Forum Discussion
- MidnightAura86New Spectator
"Writin_Reg;c-16240471" wrote:
"MidnightAura;c-16240302" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240107" wrote:
"simgirl1010;c-16239723" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16239685" wrote:
@rudy8292 Missed your post (was typing while you posted), lol, yeah, we’re kidding about it but I must admit if anything it actually makes me angry. Leaving essential things out and then acting like simmers should be greatful? I realize not everything in predecessors is automatically in a successor, I don’t even expect that, but toddlers, pools, ghosts, family tree? And then selling it as a generous gesture those things were added later and for free? I even think that’s kind of rude.
@MidnightAura Yes, by Grant and also by Rachel Franklin. It’s just not professional. You can say “we’ve tried to improve this”, but you’re just not going to downplay your previous work. It’s beyond me why anyone in any business would consider that a good idea. I know I’d really get in trouble at work if I’d do something like that and I work in a non profit organisation. And above all, it’s so not true that it makes things even sadder. Hoping nobody would notice, lol, yeah, well, you won’t get away with that with us hardcore casual players :p Maybe the ‘real gamers’ will buy it.
So what exactly do you think will be the fallout from those comments? How are they "not going to get away with it?"
That nobody would notice (my comment was a reaction to that assumption). I think non simmers may not notice and believe it blindly (hey, if an expert says so), but simmers - their cursomers - do. I’ve had a feeling before by the way Grant isn’t a simmer himself, often doesn’t know what he’s talking about and doesn’t get at all what it’s about. I truely think this is just his job, but that from a gamer’s perspective his interests lie elsewhere. That’s bad because as a result (he’s not the only one, Rachel Franklin didn’t get it either) they’ve turned this franchise into something many simmers don’t want and though others do, I see them expressing criticism that in my opinion is very justified (like the thread about instructions falling out of queue, and the lack of options, openness and customizability).
I think that is a huge problem with the sims 4. The people making it don't play it. Or at best don't play it a lot. Watch a live stream and its obvious by the amount of information that is given out that is not correct. For example in one of the recent live streams one of the guru's said teens can't live on their own. But they can because they themselves gave us that option. Very weird thing to state with such confidence that teens can't live on their own. You think they would know that. Perhaps it was a mistake and people are only human but its a weird thing to not know about your own game.
My husband works in game development. When he is working on a project he eat, sleeps and breathes it and he can tell you all kinds of weird and random facts about it. But then he plays the games he develops even if he left the company tomorrow he would continue to play the games.
Colossal Order who make Cities Skylines are another example. Their developers play their games and it shows. They have a passion for their games and they actually listen to and engage with their players in a very open way which I love. If they made a sims game I would be in heaven!
The sims 4 on the other hand like you say has went a different road from the previous games and as much as it likes to be denied by some there is no doubt a lot of players are not impressed with this offering. When I play the Sims 2 its so obvious how much love was put into this game, the amount of detail is astounding. It did continue in sims 3 but not in quite the same way but again the amount of gameplay and little details we got are amazing. Now look at the sims 4, cut out so many little details and vital game play and instead we get a half baked version of previous features. Look at the elevators, look at the boat for travel. Actually scratch that I refuse to call the boat a form of transport when the reality is its a cut screen the second your sims get halfway to it. Not to mention the tone had changed. The creativity has gone and its more "play our way or the high way"
Oddly Grant also worked on Sims 2 and in fact used to be one of the more popular devs. LOL.
