Public Shaming is against EA's rules of conduct. Yet it is a common practice among the Gallery users. This is a pleade to Maxis/EA to take the concern seriously in order to make the Gallery safe for everyone. The TS4 Gallery can be described as a Fanfiction Community were reuploading and remaking creates for example spinoffs. However, some players view the TS4 Gallery as their private hall of exebition excersizing power and control over newcommers by imposing the unwritten rules that constrain creativity. In addition these unwritten rules include punishments that jeopardize the safety and reputation of the individual creator.The recuring problem is that there have been made accusations against certain players about as is termed as 'DL-cheating' or self download (since 2017) and 'Stealing' aka reuploading against permission (since 2015). Those who are considered 'thieves' are publicly shamed in various humiliating and embarassing posts made by the alleged 'victims of theft'. The accused are oftentimes very young and/or have limited knowledge in english. In addition some players send private messages on platforms as Origin chat, Discord and post on the TS4 profile pages. These messages contain hateful rumors and offensive content which makes players uncomfortable thus the messenger is violating a EA rule of conduct. Moreover some posts contain content 'making personal attacks or statements about race/nationality'.Furthermore prominent players as E, K and G created a so called Cheaters list. The harrasment and social control is ongoing on TS4Gallery, Discord, Blogs and twitter since new players have been reporting recent harrasments and abuse.Even though a player may report the harmful creation it can still be spread due to ability to tweet and reupload the Gallery upload. Thus the mentioned practice above violates following rules:EA rules of Conduct:This rule is violated when a player is posting a humiliating post and players who support the content of that post.Harass, threaten, bully, embarrass, spam or do anything else to another player that is unwanted, such as repeatedly sending unwanted messages or making personal attacks or statements about race, sexual orientation, religion, heritage, etc. Hate speech is not tolerated.For example: THIEF! YOU STOLE THIS FROM XXXXX!!!!!This rule is violated by those who create humiliating posts and those who comment on them in a positive manner:Contribute UGC or organize or participate in any activity, group or guild that is inappropriate, abusive, harassing, profane, threatening, hateful, offensive, vulgar, obscene, sexually explicit, defamatory, infringing, invades another's privacy, or is otherwise reasonably objectionable.For example: YEAH YEH! SHOO all of those who CAN'T STAND THE TRUTHNot only that by supporting this particular practice - Public Shaming - YOU as a human being are part taking in bullying. The victims of this kind of practice eventually leave the gallery which has become an unsafe ground for them. The victims of bullying remain silent due to stigmatized by a handful players constructed characteristic!As IRL designers and TS4 Gallery creators we have chosen to Say NO to Public Shaming! What is YOUR choice?RespectfullyFruUtter and Luk4spuk4s Cruelty is NEVER a game

I agree more with the ones who are stolen from. If someone is so young they can't understand the meaning of stealing or don't speak the language they shouldn't be using that platform. Not understanding or not knowing the rules doesn't give anyone the right to break them.I really doubt you'd not feel bad or didn't want to make someone pay if they stole from you. I highly doubt you'd be sitting there like "ah they're in the right, they jst don't know that stealing is bad. I won't report it cause that would make me a bully. The poor thief! What a victim of public shaming!"So anyone who steals has to accept the consequences.

The moment I put my things for public use I know they are for public use... I personally don't care at all if someone takes my things and reupload them or changes something... I still know I did them to begin with. But that's pretty much the same things that happens on Tumblr on a regular basis, so I guess that's what most of the sims community is.

Case boils down to our rights as Customers, our digital rights and EA house rules. Some people feel it is important to protect what they think is theirs, but all our accounts, the service and everythinig in belongs to EA, same with this forum and every post on it.I know this is not a comment people want to read but where is it written that we have any right to any of EA's services as our own? Sure we spend a lot of time creating households, houses and rooms, putting hours into save games and whole stores and backstories into these sims, in the end however we use the service rented to us from EA and that is the extent of our control so long as it isn't abused or for as long as the service remains active.

