Regards hair "representation" - is it a valid request or fulfilled by packs?

Because there are so many skintones and haircolors, I don't think there is any other way to satisfy people than adding a colorwheel. As for hairstyles...we can become so obsessed with representation that nothing short of perfection will be satisfactory, and I don't see that happening. Hairstyles were limited in TS3 as well, but more were added with new content packs. I don't think it's realistic to expect TS4 to be any or very much different. The rest is up to CC creators.

"Nindigo;c-17646463" wrote:
Because there are so many skintones and haircolors, I don't think there is any other way to satisfy people than adding a colorwheel. As for hairstyles...we can become so obsessed with representation that nothing short of perfection will be satisfactory, and I don't see that happening. Hairstyles were limited in TS3 as well, but more were added with new content packs. I don't think it's realistic to expect TS4 to be any or very much different. The rest is up to CC creators.

It's not about the style itself. It's about the texture in any style. Laying down, in a ponytail, in a bun, half up half down, flat twists, braids, short, medium, long. Just literally, the texture of curly/coily hair in any bland lame style that the team can come up with.

@NationalPokedex Personally, I would love to see more curly hairs, especially for male Sims. Even among the CC out there, there is not a whole lot of that. But it's no obsession of mine.

"AmTk86;c-17645732" wrote:
Doing the math there about 232 women’s’ hairs in total (without Nifty Knitting, I don’t have that pack yet) out of that, 34 of those hairs are Afro textured. Men have about 126 hairs, 32 of them are Afro textured (I’m counting the cats and dogs hairs even tho they aren’t tagged as such). The majority of men’s Afro hair are reused from the women’s and a lot of the hairs are reused meshes. Boys have 36 hairs in total, 6 of which are Afro textured, girls have 10 out 56. Toddler boys have 2 out 11 and toddler girls have 4 out of 19. I hope you can see why that would be a problem to a lot of black simmers. A good portion of the base game hairs are unusable (the BG Afro is flat out offensive) and there hasn’t been a single update giving us more even though we’ve had ones with more straight hair.

From a totally different point of view I'd also argue that mens hairs are pretty static in real life, most guys tend to stick to a handful of hairstyles or no hair at all. I'd actually argue that its men of different cultures who have more unique hairstyles than what most white males sport or again simply shave bald as they get older. If anything I'd like to see more male hair, men in general always seem to get the short end of the stick for game content.

As you said women have over 232 choices...but thats also because men don't spend as much time on our hair (unless they spend A LOT of time on their hair).

Bu your right, this also comes down to numbers since you brought them up. I'd love to see how many of the players actually are POC and how many who are not use POC assets. The fact is EA does track game asset usages (if you have usage sharing enabled) and I'd LOVE to see what their stats are on this topic, but the fact is the majority of CC free sims I see on the Gallery as not POC - and honestly that can be an annoying issue in itself for those of us who want more diversity in our neighborhoods (maybe its a Canadian thing lol?) and often had to go make my own POC/asian/indian sims because the options on the gallery as very limited. Otherwise I have to scroll and scroll and scroll to find Sims who aren't white or black, asian sims are few between let alone Arabic or Indian.

If we are to argue for more hairstyles I'd like to see more for them too.

Unfortunately Maxis/EA is a machine, they take numbers and the machine crunches them and I suspect that if the numbers show that very few people use AFRO hairstyles or darker skintones, ect than that tells the designers where to focus their resources aka budget.

I know there is a very strong, youtube visible POC sim community out there but it if doesn't represent the majority of Sim users than development will favor what is popular. Its not pretty or culturally sensative, but its how big companies make sure their products sell for their shareholders - follow the numbers and those numbers exist for a reason, because they represent player choices.

While I agree more choices are needed (especially for men, other cultures/races such as asian, ect) I'm not surprised why.

Anyway more than anything...I really just want a color wheel for skin tones. I can DL whatever hair I want otherwise because frankly I've never 3/4 of the hairs in the game.

If I may add, facial hair (for men obvious haha) lacks diversity even more, when it comes to different races. Facial hair of different races and ethnicity looks quite different than facial hair of white men, especially when longer.

