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karon_shiruba's avatar
7 years ago

The lack of Gender Equality in Sims 4.

When I started playing The Sims, the game was called a “Life Simulation”, but Sims 4 makes it look like a doll house game.
I came through this topic to illuminate a fact that has been irritating me over the years. For each SP, GP and EP the male sims receive much less content than the female sims. As an example, there are almost 170 hairs for women, while for men there are at most 95 hairstyles. And I'm not even going to waste my time counting each piece of clothing, when you just have to visualize the CAS to see a huge gap between them. Why Male Sims have less clothing and hairstyle then the Female Sims, and how the producers can fix that?
Probably most of the simmers are women, but that doesnt mean they are only going to play with female characters. I am myself a man and i play with male, female and non-binary sims all the time. The fact that i am a man doesnt limite me to enjoy playing only with sims of my gender, but i miss being able to recreate myself in the game. What is the phrase I read between these lines? Because I am a man, i am not allowed to care for my appearence? I am not able to find a hairstyle remotely similar to mine in the game. And what about the beards? If we get one each year, its too much!
Every male clothing piece look way to similar and I can see why. Sims 4 producers seem to be focusing not only in getting fashion trends in the game for CAS, but the majority of the objects follow that same rule. Makes sense for the game to try and be time accurate to the real world, but man... My father has some pieces of clothing in his wardrobe from every single year that he has been alive, from the 60s to today. Every time i amo n the streets i can see man and women wearing clothes and hairstyles that doont match the modern fashion trends, but because they like them. And I miss that in the game.
Every premade sims in the game looks rich, modern, fashion and unrealisticly pretty. The Sims 4 producers are trying way to hard to make things follow the fashion trends, and its making everything artificial. Not only do women get maximum attention in the game, as children and other stages of life have much less even than men. Of course, it's no problem for a man to play with dolls, the problem here is the lack of representativeness and realism. Please, Sims 4 producers put content in the game that is in equity for not only both genres, but for all ages.

90 Replies

  • What do you guys even think unisex clothing means??

    It does not have to mean feminine clothing that looks good on males. That's not what I meant at all (though I wouldn't be too opposed to it personally).

    It could just mean gender-neutral clothing that work for any gender. Stuff that both dudes and ladies and anyone outside and in-between can wear without anyone batting an eye. Totally neutral stuff. That can't be too much of a problem, right?

    But yeah, males need a little more variety too, overall. I was surprised to not find any good full-body suits in the base game. How did they forget suits, of all things?
  • "Movotti;c-16593723" wrote:
    "Anthonydyer;c-16593290" wrote:
    "drake_mccarty;c-16593008" wrote:
    "Movotti;c-16591601" wrote:
    "drake_mccarty;c-16570385" wrote:
    Frankly, there aren’t nearly as many androgynous clothing options as the people suggesting that solution believe there are.
    And that right there, is perhaps what people should be requesting.
    More clothes that work for both male and female sims.


    Personally, I wish this skirt had more recolour options, such as tartan.
    It passes well as a kilt, it's even pleated in the back

    https://78.media.tumblr.com/3ff95bbdc9a1dbe19412a314e413d1ce/tumblr_pbhh3kbpte1v2n804o1_540.jpg




    I’m going to disagree. The complaint on my end is that males are not being represented in game with a whole lot of clothing diversity. Creating a bunch of unisex clothing really doesn’t tackle that issue. Dressing male sims up in clothing designed for females, similarly, doesn’t tackle that issue. Personally, I don’t want to see sims of both genders walking around in the same clothing, which is what would happen if they started producing more strictly unisex clothing. Males need more to fill the gender gap, unisex clothing does nothing but pad the CAS catalog while retaining the central issue.


    I agree with you. I do not support the idea of creating a bunch of unisex clothing. The original issue at hand is that males have less clothing/hair options.


    Isn't that reflecting reality?
    Until more men start demanding skirts, dresses and purple tshirts, the womens department will always have more options.

    Though, I will admit, the game is lacking in long pants. It contains too many ankle-freezers, for both males and females.




    I can pinpoint several in-game clothing items that are wildly unrealistic, especially for males. Maxis designs, and chooses what they want to include; they aren’t mirroring what’s available in the real world.

    Men’s clothing doesn’t have as many unique shapes as women’s, but insisting men start demanding skirts and dresses to get a little variety in this game is just absurd. Go take a stroll through your local mall, you’ll see lots of different styles for men’s clothing. This is a game, there is no reason for ‘reality’ to dictate what Maxis chooses to create.
  • "drake_mccarty;c-16594983" wrote:
    "Movotti;c-16593723" wrote:
    "Anthonydyer;c-16593290" wrote:
    "drake_mccarty;c-16593008" wrote:
    "Movotti;c-16591601" wrote:
    "drake_mccarty;c-16570385" wrote:
    Frankly, there aren’t nearly as many androgynous clothing options as the people suggesting that solution believe there are.
    And that right there, is perhaps what people should be requesting.
    More clothes that work for both male and female sims.