I personally wouldn't care, or even notice, if someone reuploaded my Gallery content, but in this matter my sympathies are still on the side of people whose content has been taken without credit. The OP mentioned the fanfiction community -but in fanfiction it is considered basic politeness to acknowledge both the author of the source material, and any fan authors whose work may have served as inspiration. Passing other people's work as your own is not okay in any context, at any age and in any country in the world.

Isn’t there a tag that when you reupload someone else’s work, it shows the original creator as well?

Stop Public Shaming on TS4 Gallery

Evilfeline
Seasoned Newcomer
6 years ago
@Chazzzy , not every one here knows the unwritten rules and there are plenty of players who never come here and read these kinds of threads. Those who are ignorant or who don't speak the language don't deserve the nasty comments they get. They intended no harm and some are young and vulnerable. A few months ago Maxis accidentally favored a lot that was re uploaded. It was a misunderstanding. The original lot was nominated and a re upload was favored by accident. What was unleashed after that was horrific. The comments made in the re up loaders comments were bullying, torturous and and unspeakably ugly. No one, NO ONE, deserves what was done to this person. This kind of thing is what the OP is talking about and is why I think that the community manager needs to step in and discuss the issue. Yes, its good to respect the wishes of a creator is they ask that their creations not be re uploaded, but anyone who up loads to the gallery loses the rights to their creation when they do.
Trolis555
6 years ago
This is a tricky situation to manage. As someone who enjoys building, I understand where people who upload original creations come from. It can be disheartening to see something one spend good few hours on, be uploaded without any credit. So much so, that one could stop sharing online. The problem is not reuploading, it is not tagging the original user, so best solution would be crub all the ways one could reupload without @ user and this would solve most of the existing harassment problems on its own. That said, I personally do not approve of harassment of any sort.
Livelysword
6 years ago
My two cents, which is not worth a whole lot being its two cents and just my opinion.. I think it to be wrong to just copy anothers creations and call them creations your own.. you did not create them, you simply reuploaded them and called it your own creation and its not.. There is no need for public shaming of doing so.. its enough to simply say please do not just upload the creation of another and call it your own, its not yours if you simply reupload anothers creations.. now, if you take the creation of someone else and do a lot of modifications to it, I do not have a problem with that, as you are just taking a base creation and modifying it... modifying a creation no longer makes it the original creation.. example.. if I see a creation I like the eyes of.. I may take that creation and do a whole lot of modifications to that creation even slightly modifying the eyes.. its no longer the same original creation.. it is now what I created.. I simply took a base sim and recreated it.. if you do not do anything in creating of the sim, then how can it be your creation?

Often I will look for some buildings, dwellings as well and if you are anything like me.. when you down load them, the first thing you do is go through the creation and make a whole lot of changes to them.. while the original design may still be mostly intact.. and clearly I used the original creation as the basis in modifying it to my tastes, there is rarely an instance where I do not change anything.. in fact, I can not ever remember not changing something.. and even when I do.. and if I upload it to the community.. I give credit to the original creator just making note that I have RENO, I think the term is used often.. for renovation.. but I rarely will even reupload a RENO.. but I have uploaded a few because I think they are exceptional, and I do believe I have given credit to the original creator..

So my suggest is to new and old Sims 4 creators.. be kind to each other, and please do not simply just re upload anothers creation and call it your own.. it will never be your creation if you did nothing in creating it.. a lot of the community here on the Sims 4 take great pride in the things they create.. and we should acknowledge them if we modify and re upload that creation.. just remember, if not for them, you would have to do all the work yourself for whatever you put into the game.. I for one am grateful to the community for all the works and creations they have made.. Kudos..
GalacticGal
Seasoned Ace
6 years ago
"Hoverael;c-17175283" wrote:
Case boils down to our rights as Customers, our digital rights and EA house rules. Some people feel it is important to protect what they think is theirs, but all our accounts, the service and everythinig in belongs to EA, same with this forum and every post on it.