"TOLKIEN;c-17646931" wrote:
Bu your right, this also comes down to numbers since you brought them up. I'd love to see how many of the players actually are POC and how many who are not use POC assets. The fact is EA does track game asset usages (if you have usage sharing enabled) and I'd LOVE to see what their stats are on this topic, but the fact is the majority of CC free sims I see on the Gallery as not POC - and honestly that can be an annoying issue in itself for those of us who want more diversity in our neighborhoods (maybe its a Canadian thing lol?) and often had to go make my own POC/asian/indian sims because the options on the gallery as very limited. Otherwise I have to scroll and scroll and scroll to find Sims who aren't white or black, asian sims are few between let alone Arabic or Indian.

If we are to argue for more hairstyles I'd like to see more for them too.

Unfortunately Maxis/EA is a machine, they take numbers and the machine crunches them and I suspect that if the numbers show that very few people use AFRO hairstyles or darker skintones, ect than that tells the designers where to focus their resources aka budget.

Actually, they've made more afro-textured hairs as the series has progressed because of the demand for them. The problem isn't really with the EP, GPs, and SPs. It's with the base game because people shouldn't have to pay extra for a couple basic hairs for their afro-textured/black sims.

There are more than 30 female hairs in the base game, but only about 3 are afro-textured. Two are horrible as they are/look like the below:
Credit to Yoko2112 for the image http://i.imgur.com/hwHMrDZ.png


That means that there is pretty much one decent arguable afro-textured hair (shoulder length braids) in the base game out of the more than 30 hairs for women. EA has recognized that this is an issue that needs to be addressed.

Thanks to @haneul and @AmTk86 for the numbers. Putting those two posts together...

There are 34 afro textured hairs for women in the game with all DLC (except knitting), and only three of those were free in the base game, while there are 198 non-afro textured hairstyles, more than 27 of which were free in the base game.

I think that makes a pretty good argument for more afro-textured hair in general and also for several of them to be added for free.

"haneul;c-17647551" wrote:

"TOLKIEN;c-17646931" wrote:
Bu your right, this also comes down to numbers since you brought them up. I'd love to see how many of the players actually are POC and how many who are not use POC assets. The fact is EA does track game asset usages (if you have usage sharing enabled) and I'd LOVE to see what their stats are on this topic, but the fact is the majority of CC free sims I see on the Gallery as not POC - and honestly that can be an annoying issue in itself for those of us who want more diversity in our neighborhoods (maybe its a Canadian thing lol?) and often had to go make my own POC/asian/indian sims because the options on the gallery as very limited. Otherwise I have to scroll and scroll and scroll to find Sims who aren't white or black, asian sims are few between let alone Arabic or Indian.

If we are to argue for more hairstyles I'd like to see more for them too.

Unfortunately Maxis/EA is a machine, they take numbers and the machine crunches them and I suspect that if the numbers show that very few people use AFRO hairstyles or darker skintones, ect than that tells the designers where to focus their resources aka budget.

Actually, they've made more afro-textured hairs as the series has progressed because of the demand for them. The problem isn't really with the EP, GPs, and SPs. It's with the base game because people shouldn't have to pay extra for a couple basic hairs for their afro-textured/black sims.

There are more than 30 female hairs in the base game, but only about 3 are afro-textured. Two are horrible as they are/look like the below:
Credit to Yoko2112 for the image http://i.imgur.com/hwHMrDZ.png


That means that there is pretty much one decent arguable afro-textured hair (shoulder length braids) in the base game out of the more than 30 hairs for women. EA has recognized that this is an issue that needs to be addressed.

Everytime when I see this afro, I always think, they had forgotten something with this hair, the structure. Beside the poc-topic, the curly hair itself have so little variations in the style. I like opened hair for the sleep/bath clothes and be styled for the other clothes, but often they don't match together.

Afro-textured is just a term the Sims artists use. It basically I textured hair whether it is braids, dreads, afros, corn rows, and curly and wavy hair. I had to ask SimGuruKimmie to get them in the packs. I think the base game hairs need updating too.