Make spellcasters actually exist in the game?

"Onverser;c-17769000" wrote:
...occult themes are in 5 out of 36 packs. The other 31 are purely realism play..

I just had to single out this. So what do we have? Vampire, alien, ghost, merfolk, spellcaster. Not counting the plantsims, because they aren't permanent. Skeleton is also temporary. Did I miss any?

Tbh, vampire is the only occult I feel has unique gameplay and feel fleshed out. They're worth playing. Spellcaster is also interesting, but a lot of the spells have the same effect as reward store potions, and other means within the game.

I say the devs should let the spellcasters, aliens and vampires free, give them back their power and let them walk amongst the mere mortals again. Those who don't want them? Mod them out of your own game and let the rest enjoy the gameplay and get what we paid for.

"Onverser;c-17769000" wrote:

"Gordy;c-17768476" wrote:
Hmm, yes. Finally, the occult players are starting to see my side of things. Shout your demands. Fly your banner. Lead your crusade. Never give up until you get what you deserve. It's time to wave the flag of rebellion.

I think at this stage everyone who likes occults is just sick of the treatment we get over it. Realism players treat anyone who likes occults like dirt and like we're lesser than them and shouldn't get any packs we like. Every single time something occult related comes out they become incredibly exclusionary and start preaching that nobody wants these "niche" packs and we all want families and happy farms because apparently they voice everyone and ofc what they want matters most. Then they insist on buying every occult pack because they like a ❤️❤️❤️❤️ couch from it and then start raging that their game is ruined by evil occults until the devs have to nerf the occults to keep them happy.

I'm just so tired of these people who feel entitled to having literally everything pandering to them. DLC is optional, occult themes are in 5 out of 36 packs. The other 31 are purely realism play. I haven't bought parenthood and generations as I couldn't care less about them, why can't these people just take the same stance on occults? :#

The war on occults is just exhausting. All of us are disappointed with certain things in 4, it is not the occult packs and players that are to blame for generations not being there. I wish people would just come together and push for the packs most people want, both occult and realism. Generations and farming are highly wanted and a lot have wanted them for years, but the same goes for fairies and werewolves, a massive group of people want them and have waited for so long.

People need to just be like, hey, I want this pack, these guys want these packs, can we get these added before any more "experimental" packs come out. Because it's really not a competition and we all feel the same way about being ignored regardless of our play style.

And it's really that right there. It really bugs me when a a New Life state comes out, and the CAS/Build/Buy Content is awesome, (As it should be)
they have the audacity to say "I want the content not the Life state." "Add a toggle"

Okay then Add a toggle to Human life state too. Add a toggle to Babies/Toddlers/Children/Teens/Young/Adults/Elders, Cats and Dogs, Game generated NPCs, Paparazzi, Why not toggle worlds while We're at it?! I want Mermaids, but I don't give a plum about Sulani, City Living I want, I want All the Content City Living Has to offer, San Myshuno can go to plum, it's an ugly world. But guess what, didn't buy it because it's a part of the pack.

It's people like that make me pray Babies remain forever an Object.

"izecson;c-17769022" wrote:
I havent been a part of Sims community discussion during Sims 2/3 era, is it always been like this everytime an occult pack came out?

I think it's more of a new thing, I only joined the sims community a year back but even in that time things seem to have changed a lot. There's much more of an outrage culture now around the games direction, and occults seem to have become part of this outrage.

The only outrage I remember on the Sims 2 boards was when a pack came out that only had a genie lamp for an occult, when every other expansion came with a new playable life state. And that was a small amount of complaining compared to what the "It's a Life Simulator!!!" crowd have put out in response to every pack released in the past year.

"Kathykins;c-17769037" wrote:

"Onverser;c-17769000" wrote:
...occult themes are in 5 out of 36 packs. The other 31 are purely realism play..

I just had to single out this. So what do we have? Vampire, alien, ghost, merfolk, spellcaster. Not counting the plantsims, because they aren't permanent. Skeleton is also temporary. Did I miss any?

