There needs to be vertical and horizontal thruster controls. The ship moves like a planes with gravity, which isn't nearly as controllable if the ships had controls that moved it in the vacuum of space.
There should be an advanced thruster control that allows you to pick between arcade and realistic. I should be able to pivot my ship on the vertical and horizontal planes by allowing me to control small thrusters on the top, bottom and sides of the ships.
What you are asking for is a fundamental change the to *Star Wars* space sim genre. They tried to stick sort of close to the X-Wing series, so there had to be "star wars physics," where cutting the throttle actually put on the breaks. I would have understood if they made that choice, and went to independent thruster controls (basically "drifting" at all times). But that's not what they did.
What I object to, however, is that they made it IMPOSSIBLE (practically) to precisely control where you come out of a quick turn! The ship does not steer exactly where you want it to steer, unless you apply just the right amount of "counter-steer" as you finish your turn, which requires a lot of guesswork and slows everything down.
That makes this game extremely frustrating for people who used to be good at XvT or XWA. The responsiveness is just so slow.
The ship's "maneuverability" rating should affect how fast / tightly it *turns,* but I think they have also made it affect how sluggishly it responds to your controls, and how in-exactly it comes out of turns. And that is making that part of the game very un-fun. I hope it is possible for them to eliminate the necessity of "counter-steering," or at least tone it down by about 2/3 across the board...
I don't think it fundamentally changes the space sim. I think it actually makes it a space "sim". Having the options to choose better control on the vertical and horizontal planes gives the game a vacuum of space feel, unless the Star Wars universe isn't actually in space. I get there has to be some fantasy, otherwise missiles and blasters that miss will go on forever; but giving more control over your spaceship seems to open up the world more.
It seems you would agree with me: "What I object to, however, is that they made it IMPOSSIBLE (practically) to precisely control where you come out of a quick turn!"
You could do this with better control over your ship.
I do miss my thrusters from Elite Dangerous, but that doesn't really fit Star Wars. I have them mapped to the analog sticks on my X56 and I find myself moving them every once in a while in this game. I'm waiting for VR to be fixed to really play, but I was screwing around in the practice area and I'd park by something to check out the detail and I found myself wishing I could just strafe to the left a few meters. That's really just because I'm slowly floating around checking out the environment in VR.
I do think Star Wars ships have some thrusters for landing and maneuvering around hangers, but there isn't a "Flight Assist Off" mode like in Elite Dangerous. There is a dog fighting mode in that game, but I don't think it's very popular. It's a different audience. That game attracts sim fans who want a simulated economy and a grind rather than players who want instant fast action.
I agree, it's a feature of Elite Dangerous, but I don't think one vendor owns the physics of space any more than one would on the physics of say bullet drop (for instance). I don't see any harm with the game staying as it is for those who want a more arcade feel, but would you agree to exposing advanced pilot features for people who want more of a sim feel?
To me star wars is less about how a ship moves in space and more about the galactic story. I don't think adjusting the physics engine would change that. Jedi and Sith will still be there; the Empire and Rebels will still be at each others throat; and X-Wing and Tie Fighters will still exactly what they are; but perhaps a more immersive experience wouldn't hurt?
@kwnasthatguy wrote:I agree, it's a feature of Elite Dangerous, but I don't think one vendor owns the physics of space any more than one would on the physics of say bullet drop (for instance). I don't see any harm with the game staying as it is for those who want a more arcade feel, but would you agree to exposing advanced pilot features for people who want more of a sim feel?
To me star wars is less about how a ship moves in space and more about the galactic story. I don't think adjusting the physics engine would change that. Jedi and Sith will still be there; the Empire and Rebels will still be at each others throat; and X-Wing and Tie Fighters will still exactly what they are; but perhaps a more immersive experience wouldn't hurt?
Semantics. Show me a strafing x-wing or tie fighter in any of the films. Just no.
@kwnasthatguy wrote:There needs to be vertical and horizontal thruster controls. The ship moves like a planes with gravity, which isn't nearly as controllable if the ships had controls that moved it in the vacuum of space.
There should be an advanced thruster control that allows you to pick between arcade and realistic. I should be able to pivot my ship on the vertical and horizontal planes by allowing me to control small thrusters on the top, bottom and sides of the ships.
Sorry, that made me laugh... switch between arcade and realistic? Hate to break it to you, but even in real life jets, they do not have individual throttle controls like that. Speed is limited to throttle up/down and air brakes.. and, since this is space, there is no air brakes, so throttling down is literally "less forward"..
