Arrow mod speed question

I think there'd be a lot of toons where you could do this. Especially, if the stats are good.

So your main question I think is this:

" ‘at what point is the speed sacrifice worth it? Anything less than -10? Less than -15?"

And for that, there's definitely no categorical answer. For 2 reasons:

1. Each character is different, and the loss of speed (for something else) is more or less vital.

2. Depending on how good the other stats on this mod are, how much speed are you willing to give up?

Characters fall into 3 categories:

1. Speed is vital.
2. Speed is very beneficial, but not vital.
3. Speed isn't necessary at all.

There's probably a 4th set (speed is detrimental), but that would be line up specific.

So category 1 & 3 are fairly easy to mod arrows for. It's category 2 that you need to make a case by case decision; depending on how vital/good other stats are on the mod compared to the speed you're losing.

Very very 'case by case'

Oof, I focussed on this mod rather than your question about a guideline.

But in general I toss mods with less than +10 speed. Even for TM jumpers, speed isn't bad to have. It's just de-emphasized because of the kit.

I would do the same with arrows. Instead of making a hard/fast rule about which ones to toss, it's better to make a rule that follows a spectrum about which characters to put such a mod on.

Counter-attackers can take lower speed, but you can't count on them being hit, so I would happily put a +22 speed (or more) secondary / Offense primary on a counterattacker, but I'd be less happy with +12.

Extreme TM jumpers like Imperial Troopers under Veers can take the lowest speed you have, as long as you have one fast toon to get the TM train rolling.

Slightly less extreme TM jumpers that still have a ton of TM jumping (Resistance Trooper, Resistance Pilot, Geonosian Spy, Geo Soldier, Rebel Fighters under MM, etc.) drop those +12-+16 speed arrows on.

Assisters get the middle ground (+16 - +24), usually, because you get to control when they attack out of turn, rather than the enemy controlling that in the way that they might be able to do with counterattackers.

But yeah, read the kits. I **usually** (not always) throw out mods with less than +10 speed even if they've got a little bit of promise elsewhere, but you don't have to. With some kits speed is bad or at the very least needs to be somewhat reduced (think Droideka which gets bonus damage based on relative difference in speed between DDK and the target, also JKL if you use his lead).

But with other kits speed isn't bad, it's just not nearly as helpful as other things. So whatever is your minimum standard for mods, just keep the same minimum for arrows and make the question not about "How much speed can I lose?" but about "How much is speed prioritized or de-emphasized by aspects of the character's kit?" Find their place on the spectrum and assign non-speed arrows accordingly.

In my opinion there's not a one size fits all answer. Very few characters benefit from losing speed, but there are a couple of corner cases where you might prefer it. It really just comes down to how valuable the primary is to the particular character.

E.g. I have seen plenty GG with a health primary arrow over speed since its of benefit to his DPS. In that case, health primary with a good speed secondary is probably not an awful tradeoff.

In 99% of cases the gain at the expense of speed loss is probably not worth it though. Keep the mod though, 20 speed secondary is still nice.

Yeah, toon-dependent. Tanks who still need some speed, toons where health is more important, etc

I don't know... I really think the way people talk about this doesn't really do justice to other stats. Characters that immediately come to mind for no speed primary arrow:
GAS - protection
Jolee - possibly CA
B2 - CA or protection
Magnaguard CA or protection
GMY depending how you use, offense
Holdo CA
R2D2 speed health offense or protection, use dependent and what mods you have available
GK just wants a great tank build

If you have a 20+ speed offense arrow, you should probably be using that somewhere like on Droideka. Almost all 20+ speed secondary arrows except defense primary now could theoretically have a use in a particular build. This really depends on your mod depth though.

It's not like it would make sense to put a 25 speed offense primary arrow on a toon with a main speed set averaging 15 speed per mod....

Also, if you have 20 speed secondary arrows with great synergy, consider calibrating

Characters that do their damage from assisting are maybes.

Tanks that counter-attack are strong characters for such a mod.

Characters that take turns b/c of TM jumping instead of racking up speed the normal way are also strong characters for such a mod, if they benefit from health.

So... think about General Grievous. His kit is entirely based around health (ironic, as a cyborg, but there you go) AND he gets bonus turns when his allies are killed And on top of that, you want him to take fewer turns than your B1s until you start getting bonus turns, so at the beginning (before he's gotten his stats to ramp up) a slower GG is good.

Now, it's not absolutely perfect for GG. There's still the Defence set bonus, of course, but it's still a decent mod for him.

I'd put it on a tank who has TM jumping, myself, and look for a Health Set/Health Primary mod for Grievous.

But in general, **most** characters that get TM jumps benefit more from some other primary than speed. (But of course whether or not you get bonus TM often depends on your leader, so you can mod that way, but be aware that if you put them under another leader and they lose TM jumping from that the lack of speed might be a disadvantage there.)

This particular mod, since it's not all one thing or all the other (meaning it's got both Defense and Health in two key locations instead of having both the same) should be put on a tank that gains TM jumping rather than on someone with special kit features that emphasize health.

Finn is a decent choice, but not a perfect one. I think the best choice for this mod is 9th Sister (the Inquisitor) with Royal Guard being a good 2nd.

Reading MasterSeedy's posts, reminded me of something I meant to write. 'How likely are you to promote one of these non speed primary mods to ever know?'.

It could be that a non speed primary arrow will turn out god tier. However, unless it's already hit just the spot you wanted (double health for example) before, you're unlikely to 6 dot it, to ever find out.

So.........in the long run, speed's probably still going to be king; bar the few double protection/health/potency/tenacity mods you save, if you have the room.