Forum Discussion
366 Replies
- @ArcherDK
Lol ahaha! OOTW could be a parody of B2W! :joy:
Thank you. The themes are dear to me, and I’m glad you see my writing about them positively. :smile:
I’m so sorry this is so long!!! :confounded:
I’m so curious about this Mary-sue! :lol: I believe we might have a different definition to what a Mary Sue is so I went ahead and read up more about this archetype and apparently it is used in such a wide context that it’s made me extra confused! So I’m going to link to the definition of Mary sue I found that I’m going to analyse from. All about Mary SueSpoiler
If we share this definition of a ‘mary sue’, I think Athena would best fit another Archetype. To the points:
1.Based on the author - Naturally. All my characters (even males) have bits of pieces of me. I need a character that is believable and real. But she is also based off traits from people around me.
2.No flaws - Contrarily, Athena is a very flawed character. Will detail in point 5.
3.Everyone reacts wonderfully to her - No. Not everyone. And if you refer to the reaction of her schoolmates during the basketball scene, it is simply the superficiality that comes with fame. You’ll see.
4.Boy magnet - No. NO. NO! If she were to be caught up in some drama involving more than 1 men, I will do my best to make it realistic and not plucked out of thin air. (Kian would fit this point instead)
5.No growth, no change - I think you’ve noticed too that Athena is a dynamic character. Her character in Ch 1-5 is vastly different from Ch7-9 - the catalyst being Ch 6. As you continue reading, you’ll find her developing in response to how she interacts with the people/environment. Current update would show her character shifting once again. There will be another moment too that you’re fast approaching.
Athena’s traits in Ch 7-9 is to me, typical teenage angst. Additionally she’s in the early stages of discarding her emotionally repressed nature, so she hasn’t found the critical balance between assertion and arrogance. The grim saying “I don’t remember such candor from you” can imply either assertion (she’s gaining confidence) or arrogance. (she’s gaining too much :lol: )
The thing about the above is, both are plausible. In Ch 6 I intended the happy airy schooling experience to make Athena come out of her shell and show her that she CAN and SHOULD let go and behave like a normal teenager. She did as you can see, but whether the superficial acceptance had inflated her ego, I left it up to the reader’s interpretation. :smile:
And there will be more magic in the later chapters! And they will meld together into the plot so don’t worry! You’re still at the part where she’s still distrustful and keeps her identity a secret from the world. But once she trusts, it will pour into the plot! :smiley:
What happened to her is horrible yes, but I cannot agree with you that she brought it upon herself. I always revert back to these questions. If a woman walks around topless, is she asking to be assaulted? I answer a hearty no. If a person gets drunk and is taken advantage of, did they bring it upon themselves? Still a no. When Athena makes the wrongest of all decisions due to an inflated sense of security against the world, did she bring it upon herself? I have to say no too. The thing about this is we tend to forgive those who are physically vulnerable (i.e. being drunk) or handicapped, but we are harsh towards that we cannot see (mental health issues and especially, error of judgement). Athena has made the worst kind of error here. - @candycottonchu
Oooh! I must be halfway typing because I only saw your reply after I hit send.
Ah you’re right! I should make an additional information note like how you did with languages. That was so helpful. Ok you activated my nerd moment :joy: so let me explain some things about martial arts.
Me rambling :sweat_smile:
Suplex = you use your body weight and gravity to throw someone over your shoulder. They will land on their head. She will need to have hand, leg, core chest ALL muscles, gripping and throwing technique and also how to make sure she don’t bump her own head :lol: ! So she can’t do that for sure.
Balance is the key to any form of fighting. If you apprentice under a master, he will literally make you do the horse stance for three months without teaching you any techniques! I am serious. This is the horse stanceSpoiler
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d8/09/48/d80948fa798e5687c1f403bcf6280690.png
It doesn’t look nice at all :joy: But that is where the balance and energy comes from. If a person doesn’t master this, they will just look good, but no fighting value. :smile:
P.s. - ah.. now i feel very... sickly satisfied when looking at diego. >:) No mercy for him! - @mercuryfoam ah thanks for the explanation! I have no idea and never was too interested in fighting ? that picture is funny too hehe
- @candycottonchuSpoilerAnd I find it disgusting, despicable and condemnable that you saw something like that in my words. Perhaps it is YOU who enjoyed seeing her suffer, since you've been so quick to come to this conclusion? I've met people who survived such an experience. I've talked to them. This is most vile crime one could commit. Capital offence. If it were up to me, those men would burn for millennia. If you think that I enjoyed Athena suffering - you disgust me. Begone from my sight. I have nothing more to say to you.
