, the 'Clean Slate' approach is too extreme as it wipes out the entire relationship (but only in the journal and moodlet programming), it has no bearing on a Sim's actual memory. This is where the issue of murder lies.To be honest, I don't think EA/Maxis intended for the average Sim to have access to this ability (line of thinking). They did however intend for Sims to 'do away' with each other. Proof of this is present in the game (newspaper), in the surrounding and back story of Bridgeport and old producer walk-through notes concerning vampire coding and intent. There is a method to autonomous Sim murder. They won't randomly kill, nor will they kill for object gain (money, house, car or job position). They won't even attempt it without a plausible motive. The Sim they want to remove will have some importance in/to their life, they will also be considered an obstacle to a path, goal or ability to move forward. An obstacle which cannot be removed by any other means. The desire and drive to commit this crime will only occur as the last logical conclusion (solution). You won't see a Sim commit the crime, I don't think they have the animations for it. You will only see the result, the notification of the dead Sim. And, (possibly) the lack of the body or ghost if they didn't kill them with a recognizable death such as fire (the EA/Maxis approved method).To date, I have only had two cases of autonomous murder in my game (both by townies) with a third case possibly developing from a Sim I created. The first murder I thought was an accidental death as fire and newspaper notification were used. The second murder was not accidental, it was premeditated and neither I nor Nrass can locate the deceased Sim's body (urn). I am trying to prevent the third from taking place while at the same time learn as much as I can. From what I can tell, traits have no bearings on a Sim's desire to remove another from their life. A while ago, I was going to create a thread about this very subject. I changed my mind because there doesn't seem to be a lot of Simmers here who seem interested in AI developments (which this is).To answer your question, no you do not need to have mods installed, you don't even need to have Late Night installed. The coding is inside of the Late Night patch for the game, any patch level past Late Night, you have it. You only need Late Night installed if you want to see more cases of it or, control the killings with a mod.

EA really doesn't want sim to kill sim

24 Replies

nitroglycol4104
5 years ago
"Turjan;c-17787559" wrote:
"xxcrazyskittlesxx;c-17787513" wrote:
I have never seen a sim kill another sim without the help of mods.

Even without mods, there's at least the possibility that a witch can kill a vampire with the combination of a curse and a spell. Probably an oversight. The "kill it with fire" is a bit trickier to pull off without any exploits.

Or, as I mentioned above, using the locking doors from UL so that you can lock them in a room to starve. But this stuff about the AI sounds fascinating. And odd as well as interesting if it turns out that sims are more likely to kill each other autonomously than when under player control.

That poisoned apple thing sounds weird too. I suppose you could always just have sold the apple in the consignment store instead of using it for its "intended" purpose...
UlanDhor
Seasoned Ace
5 years ago
"Nitroglycol;c-17787570" wrote:
Or, as I mentioned above, using the locking doors from UL so that you can lock them in a room to starve.

That never worked for me. Trapped sims get always reset by the game for me before they starve. Sometimes it's only the hunger need that is reset. Maybe, if you watch them the whole time?
nitroglycol4104
5 years ago
"Turjan;c-17787590" wrote:
"Nitroglycol;c-17787570" wrote:
Or, as I mentioned above, using the locking doors from UL so that you can lock them in a room to starve.

That never worked for me. Trapped sims get always reset by the game for me before they starve. Sometimes it's only the hunger need that is reset. Maybe, if you watch them the whole time?

Doesn't always work for me either. I've only gotten it to work when they're at least at the roommate level, not simple visitors. Which does suggest that EA wants killing other sims to be something sims can only do autonomously, kinda like working as a tattoo artist or postal worker. But I can now confirm that with the Stone-Hearted trait your sims will no longer cry when it happens.

Not that I've done much with that particular save since verifying that it worked, mind you.
mw1525
Seasoned Ace
5 years ago
@DivaDoodle - As players, we have all directed our Sims to do things out of curiosity which may have had less than desirable results; that's just normal. I wouldn't worry about your Sim wanting to 'do away' with his sister-in-law. Sometimes, Sims will just blow off a little steam.

Yes, the AI is very intelligent in this game and (for me) is a joy to watch. The Sims move in very subtle, almost miss-able ways, so it very easy to not 'see' or notice things as they unfold. Also, most Simmers are mainly focused on their Sims and do not pay much attention to the townies or other Sims which wander throughout the world. But, it is the townies, NPC and other Sims who are running full 'thinking' autonomy all the time.

Sim 'thinking' has nothing to do with the push and pulls of the game's commands. It has everything to do with that individual Sim.

Concerning a Sim's desire to 'remove' another, while anything is possible, from what I have seen it is highly unlikely player choices influence or even contribute to their decision, even if jealousy is exploited.

When it comes to AI watching, I am certain there are others who enjoy it as much as I do, maybe I just post about it a bit more :).

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EA really doesn't want sim to kill sim

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