    Personally, I wish this skirt had more recolour options, such as tartan.
    It passes well as a kilt, it's even pleated in the back

    https://78.media.tumblr.com/3ff95bbdc9a1dbe19412a314e413d1ce/tumblr_pbhh3kbpte1v2n804o1_540.jpg




    I’m going to disagree. The complaint on my end is that males are not being represented in game with a whole lot of clothing diversity. Creating a bunch of unisex clothing really doesn’t tackle that issue. Dressing male sims up in clothing designed for females, similarly, doesn’t tackle that issue. Personally, I don’t want to see sims of both genders walking around in the same clothing, which is what would happen if they started producing more strictly unisex clothing. Males need more to fill the gender gap, unisex clothing does nothing but pad the CAS catalog while retaining the central issue.


    I agree with you. I do not support the idea of creating a bunch of unisex clothing. The original issue at hand is that males have less clothing/hair options.


    Isn't that reflecting reality?
    Until more men start demanding skirts, dresses and purple tshirts, the womens department will always have more options.

    Though, I will admit, the game is lacking in long pants. It contains too many ankle-freezers, for both males and females.




    I can pinpoint several in-game clothing items that are wildly unrealistic, especially for males. Maxis designs, and chooses what they want to include; they aren’t mirroring what’s available in the real world.

    Men’s clothing doesn’t have as many unique shapes as women’s, but insisting men start demanding skirts and dresses to get a little variety in this game is just absurd. Go take a stroll through your local mall, you’ll see lots of different styles for men’s clothing. This is a game, there is no reason for ‘reality’ to dictate what Maxis chooses to create.


    Why people dont understand we are not talking about skirts or dresses?! like... thats not the point of the whole conversation
  • Movotti's avatar
    Movotti
    New Spectator
    7 years ago
    "drake_mccarty;c-16594983" wrote:
    insisting men start demanding skirts and dresses to get a little variety in this game is just absurd.

    I was talking about the real world.


    Go take a stroll through your local mall, you’ll see lots of different styles for men’s clothing.
    Been there, done that, not seeing it.
    The local mall has one clothing store specifically for mens clothing, business type clothing at that. It's got a jeans store (men and women), two places that I guess are similar to hot topic (mens and womens youth clothing), and an AU target. Specifically for women, there are about 5-6 other stores.
    Women have heaps of options compared to what men get.


    This is a game, there is no reason for ‘reality’ to dictate what Maxis chooses to create.
    Then why the animosity towards male sims wearing female clothing? The game allows male sims to wear anything female sims can wear. That is what Maxis chooses to create. It's certainly not reality.

  • "Movotti;c-16595017" wrote:
    "drake_mccarty;c-16594983" wrote:
    insisting men start demanding skirts and dresses to get a little variety in this game is just absurd.

    I was talking about the real world.


    Go take a stroll through your local mall, you’ll see lots of different styles for men’s clothing.
    Been there, done that, not seeing it.
    The local mall has one clothing store specifically for mens clothing, business type clothing at that. It's got a jeans store (men and women), two places that I guess are similar to hot topic (mens and womens youth clothing), and an AU target. Specifically for women, there are about 5-6 other stores.
    Women have heaps of options compared to what men get.


    This is a game, there is no reason for ‘reality’ to dictate what Maxis chooses to create.
    Then why the animosity towards male sims wearing female clothing? The game allows male sims to wear anything female sims can wear. That is what Maxis chooses to create. It's certainly not reality.



    You are missing the point. I can go to several different stores that sell men’s clothing, and even though most of them will sell the same type of clothes they will have unique designs, unique styles. A pair of jeans from location A will be different from location B, there is variation even though they are both the same type of clothing. When it comes to men’s shirts, there are so many styles out there they could reproduce for the game, but instead they produce some froofy vested or jacket, maybe a scarved top. Basically the most unrealistic tops that all resemble each other.

    I don’t see why you are circling back to the gender crossed clothing. What does that have to do with anything? For many people that is reality, but that isn’t due to a lack of clothing options in the real world. The suggestion to cross dress Sims is coming from a lack of options in game. Any suggestion for unisex clothing is missing the point. If you disagree that’s fine, but you aren’t making a good counter argument to the complaint being raised.
  • Movotti's avatar
    Movotti
    New Spectator
    7 years ago
    "drake_mccarty;c-16595401" wrote:
    You are missing the point.