Tbh, vampire is the only occult I feel has unique gameplay and feel fleshed out. They're worth playing. Spellcaster is also interesting, but a lot of the spells have the same effect as reward store potions, and other means within the game.

I say the devs should let the spellcasters, aliens and vampires free, give them back their power and let them walk amongst the mere mortals again. Those who don't want them? Mod them out of your own game and let the rest enjoy the gameplay and get what we paid for.

I actually don't count Ghosts because we can't create them in CAS. Which is absurd. So I have to create a Sim, play them in game, and try to kill them off again and again so they can have the proper Ghost effects that I want?

And also, just going to point out again (because it continues to be a disgrace) that with Vampires, Aliens and Ghosts in the game, we still don't have Fear. Sims cannot be afraid of anything and only take relationship hits for being tense or Uncomfortable. Why wasn't this worked on in the first year? The core system in this game is Emotions and not having Fear sterilizes the Occults.

*Flips Altar.*

Absolutely agree with you. Fear is a basic emotion and should have been included from the start. We have known fear since we crawled in the mud. Why it isn't in the game, is beyond me. There are a lot of features and design choices I don't understand.

"LiELF;c-17769170" wrote:

"Kathykins;c-17769037" wrote:

"Onverser;c-17769000" wrote:
...occult themes are in 5 out of 36 packs. The other 31 are purely realism play..

I just had to single out this. So what do we have? Vampire, alien, ghost, merfolk, spellcaster. Not counting the plantsims, because they aren't permanent. Skeleton is also temporary. Did I miss any?

Tbh, vampire is the only occult I feel has unique gameplay and feel fleshed out. They're worth playing. Spellcaster is also interesting, but a lot of the spells have the same effect as reward store potions, and other means within the game.

I say the devs should let the spellcasters, aliens and vampires free, give them back their power and let them walk amongst the mere mortals again. Those who don't want them? Mod them out of your own game and let the rest enjoy the gameplay and get what we paid for.

I actually don't count Ghosts because we can't create them in CAS. Which is absurd. So I have to create a Sim, play them in game, and try to kill them off again and again so they can have the proper Ghost effects that I want?

And also, just going to point out again (because it continues to be a disgrace) that with Vampires, Aliens and Ghosts in the game, we still don't have Fear. Sims cannot be afraid of anything and only take relationship hits for being tense or Uncomfortable. Why wasn't this worked on in the first year? The core system in this game is Emotions and not having Fear sterilizes the Occults.

*Flips Altar.*

Yep, A fear emotion should have been added with Vampires, heck, it should have been part of the base game. But no, it's not. Because the game was designed to be an online multiplayer modelled after Sim City until that flopped so it was haphazardly remade into a singleplayer game, where even the most basic functions and gameplay had been stripped out.
Though I think most people know this already.

"izecson;c-17769022" wrote:
I havent been a part of Sims community discussion during Sims 2/3 era, is it always been like this everytime an occult pack came out?

I think there was less complaining before because almost all of the other packs had occults in them.

I believe part of the problem with TS4 and players being so divided between Realistic and Occult players are that in other games, occults were introduced into regular play packs.

Sims 2

• Aliens - Base Game
  
• Zombies - University, Free Time and Apartment Life
  
• Vampires - Nightlife
  
• Servo - Open for Business
  
• Werewolf - Pets
  
• Plant Sim - Seasons
  
• Bigfoot - Bon Voyage
  
• Witches - Apartment Life
  

Sims 3

• Ghost - Base Game
  
• Vampires - Late Night
  
• Mummy - World Adventures
  
• Simbot - Ambitions
  
• Imaginary Friend - Generations
  
• Unicorn - Pets
  
• Genie - Showtime
  
• Fairy, Werewolf, Witch, Zombie - Supernatural
  
• Alien - Seasons
  
• Plant Sim - University Life
  
• Mermaid - Island Paradise
  
• Plumbots - Into the Future
  

In Sims 4 there are 2 packs devoted to 2 life states (vampires and spellcasters, and then you have Star Wars with masked fake aliens) and all of the related build/buy and a lot of the CAS is pretty niched to those themes. Plus the game play is more focused on those occults. Where in the other games you had "normal" gameplay packs that also included occults, so each pack had something for everyone with the exception of Supernatural from TS3 because obviously that entire pack revolved around supernatural beings.

