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Zerox50h's avatar
Zerox50h
7 years ago
Solved

Please EA/Respawn fix POPCNT error

Dear EA/Respawn I am writting this email because of an error when i try to run the game "your cpu does not have POPCNT!". Yes i know what is POPCNT and my CPU is old for it because its Intel Core 2...
gameplay discussion
  • EA_Barry's avatar
    EA_Barry
    7 years ago

    @Zerox50h 

    This game requires the POPCNT CPU feature and the minimum requirements reflect that need.

    MINIMUM REQUIREMENTS:
    OS: 64-bit Windows 7
    Processor (AMD): AMD FX 4350 or Equivalent
    Processor (Intel): Intel Core i3 6300 or Equivalent
    Memory: 6GB - DDR3 @1333 RAM
    Graphics card (AMD): AMD Radeon™ HD 7730
    Graphics card (NVIDIA): NVIDIA GeForce® GT 640
    DirectX: 11 Compatible video card or equivalent
    Online Connection Requirements: 512 KBPS or faster Internet connection
    Hard-drive space: 22GB 

    Thanks.

Cozzolino92's avatar
Cozzolino92
7 years ago
@EA_Barry Could you please elaborate on this answer?

System requirements are a statement about performance and not compatibility. POPCNT is an obscure cpu instruction which is optional for all known videogames (Anthem being the closest and most recent example) and independently implemented regardless of the main register of instructions built in the CPU (it is not part of SSE by default). You can't really ask the average user to read the system requirements and figure out such a technical aspect on their own. That kind of information can never be extrapolated from system requirements alone.

So yea, this is what is driving people crazy over the main thread about POPCNT:
- POPCNT is a known optional instruction but was, seemingly arbitrarily, implemented as essential
- We have a client sided fix to the issue (4 strings of code between us and Apex Legends) which we can't use because of EAC
- You keep throwing around system reqs as if it could explain anything of the above

We will take any legitimate answer.
EA_Barry's avatar
EA_Barry
Icon for Community Manager rankCommunity Manager
7 years ago

@Cozzolino92 

System Requirements are a statement about performance and compatibility.

POPCNT may be a relatively obscure CPU instruction but the requirements for the game were chosen so that the stated compatible CPUs and newer would all have that instruction available.

The argument that older, relatively high performance CPUs should be able to play doesn't fly specifically due to this missing CPU instruction.

  • Cozzolino92's avatar
    Cozzolino92
    7 years ago

    @EA_Barry 

    Thanks for replying.

    @EA_Barry wrote:

    System Requirements are a statement about performance and compatibility.

    I still can't agree with this statement and the reason is that I wasn't very accurate with my own. System requirements is a statement about compatibility, yet limited to OS and DirectX. I simply don't think that the correct information about CPU compatibility are being conveyed through the System Requirements. Specially thinking back at the last 15 years of PC gaming and having never encountered such a case that couldn't be fixed with some tweaking (and with the massive amount of previous instances of this problem being fixed nonetheless, it is hard to think otherwise).

    Despite that, I understand that this was a design choice and I thank you for taking your time for this clarification. I talked earlier about a client sided fix being impossible to use because it would trigger EAC. Would it be possible to set up EAC to ignore the specific injector which emulates the POPCNT instruction? And if so, where could we discuss such a matter?

    • Srksii's avatar
      Srksii
      7 years ago

      @Cozzolino92Everything is possible in computer world, question is do they want to do changes. I too had problem with my old non sse athlon before, played Crysis, but couldnt some new  crappier games cos they demanded sse. They probably didnt even thought about popcnt, they have preset compilers witch made game way it is. Ofc they can just recompile it with no sse support to it can be run on poor computers, but who cares(they dont)! Game is already crappy optimized and running it on older processors would be even more torture than not playing it.

  • RevGunthak's avatar
    RevGunthak
    7 years ago

    @EA_Barry 

    Hi there Barry,

    As another poster @NoSimpsAllowed  so eloquently put it:

    "...since the POPCNT issue was fixed on Anthem many CPU's which do NOT meet the minimum requirement still can launch and successfully play the game.

    So the simple question based on the information above is "Why" has Anthem been patched and Apex Legends has not for the same issue? Why can Anthem be played on "below" minimum requirement CPU's but Apex Legends can not?"

    Better yet, can you pass along a definitive statement from Respawn or the lead Producer on EA's side saying:

    "It is absolutely impossible to patch POPCNT retro-compatibility into Apex Legends to allow the affected CPUs to launch the game,

    and it will never, ever happen."