You, also, do not need advanced throttle controls, because you have pitch, turning and twisting, also the ability to do all at the same time. And.. you can do tight turns, wide turns, and drift turns. Hint: If you do the campaign, they teach how to do all of it. Boost drifting was a challenge, as a small bug doesn't show the button actions right away (you have to pause before attempting, otherwise, you won't catch something important).
If this were to act like ships in the vacuum of space, lasers and missiles wouldn't function and ships would require thrusters in all directions.. as in, you would need thrusters out the side, to turn... because rudders and elevators would have zero effect.
@kwnasthatguy wrote:I don't think it fundamentally changes the space sim. I think it actually makes it a space "sim". Having the options to choose better control on the vertical and horizontal planes gives the game a vacuum of space feel, unless the Star Wars universe isn't actually in space. I get there has to be some fantasy, otherwise missiles and blasters that miss will go on forever; but giving more control over your spaceship seems to open up the world more.
It seems you would agree with me: "What I object to, however, is that they made it IMPOSSIBLE (practically) to precisely control where you come out of a quick turn!"
You could do this with better control over your ship.
Again, that is silly.. because in the vacuum of space, thrusters in the back would only propel a ship forward, regardless if it's one or four. It would not actually turn a space ship, because it is the affects of wind resistance and gravity, which you are applying to your logic. Thrusters on, an X-wing by example, would only only affect the forward speed, if only one engine fired. The entire thruster would need to turn 180 degrees from the direction you wanted to go. The problem being, it would NOT force the space ship to turn, but push the entire ship in that direction... as in, slide sideways.
To put it into clarity, the Space shuttle had small air thrusters out each side of the ship. For the ship to turn, they had to fire a series of the side thrusters in a set series. It took hours to complete a basic turn. There were also four thrusters (like the X-Wing), and they did nothing to aid the turning, they only gave four basic variations of forward speed, despite the existence of rudders and elevators, used for return landings ONLY.
You CAN control the precise control of turns!! By cutting the throttle during a turn. It's funny, because there is a part of the Story mode, where you have to use the precise turning and throttle controls, in a Y-Wing to bomb structures. Literally skirting the sides and weaving.
And, likely, you are using Noobs engines and other parts... Hint: There are some engines that react quicker to increase / decrease of throttle... just like there are some that are slower.. but, there is also other disadvantages / advantages to those upgrades..
There is, also, a learning curve. You have to BECOME good at the controls, as this is not a game for button mashers, that want to be Aces from day one. And, your opponents, as well, will have the same advantages and disadvantages... so, if you had more precise controls, they would too... learn to utilize what you think is a flaw.
@Aculeus wrote:I do miss my thrusters from Elite Dangerous, but that doesn't really fit Star Wars. I have them mapped to the analog sticks on my X56 and I find myself moving them every once in a while in this game. I'm waiting for VR to be fixed to really play, but I was screwing around in the practice area and I'd park by something to check out the detail and I found myself wishing I could just strafe to the left a few meters. That's really just because I'm slowly floating around checking out the environment in VR.
I do think Star Wars ships have some thrusters for landing and maneuvering around hangers, but there isn't a "Flight Assist Off" mode like in Elite Dangerous. There is a dog fighting mode in that game, but I don't think it's very popular. It's a different audience. That game attracts sim fans who want a simulated economy and a grind rather than players who want instant fast action.
Strafing isn't common in the Star Wars Universe, because it would be unreasonable to do, considering you would need thrusters all along the left and right sides, to perform such a maneuver.
As for landing, the explanation of landing is based on the concept of tractor beams, along with vertical thrusters on the ships. But they would only propel a vehicle in the opposite direction of their exhaust, so you would need thrusters that rotated or thrusters in all directions... which would seriously take away from the look and feel, especially Tie fighters, because they would need thrusters on the panels.
@kwnasthatguy wrote:
@Billkwandoshow my any droid who's head floats above a soccer ball in any of the movies other than the last three. It wasn't there until it was, but this is a video game so I don't think this would change the canon at all. Surely you can look at all the Star Wars video games and find things that weren't there in the movies, but I would argue the SW universe is larger than the movies. It encompasses past, present, and future media.
I don't see changing how a ship moves in a video game throws the entire SW universe into a free fall of chaos; no more than soccer ball with a floating head or a Mandalorian with a baby Yoda. None of these were there until they were.
Umm, episode one... in the Naboo fighters, especially in the scene with Anakin, R2 is in the same position.
In Episode 3, the droids are on the wing, in what would eventually become Tie Fighters... which lose the droids. The difference, in the X-Wing, the droids loaded from the top and the Naboo and Republic fighters, they loaded from the bottom.
The X-Wings for Ep 7, 8 and 9, are in the same position as Episode 4,5 and 6. And, this was by design, because the droid has to sit high enough to reach exterior control panels, for things not directly controlled.
