zKylo vs zSavage

"NicolBolas;994332" wrote:

"Indominable_J;994313" wrote:

"Iron_Maiden_Jedi;994295" wrote:
You're wasting your zMaul lead potential if you keep too many non-sith in your team. So... definitely zSavage.

You want at least one non-sith under zMaul, because if all your sith are stealthed, that part of the lead loses meaning. zKylo is a great option for that position, because it forces people to target him, which helps boost his damage from the get-go.

Not if you run sith trooper

If you run Trooper vs. other DN / EP / zDM squads he's useless for much of the match as he's slow as dirt and is shocked and dispelled for long periods of the match - so he can't taunt and doesn't take many turns.

"Indominable_J;994402" wrote:

"NicolBolas;994332" wrote:

"Indominable_J;994313" wrote:

"Iron_Maiden_Jedi;994295" wrote:
You're wasting your zMaul lead potential if you keep too many non-sith in your team. So... definitely zSavage.

You want at least one non-sith under zMaul, because if all your sith are stealthed, that part of the lead loses meaning. zKylo is a great option for that position, because it forces people to target him, which helps boost his damage from the get-go.

Not if you run sith trooper

I love when people run Sith Trooper.

What are the teams you face that have Sith Trooper in it?

"JohnnySteelAlpha;994424" wrote:

"NicolBolas;994332" wrote:

"Indominable_J;994313" wrote:

"Iron_Maiden_Jedi;994295" wrote:
You're wasting your zMaul lead potential if you keep too many non-sith in your team. So... definitely zSavage.

You want at least one non-sith under zMaul, because if all your sith are stealthed, that part of the lead loses meaning. zKylo is a great option for that position, because it forces people to target him, which helps boost his damage from the get-go.

Not if you run sith trooper

If you run Trooper vs. other DN / EP / zDM squads he's useless for much of the match as he's slow as dirt and is shocked and dispelled for long periods of the match - so he can't taunt and doesn't take many turns.

Not with a zeta Savage constantly cleansing.

The AI doesn't use Zylo right.
I'm thinking about Zavage also but I don't like the dodge meta and don't want to run Zaul.
Maybe some of you guys can answer this..... ???
Is Zavage really ONLY good under Zaul? Has anybody tried him under Palp, Zader, or even his own lead?
(I'm currently running Rex lead)

"slickdealer;994446" wrote:

"JohnnySteelAlpha;994424" wrote:

"NicolBolas;994332" wrote:

"Indominable_J;994313" wrote:

"Iron_Maiden_Jedi;994295" wrote:
You're wasting your zMaul lead potential if you keep too many non-sith in your team. So... definitely zSavage.

You want at least one non-sith under zMaul, because if all your sith are stealthed, that part of the lead loses meaning. zKylo is a great option for that position, because it forces people to target him, which helps boost his damage from the get-go.

Not if you run sith trooper

If you run Trooper vs. other DN / EP / zDM squads he's useless for much of the match as he's slow as dirt and is shocked and dispelled for long periods of the match - so he can't taunt and doesn't take many turns.

Not with a zeta Savage constantly cleansing.

That's RNG and not reliable - he can cleanse any 3 of other Sith that have debuffs on them. Could easily take him 3 turns to actually cleanse trooper. It's also possible, if debuffs keep being applied on other Sith, that trooper is never chosen to get cleansed. Trooper is deadly if you have GK in there as well for taunt spam and the second cleanser (with zSO). Otherwise you will have matches where trooper does absolutely nothing due to shock / dispel vs. EP / DN. He does improve with zSO, but it's still not reliable. I have a G11 trooper with well over 80k total health / prot and when he can taunt he's great, but I've also seen too many stretches where he's pinned down and does ABSOLUTELY nothing for the squad but stand there while all the action is going on.

"NicolBolas;994432" wrote:

"Indominable_J;994402" wrote:

"NicolBolas;994332" wrote:

"Indominable_J;994313" wrote:

"Iron_Maiden_Jedi;994295" wrote:
You're wasting your zMaul lead potential if you keep too many non-sith in your team. So... definitely zSavage.

You want at least one non-sith under zMaul, because if all your sith are stealthed, that part of the lead loses meaning. zKylo is a great option for that position, because it forces people to target him, which helps boost his damage from the get-go.

Not if you run sith trooper

I love when people run Sith Trooper.

What are the teams you face that have Sith Trooper in it?

A variety of zMaul teams. Maul, Sid, Palp, Vader, ST. Maul, Sid, Palp, DN, ST. Maul, Palp, DN, SA, ST. Those are a few of the comps I remember.

"JohnnySteelAlpha;994462" wrote:

"slickdealer;994446" wrote:

"JohnnySteelAlpha;994424" wrote:

"NicolBolas;994332" wrote:

"Indominable_J;994313" wrote:

"Iron_Maiden_Jedi;994295" wrote:
You're wasting your zMaul lead potential if you keep too many non-sith in your team. So... definitely zSavage.