I know this is not a comment people want to read but where is it written that we have any right to any of EA's services as our own? Sure we spend a lot of time creating households, houses and rooms, putting hours into save games and whole stores and backstories into these sims, in the end however we use the service rented to us from EA and that is the extent of our control so long as it isn't abused or for as long as the service remains active.

^This. It isn't really ours. I don't often puts things on the Gallery, but if I do, I forego how others may use it. I make sure I'm comfortable with that. If not, I don't upload it. I'm simply flattered if they like it, and/or upload it to use. And, even though I reached out to the original creator of an unfinished house, I still haven't uploaded it with my finished version of it, because I never heard back. What is all boils down to is personal integrity. Bullying is trending high all over the world, of late. Some of us must stand against it. Shaming is bullying. Whether the person is justified in their complaint or not, there is a presumption of innocence in the United States, until proven guilty. Let's not forget that.
Babykittyjade
Rising Observer
6 years ago
"Repo;c-17175383" wrote:
There is another group of re uploaders that I didn't think about earlier but are relevant here. Some players re upload creations for preservation. They don't want to loose their favorite lot(s) and sims(s) if they have computer problems and loose their game or their library is very full and they need to remove some stuff (the full library thing happened to me and it was unpleasant). This group isn't looking for downloads or favors, they just want to save their stuff. This issue could be addressed by having EA give the player more control over their tray files. Right now, its hard to tell what each item in the tray file is. It would be helpful if players could clearly see what each item is and be able to remove and store things elsewhere. It would certainly help ease the traffic in the gallery and there would be less sifting through things that someone dumped on the gallery for preservation and there would be fewer angry creators whose creations were re uploaded.

I fall into this category. I only reloaded once maybe twice at the most so I wouldn't loose a house. Plus I wanted to download on another computer. Never thought about if it was stealing or not and didnt know this was even an issue going on.
FruUtter
6 years ago
Please dear simmers, take time and read the post. It is not about whether or not one should re-upload or remake. This post is not in order to protect THE CREATOR who sees the gallery as hers/his private forum of expression. This post encourages us to look at the #PUBLICSHAMING of players who are accused of stealing regardless if there is proof or not. Use empathy - walk in their shoes for a day!
GalacticGal
Seasoned Ace
6 years ago
"AndyDaniel;c-17175395" wrote:
"Repo;c-17175383" wrote:
There is another group of re uploaders that I didn't think about earlier but are relevant here. Some players re upload creations for preservation. They don't want to loose their favorite lot(s) and sims(s) if they have computer problems and loose their game or their library is very full and they need to remove some stuff (the full library thing happened to me and it was unpleasant). This group isn't looking for downloads or favors, they just want to save their stuff. This issue could be addressed by having EA give the player more control over their tray files. Right now, its hard to tell what each item in the tray file is. It would be helpful if players could clearly see what each item is and be able to remove and store things elsewhere. It would certainly help ease the traffic in the gallery and there would be less sifting through things that someone dumped on the gallery for preservation and there would be fewer angry creators whose creations were re uploaded.

Just this morning I was struggling with this -- trying to copy a saved lot from an earlier backup. Right now I list tray files by time of creation and cross my fingers hoping I don't mess anything up. It would be great to have a button to "archive" families and lots to a separate folder, then an Archive category (in addition to Maxis, Mine, Others, etc.) for sorting them. If you want to move something back out of the archive, you would just click the button. Preserving old lots and families would be a simple matter of copying the tray_archive folder to your external disk. All of this would happen on your own computer so there would be no issues with the online gallery.

From your keyboard to EA's eyes!

I have at least 7 saved Trays on my desktop. You're quite correct. It's very hard to discern one build/Sim from another in the Tray. I give my lots names, too, but that doesn't show up in the Tray. What I did to help clean out my Tray, was a long process. I started several brand new saves where I uploaded the lots I wished to keep. Not all of them were built by me, just to be clear, but I knew I wanted them back in my game. After I had all of them uploaded, I removed the Tray from my game and replaced it with an empty Folder, marked Tray. Then I downloaded them again. Somewhere along the line things got muddied. I will have to go through each Tray again, so that I don't leave any build behind. Then I shall willingly delete the Trays I've 'processed' and be done with it.