    Because right now:

    1) I'm actively playing 2018/2019 AAA game releases - including an EA game - that did tweak their compilers and patched the POPCNT requirement out, allowing affected users to engage in the games, and

    2) I can play all of Apex Legends' current competitor Battle Royale games at full bore 60fps/native 1080p on High settings. All of 'em, 2019 releases included. Even those with arguably more technically demanding complexity and visuals, and higher system requirements than Apex.

    - Yet I cannot even launch Apex (on the aforementioned PC) due to POPCNT's hard presence.

    I would need a programmer at Respawn or a tech lead at EA to literally spell out the reasons why it's not feasible.

    Not a past tense "because the system requirements" cop out, but rather an actual detailed explanation why a future patch isn't possible.

    Then we'd be satisfied - and quite appreciative, actually.

    Thanks,

    -RG

    • NoSimpsAllowed's avatar
      NoSimpsAllowed
      7 years ago

      @RevGunthakWhat I'm gathering is that there is some purposeful obfuscation going on by EA.  For example the questions I posed were very clear and had a pertinent example of another recent EA game Anthem.  

      In other words I left out any mention of competitors and just asked some very overly simplistic questions about why would EA patch one of their games and not the other for POPCNT?  I mean it's so simplistic.  This is 3rd grade deductive reasoning that obviously adults at EA should be able to answer.

      Lets take a trip back to grade school.

      - EA has two games (actually more just trying to keep it simple)

      - One is called Anthem the other is called Apex Legends

      - Anthem received a patch to fix the POPCNT issue

      - Apex Legends did not

      - Anthem can now be played with CPU's (Core 2 Quads)  that do not meet the minimum requirements

      - Apex Legends still can not be played with CPU's that do not meet the minimum requirements

      Q:  Why wont EA patch Apex Legends.  (Notice how I stated wont and not cant.  Obviously they have shown they can do it with Anthem)

      It's really not rocket science.  It's a simple question using simple deductive reasoning.  The real answer I guarantee you can be answered with two lines of space.  Long winded responses to simple questions like the ones we receive from EA implies to me that they are just not concerned with the issue ,have no intention of fixing it, and are not interested with giving just a straight answer.  

  • Player_mr148lep's avatar
    Player_mr148lep
    7 years ago

    Sir, I have an Intel quad Q9550 with 8GB of RAM and a geforce 1070TI on it and a the best mother of that moment. I play Fortnite at 120 fps at full. My processor is old but is an old Ferrari. Old Ferrari win a lot of new cars. The SSE4.1 instruction requeriment to play APEX basically is discriminate old CPUs that still have great perfomance and can be use with good graphic cards like a 1070TI.

    I personally compare and test same games using a PC with a new Core I5+1070TI VS Q9550+1070TI and there are only 5 of difference. APEX make a big mistake blocking old CPUs. Old doesn't mean it has low performance!!, and ALL the test of games using SSE2 vs the SSE 4.1 demostrate that you dont have any perfomance benefit using SSE 4.1 instead of SSE2.0, some games only have 2FPS of difference on tests using SSE2.0 vs SSE4.1 and is not that's not enough justification to block old but good the CPUs.

  • Player_mr148lep's avatar
    Player_mr148lep
    7 years ago

    Sir, I have an Intel quad Q9550 with 8GB of RAM and a geforce 1070TI on it and a the best mother of that moment. I play Fortnite at 120 fps at full. My processor is old but is an old Ferrari. Old Ferrari win a lot of new cars. The SSE4.1 instruction requeriment to play APEX basically discriminate olds CPUs that still have great perfomance and can be use with good graphic cards like a 1070TI.

    I personally compare and test same games using a PC with a new Core I5+1070TI vs Q9550+1070TI and there are only 5 or 7 fps of difference at high fps (120 vs 115fps aprox). APEX make a big mistake blocking old CPUs. Old doesn't mean it has low performance!!, and ALL the test of games using SSE2 vs the SSE 4.1 demostrate that you dont have any perfomance benefit using SSE 4.1 instead of SSE2.0, some games only have 2FPS of difference on tests using SSE2.0 vs SSE4.1 and is not that's not enough justification to block old but good the CPUs.

    • Srksii's avatar
      Srksii
      7 years ago

      @Player_mr148lepThey are morons! Instead making game that works on big percent of computers, they discriminate old processors and made terrible video optimisatiion! You re lucky with 1070, Im on 1050 ti, and its pure torture! half time it feels like Im playing on 30 fps even I killed all settings on lowest of low possible settings with advanced customisation! Actually, at end Im not even sure anymore that its my video card , or game is just terrible coded