Caustic is terrible, and the new map shows it
LONG POST! Caustic is a very bad legend. As a Caustic main I am happy the new map came out because it shows everyone how bad he really is. It is very open, and players are starting to see that he can...
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For S3 I switched to Caustic from Pathfinder because I wanted as big a change as I could get to keep the game fresh. About 1k kills and 55 S3 wins so far and I'm loving him. I don't think he needs a buff other than the ideal but totally not happening "different player model about the size of mirage" and get rid of fortified :P
I think he's unpopular among better players not because he himself isn't good to use but because if you're about padding your stats, you want the characters that enable to you to push as aggressively as possible all the time : this means mobility or faster healing to get into thicker fights/new fights faster.
I really don't think his gas needs to be buffed or changed, he's in a fairly decent spot imho. It might be an idea to have it so that when someone shoots the base of your trap to deactivate them, a small cloud appears for 1 or 2 seconds, so that the often lamented issue of a player with a good shot nullifying Caustic isn't as pronounced - but honestly, if your traps are all getting shot out then you're putting them in the wrong place.
[edit] - Re the map, I think it's significantly better for Caustic than Kings Canyon ever was. There are far more buildings and enclosed spaces. In HUGE sections of the map you can deny access vertically by trapping ziplines, elevator shafts, stairwells etc. In most of the buildings you can render a floor effectively a 'safe-ish zone' to med up etc because the gas totally covers the entire floor. So much comes down to CQB in a lot of this new map in buildings that Caustic has never been more relevent in the hands of a solid player.
@Anlbrd wrote:For S3 I switched to Caustic from Pathfinder because I wanted as big a change as I could get to keep the game fresh. About 1k kills and 55 S3 wins so far and I'm loving him. I don't think he needs a buff other than the ideal but totally not happening "different player model about the size of mirage" and get rid of fortified :P
I think he's unpopular among better players not because he himself isn't good to use but because if you're about padding your stats, you want the characters that enable to you to push as aggressively as possible all the time : this means mobility or faster healing to get into thicker fights/new fights faster.
I really don't think his gas needs to be buffed or changed, he's in a fairly decent spot imho. It might be an idea to have it so that when someone shoots the base of your trap to deactivate them, a small cloud appears for 1 or 2 seconds, so that the often lamented issue of a player with a good shot nullifying Caustic isn't as pronounced - but honestly, if your traps are all getting shot out then you're putting them in the wrong place.
[edit] - Re the map, I think it's significantly better for Caustic than Kings Canyon ever was. There are far more buildings and enclosed spaces. In HUGE sections of the map you can deny access vertically by trapping ziplines, elevator shafts, stairwells etc. In most of the buildings you can render a floor effectively a 'safe-ish zone' to med up etc because the gas totally covers the entire floor. So much comes down to CQB in a lot of this new map in buildings that Caustic has never been more relevent in the hands of a solid player.
Bravo. You’re absolutely right. This game is great because it provides rewards to intelligent gameplay for very good players through the use of Legends with much varied play styles. Many of them are counter to the highly aggressive, twitch reflex standard. Caustic is one such Legend and is anything but useless or disadvantaged. Neither in KC, nor WE.
-To reply to all three of you, whom seem to agree, I've played him from season 1 onward. A lot of people tell me I'm not playing him right, but don't play him half of the time themselves.
-These buff would increase his defensive capabilities so that he can defend against super agressive players
-Caustic should be able to leave his traps anywhere so that he could defend open areas. Right now me and my team have to flee into a building to have Caustic preform most of the time. Even then, the enemy team just stays back. (Counter to traps that can't be shot out because that are in a building)
-They throw grenades and activate traps,then flee untill I can't place anymore, and then they push us (if activated you can run out before Caustic has any chance to get to you)
-Data shows he needs work. Wins and kills are lowest for him.
-Ive already made all the points I can make in previous posts on everything all three of you talked about. He needs these buffs and there is evidence supporting that he needs buffs.
- @CausticCoffey Wins and kills are lowest for him because most good players want to get higher kill games. He's harder to do this with not because he's bad but because there are specific bonuses that help go for higher stats - mobility and healing. The core idea of Caustic is one that most aggressive players are NEVER going to choose over other more mobile/faster healing/evasive characters, ever. This accounts for the lack of wins - there aren't that many good players who are likely to pick Caustic.
If you want to use his bottles out in open areas - you throw them and have your team mates shoot them, or you shoot them. When they're activated they can't be removed.
Most Caustic players seem to want him to be able to make areas totally inaccessable to all but Caustic, his team and enemy Caustics for 3 or 4 minutes at a time : this would be garbage and CLEARLY isn't what the developers are pushing for.
He's about area denial, breaking teams up and creating space for heals. People who always get off at the first bus stop of thinking will see Caustic as being good for nothing but camping, but they're also the kind of Caustic mains that show him as having barely any wins against his name.
They die slower than a Pathfinder crouching in a building, but they still just die. This is how it should be.Caustic was better in King's Canyon by far. Trees, bushes, rocks, smaller choke points, smaller buildings, more cover, and intelligence easily acquired from enemies passing through where you've been. Season 3 and the new map brings buildings with 4 floors and several entrances per floor and choke points so large you need to spread all 3 gas traps across the width of them for any possible area denial and that's ALMOST okay, but there's always no cover to hide or obscure those traps in these areas. There were so many slot canyons and narrow passages on the previous map. Areas where you could setup OUTSIDE and have them covered by a decent Caustic. Anyway..
I have 58 wins this season and 3,400 kills total with Caustic.. got Diamond with just him last season.He has the LOWEST DAMAGE and LOWEST KILLS despite being obsessed with death. (ironic) Also the 4th lowest pick rate at 3.38%. (2 per match)
Means to me he needs some attention. I would suggest..
- Faster trap activation / deploy speeds
- Traps not being activated through CLOSED / INTACT doors.
- Reduced item or ability usage speed by 25% if recently damaged by gas
The two most picked champions if caught in gas are also the two with the easiest time ignoring it.. imagine that. (Wraith / Pathfinder)
I'm not opposed to spreading gas or a wider radius to it given the size of the new map and the overall low pick rate of Caustic, it's obvious he needs something done. He's not competitive, he's not dangerous, if anything he's a free kill outdoors and the first guy you'll want to shoot at.
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