You want at least one non-sith under zMaul, because if all your sith are stealthed, that part of the lead loses meaning. zKylo is a great option for that position, because it forces people to target him, which helps boost his damage from the get-go.

Not if you run sith trooper

If you run Trooper vs. other DN / EP / zDM squads he's useless for much of the match as he's slow as dirt and is shocked and dispelled for long periods of the match - so he can't taunt and doesn't take many turns.

Not with a zeta Savage constantly cleansing.

That's RNG and not reliable - he can cleanse any 3 of other Sith that have debuffs on them. Could easily take him 3 turns to actually cleanse trooper. It's also possible, if debuffs keep being applied on other Sith, that trooper is never chosen to get cleansed. Trooper is deadly if you have GK in there as well for taunt spam and the second cleanser (with zSO). Otherwise you will have matches where trooper does absolutely nothing due to shock / dispel vs. EP / DN. He does improve with zSO, but it's still not reliable. I have a G11 trooper with well over 80k total health / prot and when he can taunt he's great, but I've also seen too many stretches where he's pinned down and does ABSOLUTELY nothing for the squad but stand there while all the action is going on.

That also depends on the speed of your team. If you run a fast enough SA/Sid, which is what I do, trooper taunts right off the bat. A lot of zaul teams don't run dispel aside from DN, but you will have to weight the benefits of using DN's basic as opposed to his force drain as a first move to dispel. I agree that he's useless once shock lands on him and savage doesn't dispel, but he does help a lot with the early game which is important on zaul vs. zaul. Trooper also deals with tanky teams like Rex/Zarris/Chaze/GK that don't run a ton of debuffs.

As for OP, I have tried Zavage under a Rex lead and he's no good.

"NicolBolas;994479" wrote:

"JohnnySteelAlpha;994462" wrote:

"slickdealer;994446" wrote:

"JohnnySteelAlpha;994424" wrote:

"NicolBolas;994332" wrote:

"Indominable_J;994313" wrote:

"Iron_Maiden_Jedi;994295" wrote:
You're wasting your zMaul lead potential if you keep too many non-sith in your team. So... definitely zSavage.

You want at least one non-sith under zMaul, because if all your sith are stealthed, that part of the lead loses meaning. zKylo is a great option for that position, because it forces people to target him, which helps boost his damage from the get-go.

Not if you run sith trooper

If you run Trooper vs. other DN / EP / zDM squads he's useless for much of the match as he's slow as dirt and is shocked and dispelled for long periods of the match - so he can't taunt and doesn't take many turns.

Not with a zeta Savage constantly cleansing.

That's RNG and not reliable - he can cleanse any 3 of other Sith that have debuffs on them. Could easily take him 3 turns to actually cleanse trooper. It's also possible, if debuffs keep being applied on other Sith, that trooper is never chosen to get cleansed. Trooper is deadly if you have GK in there as well for taunt spam and the second cleanser (with zSO). Otherwise you will have matches where trooper does absolutely nothing due to shock / dispel vs. EP / DN. He does improve with zSO, but it's still not reliable. I have a G11 trooper with well over 80k total health / prot and when he can taunt he's great, but I've also seen too many stretches where he's pinned down and does ABSOLUTELY nothing for the squad but stand there while all the action is going on.

That also depends on the speed of your team. If you run a fast enough SA/Sid, which is what I do, trooper taunts right off the bat. A lot of zaul teams don't run dispel aside from DN, but you will have to weight the benefits of using DN's basic as opposed to his force drain as a first move to dispel. I agree that he's useless once shock lands on him and savage doesn't dispel, but he does help a lot with the early game which is important on zaul vs. zaul. Trooper also deals with tanky teams like Rex/Zarris/Chaze/GK that don't run a ton of debuffs.

As for OP, I have tried Zavage under a Rex lead and he's no good.

Yeah I have a fast SA and my trooper gets his taunt up asap, and my DN does yank the CD of the enemy in rd 1 - but then that's kind of worst case scenario for trooper because EP / DN AI have to use their basics on him and right away he's shocked / dispelled. Now if SO doesn't cleanse he's just standing there the whole match. I've just found zKylo better because he can stun and drop bombs on offense and he's a consistent taunter. So I get offense and protection from him.

@ZalandasG - I think zSO is the way to go for Sith - but really look to get SA and DN up to speed. You'll need them and also Dooku vs. the Rex / 3x cleanse teams. Dooku under a DN lead is unstoppable. zSO is good in a DN lead or in a zDM lead - those are two different types of squads vs. different opponents. I would though plan on using a zeta on Kylo next. He's really an unstoppable force in arena with his zeta. He's also more diverse in his usage than zSO. This really is a good choice to make here because you really can't make a wrong call on this one. Both are outstanding in a Sith-based team.

Wouldn't forcing the enemy EP to use shock on trooper be the best case scenario? That way Savage only has one target he can pull debuffs from as opposed to EP stunning everyone?

zSavage is good with palpy lead too.