@mercuryfoamSpoilerLike I've said, nothing I say is a complete and absolute truth. If I'm wrong then I'm wrong. And like I said, I do not understate the significance of Athena's horrible experience. She didn't deserve it. But she didn't have to interfere. She didn't have to go there. My point is that grim told her to stand still. He definitely knows much and she explicitly asks him to be her mentor. Everyone makes mistakes, but she was the one to set the events into motion. Just like your example with drunk - nobody forced them to drink, no?
Look, I get it. I really do. I've met and talked to victims of this terrible experience. The problem is that in THIS case Athena had someone telling her AGAIN and AGAIN to do NOTHING, yes she's chosen to act.
I know that I look like a demented piece of llamas droppings, but like you've said in your work - it is fiction. I'm talking about fiction. I would never say anything like that about a real person. I'm not that heartless. We can all agree that Athena suffered something so horrible that no one deserves this fate. Not even a pile of pixels on a rig. - I think we should just leave it be. No one is right in this topic. We should all be grateful that we're discussing fictional character.
"candycottonchu;c-17521732" wrote:
@ArcherDKSpoilerI find the glee with which you apparently enjoy Athena's horrible experience disturbing. Yes, she is arrogant, maybe even self-righteous, sometimes ungrateful. But she's just a random teen girl, and even if she was much worse than she is, and saying she deserved it... I have no words for that.
If I misunderstood, my apologies.
Interesting how the way we all perceive Athena's character differs. I never saw her as arrogant. I'd think her tendency to throw herself head first into these situations stems from the sense of invulnerability most teenagers posses. From their belief they can change the world if they put their mind into it. That is not arrogance. That is thinking of a person who hasn't been exposed to the harsh truths of life and death. But then again Athena was there when her father died. She should be more aware of the risks. Maybe it's her optimistic personality that always has upper hand, her belief that everyone and everything is salvageable what urges her to act in those hopeless situations. And only something as horrible as what happened to her can change that. I think her effort to change everything for the better is admirable. Maybe Athena subconsciously knows that the only thing necessary for the evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing, and she refuses to stand idly by.- @Maladi777SpoilerA sense of invulnerability after getting bat to the back of her skull. Yep, no arrogance whatsoever. After standing near a very real personification of DEATH and STILL trying to pull her weight. No! Not arrogant! After encountering a very real organized crime syndicate. Nope! No arrogance whatsoever!
"ArcherDK;c-17521860" wrote:
@Maladi777SpoilerA sense of invulnerability after getting bat to the back of her skull. Yep, no arrogance whatsoever. After standing near a very real personification of DEATH and STILL trying to pull her weight. No! Not arrogant! After encountering a very real organized crime syndicate. Nope! No arrogance whatsoever!
I believe you may have a few terms and their definitions mixed up. Arrogance suggests a person who is full of self-worth and unpleasantly proud. I don't see Athena as such. Stubborn and impulsive? Yes. Arrogant? No.- @Maladi777SpoilerSo you're trying to say that ignoring advice of people who definitely know more than Athena is not a display of arrogance? She assumes that they're wrong and she is right. Otherwise she would listen. Sounds pretty arrogant to me. Arrogant AND stubborn. List just keeps getting bigger! With that said, it is a round-about way of looking at it.
"ArcherDK;c-17521895" wrote:
@Maladi777SpoilerSo you're trying to say that ignoring advice of people who definitely know more than Athena is not a display of arrogance? She assumes that they're wrong and she is right. Otherwise she would listen. Sounds pretty arrogant to me. Arrogant AND stubborn. List just keeps getting bigger! With that said, it is a round-about way of looking at it.
Oh yes. That's exactly what I'm trying to say. Children often don't listen to their parents' advice either. Would you call a child arrogant? Athena has closer to a child than she has to an arrogant person who holds other people in contempt. She's been proving it the whole time. She cares about others to a fault.
