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GammaX6's avatar
6 years ago

The Plants Have Too Many Abilities That Require Low Skill To Use For Easy Kills

All of that came to me during overtimes... The plants team switching to chompers, snapdragons, oak, peashooter, nightcap or even citron sometimes during overtime is very common.

Those heroes I mentioned have abilities/attacks that require less skill compared to zombies:

  1. Chomper: Burrow + Traps: Both abilities work so well in this game since most of it have tight corners, it was quite easy for a chomper to sneak on you and swallow you, it requires no skill or aim to be good at chomping. The traps blend in almost perfectly with green maps, makes them difficult to spot and they also deal a massive damage. The burrow might be risky to use, but it can be a "guaranteed kill" when used correctly.
  2. Snapdragon: Most of the abilities/main attacks work very well and easy to use, especially when defending points. Use your abilities and get free kills.
  3. Oak: Has a huge health pool, both of his abilities deal a massive damage and have a huge generous radius that can be difficult to avoid at certain choke points.
  4. Peashooter: Him randomly shooting, using the chili bean, and blending into the nature using his Gatling gun ability makes him an easy to pick up hero.
  5. Nightcap: All of her abilities assist her in most situations, sneaking, around objectives, obstructing vision, dealing massive damage..
  6. Citron: His shield negates a lot of damage, easy to use, easy to implement and perfect for reviving teammates. His EMP, laser and dashing forward abilities are easy to use and can rarely miss.
  7. Sunflower: She is the easiest hero to use, you can just press a button and place yourself perfectly behind cover and you can do your job very well. While also overhealing others and negating the enemy team the chance to get any kills. High leveled sunflowers have it way much easier with healing chains.
  8. Cactus: The potato mines can be lethal and they are less risky than putting yourself in a barrel.
  9. Rose: It is extremely easy to goatify almost all zombies on objectives. Negating them all abilities. Her jinxing ability is auto-aim. The speed buff is a godly ability for escaping while also speed buffing allies.
  10. Kernel Corn: ... probably the only hero that requires true skill (aside from cactus's sniping). His Butter Beacon is easy to use and super helpful for their teammates.

On the other hand, most of zombies abilities require aim and have risk when using:

  1. 80s Action Hero: Requires skill and timing. 2 of his abilities may put him in risk especially Rocket Ride. Can't-Miss-ile may put a player in a brief risk during the animation. 
  2. Electric Slide: Her main weapon is a bit underwhelming, it requires skill for smaller targets. Disco Tornado, it's a good ability but sometimes the tornado's path might not go well (due to bugs?). Also, unlike Nightcap's ability, you can see it coming and evade it better.
  3. Space Cadet: She is easy to shoot with, but both of her main abilities require aiming and good timing. After transforming, her Crater Maker is a powerful ability, but still it requires skill to get it "right" without being a piñata for others to shoot you. She becomes an easy target, easier to kill than an Oak.
  4. Imp: Gravity grenade can be easily negated using most plants + if there was a sunflower, you'd be just wasting an ability. Imp-Kata... I forgot how OP it used to be in GW2. Now it just asks other players to shoot him while dealing modest damage, an ability too risky to use at the wrong times, unlike nightcap's. The Mech is too powerful but too big, it can be taken easily which makes it difficult and hard to use.
  5. All-Star: His dome-shield dies quickly and less effective vs Citron's. His tackle may put him in danger and position him in a nasty spot. He has his cooldowns so he can be hard to maintain.
  6. Captain Deadbeard: His barrel is another "risky" ability since it can be taken down and too obvious.
  7. Engineer: Probably the easiest hero to use in the zombies side. He is a must have and his abilities are always useful in all modes.
  8. Scientist: Don't get me started! The healing is underwhelming overall, you rarely see overhealed zombies because it's difficult to follow others and heal them. The range seems shorter than a Sunflower's beam. Healing WITHOUT shooting is a major drawback to me. The sticky healing "requires more skill" due to timing/positioning/cooldown than a sunflower's "Sunny Side Up" where she throws down healing suns for everyone to pick up freely and negate zombies damage. His shotgun requires skill and not always easy to use. And from all the scientist variants, they picked the "default" one which almost nobody used in GW1 or GW2.
  9. Foot Soldier: The smoke can be considered "easy" to use. But the ZPG requires timing and skill to get it "right".
  10. Super Brainz: He might seem "easy" to use and OP on paper. But in reality, there are too many chompers or snapdragons or long ranged heroes that might catch him off guard. Most of his abilities require him to put himself into risk. Just like chompers but he cannot get a "guaranteed kill" if he wanted. (his super ball requires more skill than burrow).