It wasn’t as a producer though so not in the same capacity as he is now and for the sims 3. I didn’t know he had anything to do with the sims 2 and when I check the credits in the game itself the only thing I can see he is credited for is a “special thanks to...” for the sims 2 apartment life which doesn’t indicate their role or contribution. I don’t care for popularity per se, although I am continuously surprised at remarks he makes in interviews that seem to insult the players intelligence not to mention live streams he doesn’t do himself any favours. "MidnightAura;c-16240652" wrote:
"Writin_Reg;c-16240471" wrote:
"MidnightAura;c-16240302" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240107" wrote:
"simgirl1010;c-16239723" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16239685" wrote:
@rudy8292 Missed your post (was typing while you posted), lol, yeah, we’re kidding about it but I must admit if anything it actually makes me angry. Leaving essential things out and then acting like simmers should be greatful? I realize not everything in predecessors is automatically in a successor, I don’t even expect that, but toddlers, pools, ghosts, family tree? And then selling it as a generous gesture those things were added later and for free? I even think that’s kind of rude.
@MidnightAura Yes, by Grant and also by Rachel Franklin. It’s just not professional. You can say “we’ve tried to improve this”, but you’re just not going to downplay your previous work. It’s beyond me why anyone in any business would consider that a good idea. I know I’d really get in trouble at work if I’d do something like that and I work in a non profit organisation. And above all, it’s so not true that it makes things even sadder. Hoping nobody would notice, lol, yeah, well, you won’t get away with that with us hardcore casual players :p Maybe the ‘real gamers’ will buy it.
So what exactly do you think will be the fallout from those comments? How are they "not going to get away with it?"
That nobody would notice (my comment was a reaction to that assumption). I think non simmers may not notice and believe it blindly (hey, if an expert says so), but simmers - their cursomers - do. I’ve had a feeling before by the way Grant isn’t a simmer himself, often doesn’t know what he’s talking about and doesn’t get at all what it’s about. I truely think this is just his job, but that from a gamer’s perspective his interests lie elsewhere. That’s bad because as a result (he’s not the only one, Rachel Franklin didn’t get it either) they’ve turned this franchise into something many simmers don’t want and though others do, I see them expressing criticism that in my opinion is very justified (like the thread about instructions falling out of queue, and the lack of options, openness and customizability).
I think that is a huge problem with the sims 4. The people making it don't play it. Or at best don't play it a lot. Watch a live stream and its obvious by the amount of information that is given out that is not correct. For example in one of the recent live streams one of the guru's said teens can't live on their own. But they can because they themselves gave us that option. Very weird thing to state with such confidence that teens can't live on their own. You think they would know that. Perhaps it was a mistake and people are only human but its a weird thing to not know about your own game.
My husband works in game development. When he is working on a project he eat, sleeps and breathes it and he can tell you all kinds of weird and random facts about it. But then he plays the games he develops even if he left the company tomorrow he would continue to play the games.
Colossal Order who make Cities Skylines are another example. Their developers play their games and it shows. They have a passion for their games and they actually listen to and engage with their players in a very open way which I love. If they made a sims game I would be in heaven!
The sims 4 on the other hand like you say has went a different road from the previous games and as much as it likes to be denied by some there is no doubt a lot of players are not impressed with this offering. When I play the Sims 2 its so obvious how much love was put into this game, the amount of detail is astounding. It did continue in sims 3 but not in quite the same way but again the amount of gameplay and little details we got are amazing. Now look at the sims 4, cut out so many little details and vital game play and instead we get a half baked version of previous features. Look at the elevators, look at the boat for travel. Actually scratch that I refuse to call the boat a form of transport when the reality is its a cut screen the second your sims get halfway to it. Not to mention the tone had changed. The creativity has gone and its more "play our way or the high way"
Oddly Grant also worked on Sims 2 and in fact used to be one of the more popular devs. LOL.
It wasn’t as a producer though so not in the same capacity as he is now and for the sims 3. I didn’t know he had anything to do with the sims 2 and when I check the credits in the game itself the only thing I can see he is credited for is a “special thanks to...” for the sims 2 apartment life which doesn’t indicate their role or contribution. I don’t care for popularity per se, although I am continuously surprised at remarks he makes in interviews that seem to insult the players intelligence not to mention live streams he doesn’t do himself any favours.
