So you know in every ME you can "romance". But i would like to see some ways to get children with other species and then have them as companions to play with. Would be a fun way to make romancing more rewarding and make it useful in some way. Anyone with me on this?
@fudgietroll wrote:Honestly, ship captains have been successfully raising families on their vessels, even warships, for about as long as women have been allowed on ships, even when going on risky endeavors exploring beyond the edge of the map, where there be dragons (don't be scared off by the Mary Celeste, but it could be an interesting storyline). The same goes for trade caravans and pioneer families (See various pioneer sources, including the Little House on the Prairie book series). 🤓:eahigh_file:
The Pathfinder cabin on the Tempest is perfectly large enough for a family (read some tenement histories, you can have a family if 16 live in that space, and I suspect that Ryder is going to take awhile to be that prolific. Lexi will probably take over part of the medbay for her and Drack's blue baby, and there is space in Liam's man cave for another small family/nursery if Liam gets kicked out of it.🥳
Just because something is in theory possible, doesn't mean it's a good idea. Things like knowingly putting kids in the frontlines of a war and your decision making processes being impaired because of their presence are things that should ring alarm bells, not trigger anecdotal justifications.
How many of these captains were on military ships or knowingly brought their children with them into confilict zones? And if there are any, please tell me how this was a responsible thing to do?
No, far better not to have the entanglement.
As far as Nexus species are concerned, it's even a plot point (Gils questline) why there aren't any, yet... Kett obviously don't have children at all, but the Angara should just didn't see any (devs didn't bother/have time).
Fully expect some pitter-patter in the next game though, it's kinda vital to the whole Initiative.
@EgoMania wrote:
@fudgietroll wrote:Honestly, ship captains have been successfully raising families on their vessels, even warships, for about as long as women have been allowed on ships, even when going on risky endeavors exploring beyond the edge of the map, where there be dragons (don't be scared off by the Mary Celeste, but it could be an interesting storyline). The same goes for trade caravans and pioneer families (See various pioneer sources, including the Little House on the Prairie book series). 🤓:eahigh_file:
The Pathfinder cabin on the Tempest is perfectly large enough for a family (read some tenement histories, you can have a family if 16 live in that space, and I suspect that Ryder is going to take awhile to be that prolific. Lexi will probably take over part of the medbay for her and Drack's blue baby, and there is space in Liam's man cave for another small family/nursery if Liam gets kicked out of it.🥳
Just because something is in theory possible, doesn't mean it's a good idea. Things like knowingly putting kids in the frontlines of a war and your decision making processes being impaired because of their presence are things that should ring alarm bells, not trigger anecdotal justifications.
How many of these captains were on military ships or knowingly brought their children with them into confilict zones? And if there are any, please tell me how this was a responsible thing to do?
No, far better not to have the entanglement.
Ignoring the argument many have made that the Tempest ISN'T a military ship, Military captains in the wooden ship era, including various Royal navies, often took their families with them when they were redeployed, which was generally a risky combat mission in and of itself, and not infrequently kept them onboard while patrolling, doing escort duty, etc. This approach was common among armed and unarmed merchant vessels, even when operating in risky areas, and, thanks to Cora (and possibly Spacer Shep) we know it is still happening during the Initiative's time.
Anyway, the Nexus was boarded by the enemy and had a bloody civil war, multiple outposts have been wiped out, all the Angaran planets are hostile/war zones, Kedara and Elaaden are hostile freefire zones, the Kett know where meridian is and how to breach it, and every world in the cluster almost got exterminated/instantly Kettified. At least on the Tempest I can protect them,
Despite the risks, and there is nowhere that is truly safe, life finds a way, and we must go on to the next and the next generation. My Ryder didn't travel 600 years and 2 million light years just to give themselves a Darwin Award, although it is your Ryders right to choose otherwise if that is what you truly desire.
It would be great to have childrens in the next Adromeda, in the first MEA they explain to us why there are no childrens arround and why people are "forced" not to have them, this is why the forst mother in Andromeda is on the run and why Kesh is keeping things quiet about her babies.
But once we build the outpost, make planets good for life and defeat the Kett well it is normal for the people to start having babies again ( just like Gill and Jill are doing).
So it would be nice to have a babie with your loved one, this would affect the game and progress the romance to a next level, because let's be honest romance is a big part of BioWare games but they have no impact on the story or the characters, onces you complete the romance with your loved one nothing really happends (so it would also be awesome to have more interactions with your LI).
Progressing the relation of MEA in to the next ME game? AWESOME i think most of ME players would love to see the relation progress maybe with some new tecnology we will have chance to be able to have childs with other races, but how do you incorporate these childs into the game?
-You start from the beginnig with your LI going arround with a huge belly slowly throughtout the game progression untill she gives birth to your child? This can't really work because your LI would be relegated to the Tempest for most of the game. Plus this solution can't work for female Ryder characters.