All what I'm trying to say is... In order for you to be a good zombie, you need more skill than a plant. I'm not saying that it's "impossible" to counter plants. But in a game where there can be 5 chompers or 5 nightcaps, you get denied the chance to do anything useful as a zombie. Your abilities have cooldowns after all, you cannot just evade all 5 chompers all the time or all 5 nightcaps. You kill 1 others take the chance to take you down, and you have no abilities to use to evade any of that. It feels like an endless nightmare.

Factoring in a powerful Sunflower (which I think has a higher pick-rate than scientist) that can negate most of the damaging abilities that zombies have. Bare in mind that due to the easiness of plants, a good plant can be quit frustrating. For example, a good chomper that specifically burrows towards a scientist (happened to me 0-5 times, he came from behind + around corners, my team lost their chance to get healed with the little healing a scientist can do).

7 Replies

  • Have to agree on all your points here, I like to play healer and have maxed out Sunflower, but the Scientist I cannot get along with at all, his spray mist is awful, has less range than Sunflowers beam, which means you need to be right next to the player to heal them, his heal ball is super strong but with a big Cooldown, I have been healing players and seems like an hour has gone by before they are fully healed, healing with Sunflower takes seconds to fully heal.

  • @GammaX6 Did you just call snapdragon easy? That character sucks and the dash is very wonky and half the time even when you land it, it's bugged and does 0 damage. Also the blue fireball takes FOREVER to go off and is extremely easy to dodge. Meanwhile the Snapdragon's fire wall can just be side stepped.

    I dunno, people underrate the zombies far too much, they are really strong. There are just a few characters that just desperately need help like foot soldier and imp and possibly All Star, the rest of the zombies are pretty good
  • After playing plants PvE and switching to do Zombies I was disappointed, and almost felt insulted, by how weak the Scientist's heal mist is. It is nowhere near strong enough to keep allies alive while they are underfire, or even to give them overhealth.

    Just going for their trophies/achievements shows you how much of a difference there is between them.

  • RetroBitPixel's avatar
    RetroBitPixel
    Rising Adventurer
    6 years ago

    I totally agree with everything you wrote down. This needs to be fixed.

  • Getting 1 shot is definitely annoying, but some of these are nearly essential to the plants in their current state. 

    1. Chomper will ALWAYS be annoying, he is a pain to play and a pain to fight. Unfortunately with the way he is designed he will always be like that. Really is just bad character design in general, I like him as a character, but man they just can't get him right. 3 games now. Nerfing him at all right now would lead to him just being useless.

    2. Snapdragon is very slow and weak right now I'd say. He is large and has a very BIG HEAD, making him sniper food. His fire... seems to just slightly warm the enemy's feet. His homing fireball is very slow and easy to dodge. "Use your abilities and get free kills" can be said about... a lot of abilities in this game. Nothing is really free. There is technically a risk to ... anything. Even something like popping out a chili bean bomb, you still have to think, and the abilities need to be timed correctly to actually .... well 1 shot. Being on the receiving end of that 1 shot isn't fun of course, but I wouldn't say that they are completely 100 percent "NO SKILL".

    3. Oak you are right about. He does way too much damage for a tank. BUT Acorn is completely useless. Giving Oak an actual cool down and treating him as a "mech" would help fix this I think. That or... just lower his damage and buff Acorn so there is a point in using both forms.

    4. Gatling Pea is also a death sentence for the peashooter himself. Its a very high risk high reward ability. You are rooted... and become a free kill to any snipers or zpgs you can't see. Chili bean bomb is very easy to escape right now that sprinting is a thing. Really you can just run out of it. It will probably kill you if you are unaware of it of course, but it gets pretty predictable after a while.