Now, I'm not saying that the other games had as fleshed out occults as TS4 since obviously they devoted an entire pack around them, but from a "normal" player's point of view, when they release packs that don't cohesively fit in with normal, boring everyday realistic game play, people get upset.

The same thing could be said for occult players, in the past each pack introduced some form of occult play, so even tho they may not have liked many aspects of the "mundane, boring, realistic" packs, they did include something they could get enjoyment out of. With TS4 for the most part it's either one or the other. So occults lovers get a pack, realistic players start complaining, then when realistic players get a pack it upsets occult players.

I personally never play with occults in TS4 as playable sims but I don't mind vampires and witches doing their occulty things in my worlds (don't really like aliens tho). I did use to play witches in TS2 & TS3 both and enjoyed them. I'm sure when the next pack comes out, there will be something I could use in my every day play.

"Chicklet453681;c-17769452" wrote:

"izecson;c-17769022" wrote:
I havent been a part of Sims community discussion during Sims 2/3 era, is it always been like this everytime an occult pack came out?

I think there was less complaining before because almost all of the other packs had occults in them.

I believe part of the problem with TS4 and players being so divided between Realistic and Occult players are that in other games, occults were introduced into regular play packs.

Sims 2

• Aliens - Base Game
  
• Zombies - University, Free Time and Apartment Life
  
• Vampires - Nightlife
  
• Servo - Open for Business
  
• Werewolf - Pets
  
• Plant Sim - Seasons
  
• Bigfoot - Bon Voyage
  
• Witches - Apartment Life
  

Sims 3

• Ghost - Base Game
  
• Vampires - Late Night
  
• Mummy - World Adventures
  
• Simbot - Ambitions
  
• Imaginary Friend - Generations
  
• Unicorn - Pets
  
• Genie - Showtime
  
• Fairy, Werewolf, Witch, Zombie - Supernatural
  
• Alien - Seasons
  
• Plant Sim - University Life
  
• Mermaid - Island Paradise
  
• Plumbots - Into the Future
  

In Sims 4 there are 2 packs devoted to 2 life states (vampires and spellcasters, and then you have Star Wars with masked fake aliens) and all of the related build/buy and a lot of the CAS is pretty niched to those themes. Plus the game play is more focused on those occults. Where in the other games you had "normal" gameplay packs that also included occults, so each pack had something for everyone with the exception of Supernatural from TS3 because obviously that entire pack revolved around supernatural beings.

Now, I'm not saying that the other games had as fleshed out occults as TS4 since obviously they devoted an entire pack around them, but from a "normal" player's point of view, when they release packs that don't cohesively fit in with normal, boring everyday realistic game play, people get upset.

The same thing could be said for occult players, in the past each pack introduced some form of occult play, so even tho they may not have liked many aspects of the "mundane, boring, realistic" packs, they did include something they could get enjoyment out of. With TS4 for the most part it's either one or the other. So occults lovers get a pack, realistic players start complaining, then when realistic players get a pack it upsets occult players.

I personally never play with occults in TS4 as playable sims but I don't mind vampires and witches doing their occulty things in my worlds (don't really like aliens tho). I did use to play witches in TS2 & TS3 both and enjoyed them. I'm sure when the next pack comes out, there will be something I could use in my every day play.

I think it's safe to say that occult players start to feel a bit territorial about the occult centred packs because they were made with the express purpose of keeping both realism and occult players happy, since it gives the realism players the chance to opt-out on a life state they don't want in their game. The problem started to rise when Realism players wanted the Vampires Game Pack because of the BB/CaS/Decore items, which ngl they are pretty darn cool.

So they purchased the pack, fully knowing that the "unwanted" life-state would be included in the pack, and to their "shock and horror" they discover that the vampires are actually an active part of the gameplay in the dedicated pack, who would have thunk it right? Like how dare the sims team cater to the people who actually want this stuff? So instead of dealing with it, they took to Twitter and start to harass the Guru's until the Vampires are nerfed into oblivion. Much to the chagrin and disappointment of the people who loved the Vampires as they were.