-Another way could be if the next ME took place few years after this one, and when you start you allready have a children and he/she would be a little bigger so you would not be forced to stay with him all the time and be able to do pathfinder stuff.
-Or they could just progress the relationship with your LI untill a point in the late game she tells you that she is pregnant or you as Sarah tell you LI that you are.
- The last one a can think off is if the next game took place a lot of time after the first Andromeda and we play as the son/daughter of Ryder and her/his LI.
In conclusion having a child would be the natural progression to a relationship in Andromeda, because this is whats going on in the cluster at the end of MEA as we learn from Gill and the radio trasmission on the Nexus so we need to do our part in the repopulation of our new home, and it would add something special to the story, relationship and game in general.
@fudgietroll wrote:Ignoring the argument many have made that the Tempest ISN'T a military ship, Military captains in the wooden ship era, including various Royal navies, often took their families with them when they were redeployed, which was generally a risky combat mission in and of itself, and not infrequently kept them onboard while patrolling, doing escort duty, etc. This approach was common among armed and unarmed merchant vessels, even when operating in risky areas, and, thanks to Cora (and possibly Spacer Shep) we know it is still happening during the Initiative's time.
Anyway, the Nexus was boarded by the enemy and had a bloody civil war, multiple outposts have been wiped out, all the Angaran planets are hostile/war zones, Kedara and Elaaden are hostile freefire zones, the Kett know where meridian is and how to breach it, and every world in the cluster almost got exterminated/instantly Kettified. At least on the Tempest I can protect them,
Despite the risks, and there is nowhere that is truly safe, life finds a way, and we must go on to the next and the next generation. My Ryder didn't travel 600 years and 2 million light years just to give themselves a Darwin Award, although it is your Ryders right to choose otherwise if that is what you truly desire.
Well you come back again with the same argument that it's done many times before and I still reply the same thing...just because it's been done, doesn't make it a good idea. I think it's irresponsible to do such a thing, particularly because you are the Pathfinder especially in a story where things happen like boarding Kett ships and all that.
In the end it may not be a military ship but you're exploring in a warzone with it. It's down right irresponsible to take children into a warzone especially if you can't even defend yourself. Again the argument that it was done before or even was common practice doesn't make it a good idea.
But let's look at the game and story development itself. To me, having children in this situation, would significantly have to change your choices and decisions unless indeed you like to be the reckless parent and just not care. But then why have kids? They're not accessories.
But would you go on board of a Kett cruiser, would you take the same risks you do now if you had children? If the answer is yes, then in my book you're an irresponsible parent. If the answer is no, then it would complicate the story writing and decision trees that you get because they would be significantly different.
I remember a scene from Babylon 5 where the main character gets married and at some point he has to go to war and his (half-alien) wife goes back to her home planet. One of the reason is she tells him that he should be able to make certain decisions and with her around, he wouldn't be able to make those decisions.
I firmly believe that this is true and with children even more so. Having children and still doing the same exact things would just not be believable to me. And besides, you just came out of stasis. I don't see having a pregnant protagonist or jumping years into the future as really interesting options for the story, but at that point of course that's also just my opinion.
@EgoMania wrote:
Well you come back again with the same argument that it's done many times before and I still reply the same thing...just because it's been done, doesn't make it a good idea. I think it's irresponsible to do such a thing, particularly because you are the Pathfinder especially in a story where things happen like boarding Kett ships and all that.
In the end it may not be a military ship but you're exploring in a warzone with it. It's down right irresponsible to take children into a warzone especially if you can't even defend yourself. Again the argument that it was done before or even was common practice doesn't make it a good idea.
But let's look at the game and story development itself. To me, having children in this situation, would significantly have to change your choices and decisions unless indeed you like to be the reckless parent and just not care. But then why have kids? They're not accessories.
But would you go on board of a Kett cruiser, would you take the same risks you do now if you had children? If the answer is yes, then in my book you're an irresponsible parent. If the answer is no, then it would complicate the story writing and decision trees that you get because they would be significantly different.
I remember a scene from Babylon 5 where the main character gets married and at some point he has to go to war and his (half-alien) wife goes back to her home planet. One of the reason is she tells him that he should be able to make certain decisions and with her around, he wouldn't be able to make those decisions.
I firmly believe that this is true and with children even more so. Having children and still doing the same exact things would just not be believable to me. And besides, you just came out of stasis. I don't see having a pregnant protagonist or jumping years into the future as really interesting options for the story, but at that point of course that's also just my opinion.
