EA Nerf Wingman pls

@Xx__Miku831__xX"That shows that wingman is not supposed to fight for long range. You cannot say that since sniper rifles are hard to fight in close combats, then we should increase the damage when someone lands a headshot within several metres. It is a joke as sniper rifles definitely have a tough time against short range targets. Hence, wingman should have less ability to fight long range, and we should not compensate them with no damage reduction on long range." Your logic is so very broken.. I'll try my best to break it down for you why your logic here is so insanely broken.

"That shows that wingman is not supposed to fight for long range" And it absolutely is not suited for long range fights. Hence if you can land those INSANELY HARD SHOTS then you deserve to get that damage.

"You cannot say that since sniper rifles are hard to fight in close combats, then we should increase the damage when someone lands a headshot within several metres" And I do not for the simple reason that if it hurts far away, then it hurts close up as well. The right logic to use here however, since you are wanting a damage fall off on the wingman on long ranges, would be to give snipers a "damage add on" for hitting a target that is closer than "far away".

"Hence, wingman should have less ability to fight long range" Again. It DOES have significantly less ability to fight long range fights compared to most other guns (R99, R301, Hemlok, Kraber, Longbow, G7, Tripple-Take, Charge Rifle, Sentinel)

"And we should not compensate them with no damage reduction on long range." Why? I do not understand why? Guns have differences and the Wingman is not the only gun with no damage fall off. Also, it's not a compensation it is a feature. Some guns shoots faster, others slower and packs more of a punch, differnt guns has different magazine sizes, projectile speeds, different spray patterns etc. I have absolutely no problem with no damage falloff on wingman knowing how hard it is to snipe with the thing. If I get hit by one while moving I know it is just a lucky shot most of the time and so it doesn't bother me. If I get hit while standing still, well, then I deserve that headshot because my dumb behind knows better than to be a sitting duck target practice.

"The damage falloff system prevents player to deal so much damage from a long distance, it should be applied to all guns in the game (except sniper rifles as it is their only function to hit targets from long distance.)." No, no no no no no NO! If anything, the snipers here would need the damage falloff because they are the guns that are easiest to hit with and packs the most damage per bullet. It would be god knows how much easier to make that 123 damage headshot with a Tripple-Take on long range (did that earlier today actually, 2 tapped some guy far far faaar away) then it is to make that 100 damage headshot with a wingman. The farther away the target is the harder it is to hit with any gun. Snipers included. Should be self explanatory.. That other games have decided to have damage falloff, I don't give a flying eff about it, this game is its own game. You might be used to damage fall off where you come from, where I come from I am used to 1 tap with a AWP or 1-2 taps in the head with M4A1/AK47's (Counter-Strike).
This however is not CS and therefore I don't want CS's philosophies anywhere near this game.

"The last question, why re-45 or mozambique. As AS and LMG is capable for long-ranged battle, so it is useless to type as an example. The actual meaning of these examples is they all having a tough time to fight in long-ranged combat, but only wingman does not receive a damage falloff for all pistols and SMGs." Those guns have a tough time fighting in even close ranged combat. They are in such a low tier of their own that literally no one would complain or give a crap if they were removed from the game permanently. In the light of that your using those guns as an example, I am gonna pretend that never happened. Also, P2020 has no damage falloff and neither does Alternator (like I said, not all guns have damage falloff. I don't know where you have that from)

@HLNorsemaneFor the last point, I think you remember it wrong.
Both P2020 and Alternator have damage falloff. Both SMGs, LMGs, pistols have their damage falloff beyond 38 metres (except those care package weapons). So it is a little bit OP for wingman to have no damage falloff.

@Xx__Miku831__xXFinally found some validation and from the look of things it seems that you have been misinformed. I can only find reddit posts and forum posts that confirms no damage drop off. And then I found this over at rock paper shotgun, in an article from 19th of may 2020.

"Is there damage drop-off? – Just the Havoc and Charge Rifle beams. However, there is a different max headshot range for each weapon, beyond which a headshot will no longer deal bonus headshot damage."

Here is the link to that article : https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2020/05/19/apex-legends-guns-season-5-weapon-stats-and-best-guns-tier-list/

Since the video quality is really bad, I would explain it here.

First, I used P2020 and wingman to shoot from 45 metres. P2020 lost its headshot bonus while wingman does not.
Then, I used R-301 to shoot from 44 metres. It did not lose its headshot bonus.

Third, I used Splitfire to shoot from 56 metres, it did not lose its headshot bonus.

Then I used L-Star to shoot from 62 metres and it lost its headshot bonus.
Prowler also lost its headshot bonus from 42 metres.
Splitfire lost its headshot bonus from 72 metres, while wingman did not.

Alternator lost its headshot bonus from 42 metres.

At last, PK did not lose its bonus from ~52 metres.

It is a little bit messy to read.

@Xx__Miku831__xX"38 metres is not too far that wingman can still land headshots constantly with a little bit practice." This right here is such bogus. You say "it only takes a little practice" and yet not even the best twitch streamers can consistently do it.. Meaning that you must be an absolute god with the wingman. You said it's easy, not me. So in the light of that I want you to show me "easy" and record yourself 2 tapping people at all kinds of ranges. If you are gonna be so bold as to claim it only takes a bit of practice then you need to back that up with some gameplay to prove your point.