    It's invisible. I can't see the point you're trying to make.



    I can go to several different stores that sell men’s clothing, and even though most of them will sell the same type of clothes they will have unique designs, unique styles.

    Lucky you.
    In this city, at this time of year, you're lucky if there's 5 versions of jeans, a pair of chinos or two, maybe some cargo pants, and about 3 versions of tracky-dacks.
    Tops include several fits of t-shirts, a couple of options of flannelette shirts, and some hoodies (some with zips, some without).
    And as for shoes: sneakers, work boots and thongs. Yes. Thongs, even in the middle of winter, people are showing off their blue toes.


    A pair of jeans from location A will be different from location B, there is variation even though they are both the same type of clothing.

    Lol sure.
    Jeans from JJs are usually for emo wannabes, while from Just Jeans, they're for wealthier wannabes. From cotton on, are they even jeans? From target, they're old man jeans, or for young whipper-snappers.
    Like I said, the options here are really limited, so when you talk about variety in stores, I'm not seeing it here.


    When it comes to men’s shirts, there are so many styles out there they could reproduce for the game, but instead they produce some froofy vested or jacket, maybe a scarved top. Basically the most unrealistic tops that all resemble each other.
    I will agree with that.

    I don’t see why you are circling back to the gender crossed clothing. What does that have to do with anything?
    The game is offering options. :)


    For many people that is reality, but that isn’t due to a lack of clothing options in the real world.

    http://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/quote-they-re-not-women-s-clothes-they-re-my-clothes-i-bought-them-eddie-izzard-50-10-59.jpg


    The suggestion to cross dress Sims is coming from a lack of options in game.
    Nah, it comes from me liking some of the female options on male sims. I find that some stuff works really well.


    Any suggestion for unisex clothing is missing the point.
    That's because you need to sharpen that point, because I still can't see it.


    If you disagree that’s fine, but you aren’t making a good counter argument to the complaint being raised.
    Maybe you don't think my argument is any good because my point is as invisible to you, as yours is to me.

    I think there needs to be more clothing options in general. I like having interchangeable male/female clothing, because it's more realistic

  • Even if boys and men don’t have as much clothes as girls and women, they still have at least SOME different styles of clothing, as the Sims 3 store (and past Sims games) has shown.

    Some packs like Dragon Valley, Into the Future, City Living, etc, shows other types of clothing as well.

    Like punk, goth, grunge, vests, different cool jackets and coats, sports clothing, etc.

    I would love more unisex clothing as well, but only if they do the meshes right. (There are weird breast and crotch meshes when the clothes are used on the opposite sex.)
  • Movotti's avatar
    Movotti
    New Spectator
    7 years ago
    "bunny-gypsy;c-16595652" wrote:
    I would love more unisex clothing as well, but only if they do the meshes right. (There are weird breast and crotch meshes when the clothes are used on the opposite sex.)

    I think you're onto something there.
    Getting intentionally unisex clothing right, might lead improving the interchangeability of all future clothing.
    If meshes were improved, I'm pretty sure more people would find more suitable clothing for male sims among the clothing aimed at female sims.

    As to the topic of more clothes for male sims, I'd like to see some late 1950's/early 1960's clothes... but I'd also like clothes of that era for female sims.

  • For those saying the unisex CAS update fixed this problem, nah, not really. The problem isn't just the lack of options for male sims, it's the lack of variety. This seems to extend to CC even, but for as many cute dresses and crop tops I find, I still would rather download masculine-styled CC, because there's so much less in the base game.

    I wholeheartedly agree with @Karon, the Sims 4 team needs to look for inspiration wherever they can; they have the whole internet at their fingertips to research men's fashion. They could take a trip to any department store with a men's section -- Target, TJ Maxx, Ross. They could look at older Sims games. Look at American subcultures, look at other countries' cultures.

    And while they're at it, I'd greatly appreciate if they'd fix the vast majority of the unisex CAS stuff, shirts in particular, but pants as well, so they look less absurd on the gender they were added for. There are male tops that when worn by women, make their breasts look fully rectangular and blocky. There are female tops that give the appearance of breasts. There are bottoms for both genders that distort and stretch the actual skin of the sim and cause the arms to stick out too far or clip through their hips. It was an appreciated gesture, but a minimal effort execution, and it could certainly stand to be improved.
  • EA_Cian's avatar
    EA_Cian
    Icon for EA Staff (Retired) rankEA Staff (Retired)
    7 years ago
    Folks, at this point I'm closing the conversation as we're getting off the rails into complaining about what clothes men do or do not wear in the real world and arguing rather than having a productive conversation.

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