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bardock9001's avatar
5 years ago

SBMM and MMR are lies

There literally can't be skill based match making in Apex or any type of MMR system in place.

I'm a below average player in terms of skill. I have 1.1 K/D overall and most seasons I get 1.0 K/D. I get about 400-600 damage a match. Me "popping off" is when I get 7 kills, around 1,400 damage, and a revive. I've never done 2K damage in one match. My longest win streak in BR is 3. The most kills I've ever gotten was 9. I don't play ranked, only casual BR.

So why, oh why, are my lobbies packed full of master players and apex predators that drop 20 bombs on the reg?
I swear almost everybody I run into is level 500, has the 4K damage badge, 20 bomb, and is at LEAST diamond but usually a predator.
Like I stated previously, I've never even done 2K, these guys probably average that kind of damage. 

What sense does that make?

It doesn't matter how poorly I perform, I can die 10 matches in a row without a kill and still be put into a predator lobby.

You wanna know what's worse? I solo queue a lot but still play against sweat stacks. So my teammates frequently leave, are toxic, or some non sense, and aren't as coordinated as the master players that play with each other every day.

"Play ranked" 

My Brother is a gold player and still gets put in there with people with diamond and master trails. Watching him play ranked it looks like the exact same thing as casual, except you sometimes get easy kills off players trying to "rat" to rank up. Plus they claim there's SBMM and MMR in casual, I shouldn't have to play ranked for a fair match.

If you still think it isn't that bad, let me give you two more examples of how broken match making is.

My buddy ScoobyDoobyD0nt no offense to him be he's even worse than me, by far.
He's played for 16 hours and only has 4 kills, he rarely does 100 damage, and his only two wins he had no kills, I don't think any damage, and no revives. 
Surely you wouldn't think Scooby would see any diamond, master, or predator players right? Wrong, every time we play all those dudes are still filling our lobbies.
0 kills, 0 damage, and no revives in his last 30 matches, that sure sounds like the MMR of a master player right? What's up with this dang game? xD

My other Brother (Not the one that is gold) TorturedTortise he is a little bit better than Scooby, but he doesn't usually play games on controller, so he struggles still.
He usually can get at least 100 damage but usually not much more than that, and he struggles to actually get a kill. He only has 1 win and has played for almost 10 hours.
Yep we still run into Diamonds, Masters, and Predators with 4K damage and the 20 bomb badge.

Next time someone at Respawn claims there's SBMM or MMR know it's a complete lie. Feel free to rub this in their face.
If there actually is MMR or SBMM the system doesn't work, whatsoever, so it might as well not be in the game.

Want my suggestion? In casual put the Bronze, Silver, Gold, and Low Platinums in one queue and put High Plats, Diamonds, Masters, and Predators in another queue. You have plenty of data to work with, hire a decent data analyst and create a good MMR system, figure out who should go into a bum lobby and who should go into the god lobby. To deal with smurfing take their last 1-3 matches very seriously when they're under lvl 50, if they start playing too well throw them to the wolves, if they get eaten by the wolves let them come back to the average joe lobby.


P.S Add new achievements on xbox (off topic but I'm going to keep campaigning for that as well)

6 Replies

  • Not lies, just designed that way to keep you engaged, unfortunately. And I guess that it's doing its job as you keep trying to redeem yourself. The more you play while this happens the more it will keep happening. It's pretty unethical imo. This game is like a revolving door that gets you nowhere and it will never end unless players decide they've finally had enough. Another thing you'll notice when you start paying attention is that your wins / good games will come in cycles. 

    Don't let people tell you that your 1.1kd is above average and that's why you're getting harder lobbies either. They will be along shortly to tell you that, wait and see. The average gamer can't be "only" good enough to manage 1 kill per game, it's ludacris to think that, even if your teammates steal your kills it's something that works both ways so it's not an excuse either.