I saw your video, but it definitely would be extremely difficult to consistently land headshots at your 38+ meter range. Especially if the enemy is strafing, and/or you are strafing.

It’s really not easy. 

Its the best weapon ingame for sure, for multiple reason, aka insanely good in long, mid, and close range. Also its insanely useful, because of the high damage it does and that you don`t really need much ammo with it, which is a big factor. Another huge factor is the ADS speed that is 100%, which is insanely big factor, because you can strafe like madman with it . Firerate is another big factor for how good overall Wingman is.

I think they design this weapon to be at the top and be that powerful with a reason.

If they want to tune it down, leave it like now, just remove the skullpiercer and will be perfect. Still very powerful, but not overpowerful..

@Sir_NamedThen why not set the damage falloff of wingman to 36 metres when there is no hop-up attached in it, and change that pop-up to "Increase headshot damage, increase the damage falloff range."
Maybe the maximum range of damage falloff for wingman with that skullpiercer is about 100 metres (cause I am very bad at calculating distance in game).

*The most important thing is that EA would not delete this pop-up in the future, or they may change the guns affected when it was removed.
*I don't know the falloff range of snipers, but I wonder if it is fine to increase the damage falloff range of Longbow.

@Xx__Miku831__xX"Then why not set the damage falloff of wingman to 36 metres when there is no hop-up attached in it, and change that pop-up to "Increase headshot damage, increase the damage falloff range."
Maybe the maximum range of damage falloff for wingman with that skullpiercer is about 100 metres (cause I am very bad at calculating distance in game)."

Because the way things are right now is how they decided they wanted it to be. Should be pretty self explanatory that one. And I still find it absolutely ridiculous you want this nerf so bad. It won't change anything really. Go look around at full vids of the top streamers using wingman, count the shots and observe how many shots actually hit and how many of those shots are headshots. You'll find that at most (and I am being generous here) 4% of wingman shots AT MOST over a full game are headshots and 70% of shots more or less misses the target.

Just go to youtube and watch any video of any streamer that isn't a montage, but a full game video in predator rank and you will see why wingman isn't anywhere near op. Also, that said, before you focus on the gun and the shooting, remember to pay attention to how these guys position and how they move. You should realize then that the gun (not just the wingman) isn't what plays the biggest role in why these guys dominate most opponents as hard as they do.

@HLNorsemaneMy opinion is that pistols should be good at fighting at short range, able to fight at medium-short range and hard to fight at medium and medium-long range.

Since EA does not identify the positions of pistols well to players, hence it caused problems about the game balance. P2020 is fine after hammerpoint was added to the game, wingman done pretty well at all ranges except hitting those targets who 100+metres (seriously, this should not be identified as a fight when you shoot pistols to those far targets), RE-45 and Mozanbique? They are jokes.

I am surprised that you talk about the damage falloff first before the increase bullet use of wingman. I think this is much more terrible as it really affects the gameplay of wingman users more than just adding a range limit of headshots. Remember the reasons of EA introducing sniper bullets to the game, as they use fewer bullets when compare to all other types of gun (except shotgun), so they added this in order to reduce the chance of stacking more explosives/healings. But I mentioned before, EA failed to classify G7 as it used to be a sniper rifles that used a lot more bullets than other sniper rifles. Wingman faces the same problem, can deal the highest amount of damage per bullet use among guns that use light, heavy and energy ammo, and it is 1.5 times of the second highest damage gun (G7 scouts). It might be really harsh for wingman users that suddenly they need to bring 2 more stacks of heavy ammo to fight, but we cannot adjust the bullet use to 1.5 ammo/shot.

*Actually I want EA to fix this gun instead of putting this into care package, throwing all the problems into care package does not solve the problems. It is funny to see a pistol inside a care package, although I think that Wingman has similar strength when compared to the Devotion.

No its not difficult at all, if you have good aim. I`m still new to the game, but i came from CS:GO and i won`t lie i`m very good at aiming, cause i practice a lot on aim trainers, but i don`t use Wingman, except for a 5 minutes warmup routine on the dummies at firing range, but i don`t play it in game, and still if i got it i got zero problem landing my hits on close, mid or long distance. Have in mind that balance is made at the highest possible level of play. So just because bad aimers can`t land their shot with Wingman, doesn`t mean a *. And yeah you won`t land 8 out of 8 shots from a distance, but you need just 2 headshoots to kill someone with white armor and just 3 shots to kill someone with blue/purple/gold and even evo and this is with level 3/4 helmet ...

And still all of the points that i make stand.

And helmets reduce damage for every weapon you know that, not only Wingman?

Also it does more damage to LP legends as well, the situation there is not fun.

In most situation is way better weapon than snipers. It does insane damage, firing rate is insane(for such weapon), and you have 100% of your movement speed while ADS.

Thats why every good aimer is having a lifetime moment when find one. And its quite common as wel.

Again i`m not calling for nerfs or anything i just state that Wingman is hands down best ING. Tho its open for all, so i don`t have problem with it. As i stated if they decide to tune it down, a good way will be to remove the hop-up, let him have season 4 damage, and make him more of a mid range weapon, which will mean to tune it down his power at close and long range a bit.