    5. Okay yeah, Nightcap is a problem right now. The issue here is that nerfing really anything of hers might render her unplayable. I am worried that this is going to happen, past experiences aren't giving me too much hope either (GW2 Rose/Citron......). She is a pretty easy character to 1 shot though, not saying that justifies her 100 percent, but she is not GAME BREAKING OP like some people seem to be making it out to be, just very powerful right now. In my opinion at least.

    6. The Citron's shield is fine I'd say. Its really easy to just shoot down, but like you said can be super helpful for reviving and blocking for your teammates, not sure what the problem is here. Besides, Super brains also has the same exact one. His roll does good damage, but super brains has two abilities that are ALSO heavy and easy damage.

    7. The sunflower's sun beam is really bad. Sure if a miracle happens and you can't see the sunflower blasting you with it, it will probably kill you, but she is very easy to spot and blow up instantly. It is by far her weakest ability and doesn't fit with her kit at all. Her healing is good, but she is defenseless when it comes to combat.

    And yeah the scientist is messy right now too, like you said he's a horrific healer. But he is such a deadly assassin, really try it. Don't even bother healing and just use your abilities fully on combat, he is really powerful. This is another shame I'd say. They seem to be trying to "balance" the healers by making one good at healing (BUT COMPLETELY USELESS AT FIGHTING) and the other good at fighting, but completely underwhelming when it comes to healing. This is a big issue right now I'd say.

    8. Potato mines are pretty easy to spot yeah, but you can probably expect a cactus to drop them down when you approach one up close. I do think they should probably not instantly activate and kill you right when she drops it. You didn't mention the cactus's drone, which when compared to deadbeard's drone is a lot worse. Deadbeard's air strike IS SO MUCH more powerful than the cactus's. Much quicker, and easier to use.

    9. The goatify is REALLY easy to see coming. Rose also is just all around... weak. Sure jinx is auto aim, but it does no damage unless the rose hits you some more, or her allies help her of course. Arcane enigma is a nice escape, but.... that's really all the rose has got going for her.

    10. Yeah, the Corn is also pretty weak right now. Low damage. I do have a problem with his husk hop though. It seems funky AND STILL GLITCHES OUT like it used to in garden warfare 2. At least I have had issues with it so far. Butter beacon is a very nice ability, but is probably all the corn has got going for him.

    ..... Okay now the zombies. I read what you said and definitely agree overall some of the abilities require MORE risk (besides a few zombies... like the scientist, engineer, and super brains..), but I think zombies are better characters in general. Like... they take a bit more skill sure, but they also have much more potential to be successful than the plants do. Which is yeah. A real shame. Nerfing really any of the "no risk" plant abilities will render them useless, it would probably require full scale reworks to fix. Like I said I don't completely agree that these 1 shots are NO SKILL, but I understand what you are saying in that they are less riskier to use than some zombie abilities. These plant abilities are also... well very predictable and it makes the plant team pretty easy to predict.

    And yeah 1 more thing, the fact that everyone and their mother are playing nightcap right now makes them look a lot worse. Too many players all playing one class can get ugly no matter what they are playing. A character limit would be lame for people trying to level up or play a specific character. So I don't know, maybe if there is ever a more competitive mode they could add character limits to it.

  • GammaX6's avatar
    GammaX6
    6 years ago
    @Gowron248 I agree with you in regards of some of his abilities. However, you can still be effective with him by just pressing a button (his main attack) while also being semi-tanky. His firewall can cause chaos at points (easy damage, huge area).

    There are abilities that are broken to use sometimes, and his dash is one of them. Kernel Corn's Hop, Space Cadet's Smash and Super Brainz high jump attack also fall into the same category, they can be "wonky" sometimes.
  • GammaX6's avatar
    GammaX6
    6 years ago
    @clumsybobble The way he heals is annoying and frustrating. But what adds salt to the injury is the fact that sunflowers can provide plants with "overhealth" way much easier. That makes most plants "tankier" than usual and harder to kill. A scientist must waste his warps to heal, revive and also evade stuff. And yeah good luck waiting for people to stand still.

    He does have an interesting ability though, throw the healing sticky on a dead body, and revive allies faster while inside of it. I got 21 revives in one Turf Takeover game! The fast revive loadout isn't that bad.

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