    1.1kd might be ok in a pro tournament setting but in a PUB match setting it's doing a great job of showing you how broke this system is. Imo no game should decide who we face or don't face. It's basically match fixing. On average everyone should be facing average players or below but we are not seeing that.

    Unfortunately I don't think see a way out of this as these threads pop up almost daily now and nothing is being done, and tbh I'm losing interest in Apex because of it. 

  • Solim66's avatar
    Solim66
    5 years ago
    @Sand_spitter True, engagement seems to be the main contributor in this matchmaking system. In my oninion, it kind of feels like taking advantage of an addictive product.

    My advice to everyone having a bad time is to not get dragged in this downward spiral. If you already feel annoyed after a few games, just quit the game and do something relaxing and/or enjoyable instead. Set up some rules like "if I don't get a kill in the next three games, I will leave". The constant beating you may experience from the matchmaking system might even cause adverse health effects without you even knowing.

    Always stay in control. Don't get a game control you.
  • "Next time someone at Respawn claims there's SBMM or MMR know it's a complete lie. Feel free to rub this in their face.
    If there actually is MMR or SBMM the system doesn't work, whatsoever, so it might as well not be in the game."

    They have said there is a SKILLED BASED MATCHMAKING, which manipulate the matchmaking based on the variable skill. But to my knowledge, they NEVER said that that this SBMM in casual tried to match equally skilled player against each other... Thats the thing you are missing..  They even explicitly describe ranked with the text "play against equally skilled players" or something like that, but this text disappears when you select casual mode.. 

    In my experience, this SBMM tries to make "even" matches, rather than matching equally skilled players against each other. So for example; if there are 5 empty lobby slots on the servers available and there are 20 master-to-pred skilled players queuing at the same time, the matchmaking rather spread those 20 players so each lobby has max 4 of those players, rather than let one of those lobbies have 20 etc etc.

  • @Solim66Excellent advice. That's the thing people seem to miss, we are in control as in any business model we (the consumer) dictate the market value and product. Once we take control the rest will follow eventually.

  • @bardock9001Dude, your stats and experience are very similar to mine. I know I'm below average so it bugs when I get instantly lasered to death multiple games in a row...which is normal, TBH. The SBMM in Apex is complete trash.
    I get in matches where I run up against players who run right at me and never seem to miss a shot while I strafe around like a lunatic. Pred trails are common at drop. I always run up against 3 stacks that have perfect anticipation of my moves and seemingly all focus me while ignoring everyone else.
    I've learned to not give a f*ck and I just quit to lobby when it happens. What makes it frustrating is that 1 in 15 match where it seems normal and is super fun. You seem to have a chance and your enemies seem normal and not super human with perfect aim, movement, and anticipation.

  • @bardock9001Same man same... my highest was 2.3k but I did most of my 2ks back in Season 7 because the aim assist was buffed due to crossplay or something since then I only do a 2k like once a month or 2 and still run into masters and preds in pubs... I understand currently because of an LTM but before the LTM was even added I still kept getting thrown into Master/Pred games...

    Most of my games are usually 200-300 damage... occasionally I might get 1k-1k-1.5k but a 2k is really rare... my K/D for the season is 1.23 and overall is 0.77 but with how often I rage quit and drop solo and just troll and do stupid stuff 0.77 is understandable and I used to just skydive off the map to get dailys and stuff done quicker because I wasn’t interested in playing for like all of season 6 and some of 5

    This season I have only gotten 432 kills, 351 deaths, my highest kills this season was 6 and my longest win streak was 2 (my highest win streak of any season was 3 but I can imagine preds/masters get a 10 win streak no problem especially running in a 3 stack

    I can kinda understand to a point because I have 3 million total damage, 10k lifeline kills, but my highest was 2,332 and my lobbies consist of Masters/preds but also level 2-10s that have no idea what they are doing too... I had a lifeline yesterday that was level 7 and was just learning things she didn’t even know how to use a jumptower so she just ran on foot to us but I didn’t really care but then we ran into a pred and got demolished instantly... I feel like SBMM has been turned off 

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