4 years ago

Why Wasn't There A Mention About This? Pronoun Changes?

Reading some threads and other Simmers posting what is said (text) about the Sim such as she/he just go a promotion etc. or anything like that, but not at all about the following subject, why did Maxis not make an announcement in patch notes or other areas of the forum that the pronouns are changed in TS4? No longer does the game say he/she but used the pronouns like They and Them. There was a thread once about wanting all these pronouns to be changed in the game if there were any popups etc.

Interesting to see Maxis developers went ahead and made these changes without any mention of this as if this is everyday speech of the masses without ever mentioning it to the public let alone the players who already have the game.

Dear Maxis, in some circles you would be commended for these changes. However, you owed it to the public and the players who buy your products you were going to change the grammar of the game to exclude He/She pronouns and change all that to They/Them.

This is not everyday speech of the masses. We all know it isn't. Let's not pretend it is. I struggle with my grammar as it is since I have some cognitive problems and I lose my words and thought to even write a proper sentence sometimes. Let alone call a single Sim a plural pronoun. I don't want to have the argument if this is proper or not, only that people should have been informed.

I don't want to be a negative Nancy, but Maxis if you are going to do these things they should at least be in the patch notes. Parents and Players have a right to know, don't they? Especially those parents who buy your products for their kids and want them to be known as He or She. To expand on my thought about this, are there toggles to allow the game to decide if the text of a popup uses He/She/They/Them? No? I'm very disappointed in Maxis did Not inform those who respect the he/she populations nor inform players or parents they and them would replace those pronouns.

Are these changes only if someone uses the gender patch? How does this work? Any announcements gender patch was updated to do this? I'm disappointed people were not informed at all. ???

simgirl1010
Hero
4 years ago
I haven't seen any threads about this. Can you provide a link to them?

Searching the web I found an article about a petition requesting new pronouns.

The Sims 4 fans petition for pronoun options to be added.
The campaign has more than 2,000 signatures so far.

https://www.digitalspy.com/tech/a35950846/sims-4-pronouns-petition/
simgirl1010
Hero
4 years ago
Did you notice it in game?
thatpinkcoconut
4 years ago
I have noticed it in some notifications. There are still some (older) strings that haven't been changed.
Cinebar
4 years ago
This concerns the new trait system. Here if you scroll down you can see the pronouns have changed when the Sim got a notice about a new trait perk etc. The previous notice about the Sim's job used he, the new trait notice says They. Scroll down to the picture showing what happens with a new trait system etc. It wasn't about pronouns but new traits...I just happened to notice the change. I didn't want to derail that thread with my questions and opinions.

https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/988174/lets-find-those-trait-improvements#latest

ETA: I read the petition linked by Simgirl, however, even if a player picks male or female frames for their Sim, the player and a parent has right to know of these changes in any new packs and or the player should have the option even if a female frame for their Sim if the popup text calls that Sim a he or she or they. Maxis has failed to provide fairness across the board here. I don't know if the Sim pictured who rec'd the new notice about a new trait action/perk etc. was a female frame or not picked in CAS, but that isn't the point, the point is Maxis should inform the public of any major changes so parents can decide what to buy and what not to buy. Players should be able to see their Sim as a he or she in the body of a text, and Maxis has failed to address these requests in a sensical manner that would be acceptable to all. ETA: And Maxis there are plenty of trans that want to be called he or she, no matter what frame they pick (if due to gender patch) who want to be called he or she and not they or them. This doesn't please a lot of folks with a blanket change without notice.
Cinebar
4 years ago
"logion;c-17846419" wrote:
I haven't heard anything about this, I know it is a feature that some people really want.

I got a user recommended on twitter (twitter does that if you follow specific topics, in this case, the sims) that seems to post every day where they ask about pronoun changes in the sims.

There was a huge thread here months ago, It is possibly closed or deleted, as some would not listen to those who wanted to keep he and she, too and a lot of arguing by the end of it.
simgirl1010
Hero
4 years ago
One thread from two years ago.

https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/957752/new-pronoun-options-please/p1
pammiechick
Seasoned Newcomer
4 years ago
Typical. Change the whole game for a few loud people.

There SHOULD be a way to check mark preference for specific sims. MOST people like a particular pronoun. Let us/they/them CHOOSE!

Smh...
logionX
Seasoned Hotshot
4 years ago
"Cinebar;c-17846430" wrote:
"simgirl1010;c-17846429" wrote:
One thread from two years ago.

https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/957752/new-pronoun-options-please/p1

lol, time flies on a solid year lockdown...no wonder I can't remember how long ago. ETA: Reread the thread, it seems most of us agreed there should be options for the player, right? But no, Maxis does this on the sly and just goes ahead and changes pronouns seen in the new trait systems mechanics in the body of texts. Why be so secretive, Maxis? Why not inform the public of these changes? That is my beef and if all the older pronouns in texts of the game will eventually disappear?

People posting in the comment of Carl's recent video (Carl Sims Guides) where he covered the new trait changes thinks one reason why their patch notes were so secretive was because Maxis did not want to make a big deal out of it, because this was an update for the players and they wanted us to discover it on our own.

Some even think they wanted to hide it from EA's noses. I'm not so sure about that...maybe this is just because they are all working from home and this was an easy way to implement changes that a bunch of people had done without going into detail.
Cinebar
4 years ago
"logion;c-17846442" wrote:
"Cinebar;c-17846430" wrote:
"simgirl1010;c-17846429" wrote:
One thread from two years ago.

https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/957752/new-pronoun-options-please/p1

lol, time flies on a solid year lockdown...no wonder I can't remember how long ago. ETA: Reread the thread, it seems most of us agreed there should be options for the player, right? But no, Maxis does this on the sly and just goes ahead and changes pronouns seen in the new trait systems mechanics in the body of texts. Why be so secretive, Maxis? Why not inform the public of these changes? That is my beef and if all the older pronouns in texts of the game will eventually disappear?

People posting in the comment of Carl's recent video (Carl Sims Guides) where he covered the new trait changes thinks one reason why their patch notes were so secretive was because Maxis did not want to make a big deal out of it, because this was an update for the players and they wanted us to discover it on our own.

Some even think they wanted to hide it from EA's noses. I'm not so sure about that...maybe this is just because they are all working from home and this was an easy way to implement changes that a bunch of people had done without going into detail.

Or they want people to accept the changes without drawing attention to themselves as if this is everyday language and we should all just accept it? I can see that argument, too. It's called influence. In media such as movies, books, TV, games etc. It's like a child sees these things and thinks everyone is saying they and them, I guess I won't say he and she no more. But there are people today who still identify as he or she. No matter their gender identity. ETA: Language evolves over time, not forced implementation forcing everyone to drop he or she.
LadyGray01
Seasoned Hotshot
4 years ago
I noticed this in game a couple weeks ago. I figured they just wanted to not make a big deal out of it. For two weeks I didn't see a peep about it, so I'm guessing most people reacted the way I did... "Hmm. Interesting." Then I went back to playing. And I'm sure that's what they were hoping for.

I assumed that trying to get the game to always correctly identify he or she or them individually would be a lot of extra coding and text, so they just wouldn't bother. Maybe it would be something they would bring into another game from the beginning.
So I'm not surprised at all that, since they decided to do it, they just went with they/them across the board. It's simpler. Actually, now that I'm thinking about it, I'm surprised that Sims wasn't gender neutral from day one 21 years ago, because it is simpler. Sims don't speak any human languages, so I think players would have just accepted it as it was had it always been that way.