It would be very helpful if EA were to come up with another way of sorting. Mind you, I only upload these builds to My Library and not to the Gallery. I don't see why the Gallery should even come into use in this instance. Save your Tray files to a flash drive, if all else fails.
LiELF
Seasoned Veteran
6 years ago
I mean, yes, it's rude to reupload something that isn't yours. Maxis has put an "original by" tag on creations because of this. Most of the time it works, sometimes it doesn't. If I see that tag then I do make the effort to go to the original creator to download because it's common courtesy to acknowledge the creator. People do put a lot of work into their creations and for someone like me who can't build very well and truly appreciates the work of others, I think it's important to be supportive.

But. I also think it's never, ever right to be slanderous or abusive to anyone in the Gallery. There is a report feature that should be used if someone thinks another person has maliciously "stolen" their work. Most of the time, if something is re-uploaded, it's only getting like five downloads or faves anyway, so it can be easily let go with the benefit of the doubt that the person who did it is most likely either a young child, someone with special needs, someone who may not speak English or be clear of the rules, or someone who is just using the Gallery as a cloud backup for their personal game. In any of these cases I'm sure it doesn't hurt to let it go, no harm done. Even a gentle message or reminder or simple request of removal would be much more appropriate. If that doesn't work, try reporting it instead.

In the end, it's true, none of us actually own anything we upload in that Gallery and if EA decided to pull the plug on it next week, all would be lost and there's absolutely nothing any of us could do. Once you put something up there, it should be with the understanding that you risk "losing credit", so to speak. And the more popular your uploads are, the bigger that risk will be. That's just the way things are.
Trolis555
6 years ago
"IceyJ;c-17175510" wrote:
"Chazzzy;c-17175406" wrote:
So OP you’re downloading other people’s stuff, making changes to it, and then reuploading it to the Gallery and you’re mad people are calling you out in the comments? I mean... ever consider NOT downloading other people’s stuff, making changes to it and then reuploading it to the Gallery?

Did the OP say he did that? Anyhow, I do that ALL the time and will continue to do so. All content is owned by EA and most people edit the stuff that they download (obviously.) I can then upload my changes to the gallery so I can recover them easily in case my computer fails.

Wish I had remembered to do this for some of my recent downloads, because I lost a ton of lots that I forgot to reupload before my hard drive failed. What some of you forget is that re-uploading isn't always done for downloads or recognition.

And if more uploaders would share simply for the sake of sharing instead of worrying so much about 'credit,' the gallery would be a better place.

Hm, introducing an additional feature in gallery like "Private Library" that can be viewed by friends would be nice. Will filter out people who use gallery for storing purpose mainly.
LiELF
Seasoned Veteran
6 years ago
"RustyCicuit;c-17175516" wrote:
"IceyJ;c-17175510" wrote:
"Chazzzy;c-17175406" wrote:
So OP you’re downloading other people’s stuff, making changes to it, and then reuploading it to the Gallery and you’re mad people are calling you out in the comments? I mean... ever consider NOT downloading other people’s stuff, making changes to it and then reuploading it to the Gallery?

Did the OP say he did that? Anyhow, I do that ALL the time and will continue to do so. All content is owned by EA and most people edit the stuff that they download (obviously.) I can then upload my changes to the gallery so I can recover them easily in case my computer fails.

Wish I had remembered to do this for some of my recent downloads, because I lost a ton of lots that I forgot to reupload before my hard drive failed. What some of you forget is that re-uploading isn't always done for downloads or recognition.

And if more uploaders would share simply for the sake of sharing instead of worrying so much about 'credit,' the gallery would be a better place.

Hm, introducing an additional feature in gallery like "Private Library" that can be viewed by friends would be nice. Will filter out people who use gallery for storing purpose mainly.

Totally agree. A private Gallery section for cloud storage would be awesome.