So I don't really blame occult players who become annoyed or nervous every time a pack with supernatural elements is introduced, because they're anticipating being yelled at for wanting something outside of the mundane "normal" gameplay that "clearly" the majority wants. Especially since I don't know of many, if any, occult players who ask "WhO aSkEd FoR tHiS? every time a realistic pack is announced, yet that seems to be the question asked every time an occult/supernatural pack is announced.

Like it's fine if you don't like occults, but don't buy a pack because you're not interested in its theme only to then turn around and yell about it. It's like standing in a fire and complaining that it's hot.

"halloweenchild;c-17768992" wrote:

"FlpAmaral;c-17768957" wrote:

"halloweenchild;c-17768235" wrote:
What you see with Spellcasters is the result of the nerfing of Vampires. Want to know how and why this started? Well it all started because the Guru's decided to make a pack solely dedicated to occults, aka the vampires. Where they would be properly fleshed out and not cramed in as a side feature to a bigger pack (ala Aliens and Mermaids.)
On paper, this was a perfect idea, that way people who wanted the life state and occult themes would be happy and people who didn't would also be happy. a guaranteed win-win situation. Or so they thought.
Turns out that people were unhappy with the gothic BB&CaS items being locked away in a pack dedicated for vampires, because how dare the Guru's try to please everybody.
So, as a result, realism players who hate occult type gameplay brought the pack for the decore items, so naturally, when the occult gameplay kicked in and started to add unlife to the game, the people who brought the pack but didn't want the main feature started to complain on here, Twitter, Facebook etc about suddenly having vampires in their game, when they didn't want them in the first place. Even going as far as to directly contact the Guru's directly to ask for a nerf, stating that the "occult gameplay was taking over normal gameplay", the Guru's eventually caved to the pressure and nerfed NPC vampire behaviour to a 00.01% chance of happening outside of the "tutorial" break-in at the start of nearly every new save.
To this day there are still people complaining about "excessive" vampire break-ins, IMHO they are either lying or are over exaggerating and mistaking a "break-in" for when vampire NPC's turn up at their sim's door-step of a night time for a random visit, which isn't technically a break-in, it's a neighbourhood interaction. There are a difference people! JFC, this topic still gets my goat.

Anyway, this is why Spellcatseres are so restrained, they're shackled to the Magic Realm and behaving like normal non-occult sims because the Guru's didn't want to deal with the "backlash" from realism players again (This also bounces back to Alien abductions being dialled down and Mermaids being so underdeveloped as well). I mean fair enough if you don't want supernatural elements/occult gameplay in your game, but when you buy a pack that has occult/supernatural themes or elements as it's the main selling feature, you don't have a right to complain about it, since you're the one who brought it, you have no one to blame but yourself, so suck it up.

Sorry, this topic just infuriates me. None of the occult gameplay lovers, that I know of, harass the devs over the decision to add more "normal" gameplay, but the moment there is even a lick of supernatural themes the Realism players just come marching out of the woodwork "reee-ing" at the top of their lungs.

It's happening again with this new stuff pack. People are already saying "WHeRes thE FaMiLy GamEPlay????" on Twitter without even knowing what's in it. Don't get me wrong, I want family gameplay too but let occult players get something please...

Ooof, as predicted. It's very reminiscent of the "controversy" surrounding Snowey Escape. People freaking out over a three-second long clip, like it's a teaser image for a reason, just because there's no "FaMiLy GaMePlAy" doesn't mean it's not there. JFC I wish people would just clam their tatas before jumping headlong onto the "REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!" express. -_-

I Laugh every time someone asks, "Where's the family game play?" Uh... Right in front of you! Hunt ghosts as a family, be a family of spell casters, Vampires, build a dynasty that would last for centuries. that's what I really enjoy about Realm of Magic's Ancient.Strong/Weak Bloodline Traits. that they can evolve over generations and paying attention to other spell caster's traits.