Forum Discussion

Awhoo_Thunder's avatar
Awhoo_Thunder
3 years ago

Never gave MM feedback in my 1300hrs, here it is and it is bad.

One of the best games I have ever played with worst matchmaking system Ive ever seen in any video game ever. Staying unchallanged by others for 16 seasons straight. Even Warzone somehow does matchm...
gameplay discussion
NickBeam27's avatar
NickBeam27
3 years ago
@Unitee01 I think the majority at this point, would rather play their doppelganger- hence a 50% chance to win and lose. However, going up against players much more skilled turns your 50% chance to win or lose - to a 95% chance to lose and 5% chance to win, if not lower.

An OHL hockey team playing another OHL team in the same league is in a sense - playing your doppelganger. 50% chance to win or lose.
Now take that OHL team and pit them against a top NHL team and chances are your 50% win or lose rate just changed to a 99% chance to lose and 1% to win.
There is Apex MM at its current state in a nutshell... ranked or pubs.
Would any others agree or disagree? - and why?
Unitee01's avatar
Unitee01
3 years ago

@NickBeam27Look Nick, I get you, but what alternative is there? My stance is if you put in effort to get good you should see the benefit of that - slay lobbies. Sbmm means you will never slay anything aside from when the game randomly puts you into some low elo lobby on purpose. Which btw is a thing! The 20 kill badge for eg is earned in low elo lobbies, there is no way preds are killing 20 preds for eg...

So weather you want it or not, and weather sbmm is a thing or not no one will be happy in the long run. In order for one person to succeed with sbmm someone else always has to suffer. To me, the only remedy to this is to have random lobbies with a wide variance in skill aka no mm. That seems fair., as soon as you "plan" a plyer's lobby you are essentially rigging the match, I call bs on that.

Better plyers should have better stats that show and lesser players should lose more, that is what makes sense to me, even if it means I, myself will be losing more matches, at least I know it is fair and my stats actually mean someting.

  • NickBeam27's avatar
    NickBeam27
    3 years ago
    @Unitee01 I personally would prefer no MM over whatever it is Apex is using. I just personally find in ranked which I only started playing about 3 months ago (been playing Apex since beta) and for me personally when I was in Brone 2, I was pitted against 20 bomb, 4K diamonds. When I made it to gold 2 ( which was the farthest I got before I quit and went back to pubs) I was seeing regularly ex-masters and preds with 20 bomb 4K badges and upwards to 155,000 kills - in gold 2!
    Something is wrong here imo - for ranked especially. Hence what I mean about the OHL team going up against a top NHL team.
    More buckets makes sense - like a bucket for rated 1 and 2's, bucket for 3's and 4's / one for 5's and 6's / 7 and 8's and one for 9's and 10's. even that makes more sense to me. However, smurfing will implode this at some point as well.
    Its just frustrating to be pitted against players you have no business going up against.
    I like the idea of playing myself. Sure, will be a real sweaty match, but with a chance to win and either way, win or lose - exciting. As opposed to real sweaty with 0 chance to win.
    Only my opinion.
    • Unitee01's avatar
      Unitee01
      3 years ago
      @NickBeam27 I've said this from the start - If someone is a pred level player and never played ranked he will bulldoze his way to where he belongs but the people playing against him will suffer. So it is a flawed system. Also, why should there be a de-rank if skill level is already established? It's dumb.

      One thing I really love about Destiny is that their ranked system 1st measures your skill and then puts you into a tier, then you start to tank up. It's not hard, and they did right by it. (one of the few things they did right tho) But Destiny, however flawed, is getting a lot more of my time these days.
  • reconzero's avatar
    reconzero
    Seasoned Ace
    3 years ago
    @Unitee01

    "To me, the only remedy to this is to have random lobbies with a wide variance in skill aka no mm."

    I still can't see how this ends in any other way than the top 5% of players winning 95% of all matches, while the rest of us scrounge around for the other 5% of the wins - the matches where there just happened to be no preds, masters, diamonds, or maybe even very many plats in the lobby. What are the odds of that? How would this situation not kill the game immediately?

    I'm not saying that it would necessarily be that much worse than what we have now, except psychologically. I think the average player, if they knew the lobby was completely random, would be far less tolerant of their losses than they are right now. Little Leaguers do not want to play exhibition games against professional MLB pros. And if the pros want to then they should probably hire an existential detective to help them locate their lost soul.
    • Unitee01's avatar
      Unitee01
      3 years ago
      @reconzero "I still can't see how this ends in any other way than the top 5% of players winning 95% of all matches" -

      Well it's pretty simple. If you worry about the 5%, you would only see them 5% of the time. Which means in most matches you won't see them at all. And if you do, that's fine too 🙂 Point is, this mode gives everyone on the map at least some way to get some kills, as opposed to how it is now, and have everyone fight crazy hard just for 1 kill. New players will lose more, basically, and as you improve, you will win more. AGAIN, this is PUBS. PUBLIC matches, where everyone joins in randomly in a random skilled lobby. Why should there be gatekeeping? We have ranked for similar skill already. What you speak of already exists. You think no mm would make pubs more sweaty, but I think it will make it more casual.

      The only players that should be protected are the very new ones who just picked up the game. Also, the top % players would not waste time on pubs...they would naturally gravitate towards ranked anyway..so that 5% drops down even lower on most days. Trust me, noob stomping is boring as hell, which is why better players would gravitate towards ranked anyway. But to be forced to sweat in PUBS 24/7? No one signed up for that and there is 0 reward for doing it.
      • reconzero's avatar
        reconzero
        Seasoned Ace
        3 years ago
        @Unitee01

        I respectfully disagree with the math. Top 5% players will, statistically speaking, show up in virtually every match, and probably as a three stack. The two squads of diamond-level players might give them some kind of run for their money, but we still know who wins those engagements all other things being equal. And the other seventeen squads will get kills here and there. As if kills matter in this game. Their win-rates will drop to virtually nothing unless they're lucky enough to get a match without high-level players. I think you make a big mistake if you think that the average low-to-mid-level player is happy as long as they get a kill or two.

        "Also, the top % players would not waste time on pubs...they would naturally gravitate towards ranked anyway" "noob stomping is boring as hell"

        Uh, what? You tell them that you're taking away sbmm and you think they won't flood unranked matches just so they can shoot the fish in the barrel? I'm pretty sure that some of them would probably never leave pubs. Honestly, once you've got whatever pretty badge they give you, what's the incentive to grind ranked, and then grind it again, and again and again and again? Especially when easy pickins await you elsewhere? I think you might be giving people way too much credit for good sportsmanship. And over-estimating their boredom threshold.

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