Sadly, after the Skyllian Blitz, Elysium, Mindior, Terra Nova, Eden Prime, Shanxi, Horizon, Freedom's Progress, Feros, Omega gang wars, Geth Attack on the Citadel, Cora's family freighter, etc., by your example, the only place in the Universe that Humans should be having babies is Earth, and we (the players) all know what happens there. Lets look at Initiative space. Eos still has plenty of Kett floating around, even if you take out the base and haven't managed to start a war over water with Advent. Havarl isn't really a colony, but it is still crawling with remnant, Rokaar, and hostile flora and fauna on the off chance someone decides to have kids there. Voeld is a straight-up warzone even after we hit the Kett base and exaltation facility. Kedara is still crawling in trigger happy exiles and a strong Rokaar presence. Elaaden has exiles and scavs, not to mention the Worm and the Krogan neighbors who will be taking over/out the colony the next time Tann crosses the line with Morda. The Nexus is still largely a crippled wreck which has barely survived terrorist attacks, dangerous protests, open revolt, and being boarded by the kett, not to mention being the largest sitting duck on Helios. Meridian is filled with who-knows-what which can pose any number of dangers, is still a sitting duck for the Kett, and happens to be a large Remnant structure floating nice and close to a massive Scourge cloud, which happens to have an appetite for Remnant tech. So, by your terms there ISN'T anywhere "safe" enough in Andromeda to have kids.
Empirically though, while your argument is well-intentioned, humanity has a long history of having kids in risky situations. From Stone Age caves, to lands racked with war, to far-flung colonies tenuously clinging to existence, to the ships and planets drifting precariously through the Terminus, to Andromeda, and beyond, humanity has not let the risks involved interfere with chasing, or producing, the future. Additionally, for the last 80 years, the Angara have been living for the most part in occupied worlds where they and their families could be taken by the Kett at any time or buried in the rubble of a ruined settlement. Not to mention the Krogan, who face death with every sunrise, and find birth not a risk but a victory. I am sure that the Turians, Salariens, and Asari have similar situations and histories. One thing is certain, for everyone who came to Andromeda the future is worth any risk, and, like their pioneer ancestors, caveman or colonist, children are not only an acceptable risk, they are an imperative. Summatively, while your concerns are understandable, for most of the free peoples of Helios they are irrelevant.
Anyway, not only is Ryder the individual in Helios most capable of taking care of themselves, we also cruise around in the only Initiative ship not wrecked, boarded by Kett, or both. It is also stealthed and has at least 4 goons onboard at any given time with nothing better to do than to be babysitters/bodyguards. Considering all of Helios is effectively a warzone, there isn't anywhere (except maybe Aya) that is safer.
While I do agree that kids mean that you generally need to stop doing stupid stuff for its own sake, it may still be required to protect your people or complete your mission, and that is something you cannot shirk. This challenge to balance family and duty is one that is faced daily by military, police, firefighters, and many others across the world. If they can do it so can Ryder.
Although, if Sara gets pregnant Scott will be carrying most of the Pathfinder load for a few months at least.
Mankind has a long history of being a race of stumbling fools. I am too rational to fall for your wall of text regurgitations of "it's been done so it's ok" argumentation.
Your empirical approach only shows that humans can be persistent, not that it's a good idea. We are a screwed up race as it is. Look at the world and then try to convince anyone we are an advanced, enlightened species in this universe. Even just saying it makes me laugh.
A poet once said: If fifty million people say a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing.
I firmly believe in that.
Now I don't think we are going to even remotely see eye to eye on this, so I think there is wisdom in agreeing to disagree as the saying goes.
Fair enough. It's kind of a case of Not Smart/Recommended vs Don't Care/Beats The Alternative. I did enjoy the debate though.
This would actually be interesting for the next game. Ryder can decide to start having kids or not, and wind up supporting unrestricted childbirth or Nexus control of reproduction, with significant impacts on the game, kind of like backing Mages or Templars over the course of DA2, with the possibility of one or more colonies revolting/attempting to secede along the way over this and other issues (see Browncoats thread). So you could back the Initiative being "smart", cautious, etc. about reproduction, and I could support the colonists going for it all out, and we could each take the consequences of our choices.
Anyway, if we're going to be quoting poetry, I think I'll go with Kipling
Oh, East is East and West is West, and never the twain shall meet,
Till Earth and Sky stand presently at God's great Judgment Seat;
But there is neither East nor West, Border, nor Breed, nor Birth,
When two strong men stand face to face, though they come from the ends of the earth!
-from the Ballad of East and West
But to-day I leave the galley. Shall I curse her service then?
God be thanked! Whate'er comes after, I have lived and toiled with Men!
-from the Galley Slave
Well, debating things is fun but once I see that people are basically repeating their same arguments without any movement I lose interest, even if I'm one of the parties involved myself. 🙂 I just realised I was repeating myself as were you, so that's why I decided it was enough for me at least.
Nice poetry though.