Actually it was Associate Producer and Game Designer for Sims 2 and 3 - and Lead Producer for Sims 4. Well after seeing him in live plays, E3;s, and Gamescom for the last 12 plus years - I guess I am just used to it, because I have never felt insulted by anything he says myself. It's just Grant being his quirky self. LOL. I even find him funny at times. He was real funny in some of the earlier Sims games he worked on - often quite animated. LOL."catloverplayer;c-16239491" wrote:
I don't know. I think they learned from the TS4 Olympas Online that people didn't want it so they had to make it single player. I think that Sims 5 will be created as a single player mode game.
I hope so. I don't want other people's safe games ruining my deviant Simmer experience. I know I play differently from others and would like to have my save files remain my save files and not someone else's saves. I know I would have hated if the Sims 4 had remained an online experience and I wouldn't have purchased it. One thing I'm thankful about the SimCity fiasco preventing that from happening. Plus if Simmers can't get along in forums, imagine the fights that will happen in an online game. It would kill the game in a heartbeat. I prefer in playing in my own dystopian Sims games that others can't alter with their versions of "Utopia" with my stories. I prefer having my stories remain my stories.- MidnightAura86New Spectator
"Writin_Reg;c-16241370" wrote:
"MidnightAura;c-16240652" wrote:
"Writin_Reg;c-16240471" wrote:
"MidnightAura;c-16240302" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240107" wrote:
"simgirl1010;c-16239723" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16239685" wrote:
@rudy8292 Missed your post (was typing while you posted), lol, yeah, we’re kidding about it but I must admit if anything it actually makes me angry. Leaving essential things out and then acting like simmers should be greatful? I realize not everything in predecessors is automatically in a successor, I don’t even expect that, but toddlers, pools, ghosts, family tree? And then selling it as a generous gesture those things were added later and for free? I even think that’s kind of rude.
@MidnightAura Yes, by Grant and also by Rachel Franklin. It’s just not professional. You can say “we’ve tried to improve this”, but you’re just not going to downplay your previous work. It’s beyond me why anyone in any business would consider that a good idea. I know I’d really get in trouble at work if I’d do something like that and I work in a non profit organisation. And above all, it’s so not true that it makes things even sadder. Hoping nobody would notice, lol, yeah, well, you won’t get away with that with us hardcore casual players :p Maybe the ‘real gamers’ will buy it.
So what exactly do you think will be the fallout from those comments? How are they "not going to get away with it?"
That nobody would notice (my comment was a reaction to that assumption). I think non simmers may not notice and believe it blindly (hey, if an expert says so), but simmers - their cursomers - do. I’ve had a feeling before by the way Grant isn’t a simmer himself, often doesn’t know what he’s talking about and doesn’t get at all what it’s about. I truely think this is just his job, but that from a gamer’s perspective his interests lie elsewhere. That’s bad because as a result (he’s not the only one, Rachel Franklin didn’t get it either) they’ve turned this franchise into something many simmers don’t want and though others do, I see them expressing criticism that in my opinion is very justified (like the thread about instructions falling out of queue, and the lack of options, openness and customizability).
I think that is a huge problem with the sims 4. The people making it don't play it. Or at best don't play it a lot. Watch a live stream and its obvious by the amount of information that is given out that is not correct. For example in one of the recent live streams one of the guru's said teens can't live on their own. But they can because they themselves gave us that option. Very weird thing to state with such confidence that teens can't live on their own. You think they would know that. Perhaps it was a mistake and people are only human but its a weird thing to not know about your own game.
My husband works in game development. When he is working on a project he eat, sleeps and breathes it and he can tell you all kinds of weird and random facts about it. But then he plays the games he develops even if he left the company tomorrow he would continue to play the games.
Colossal Order who make Cities Skylines are another example. Their developers play their games and it shows. They have a passion for their games and they actually listen to and engage with their players in a very open way which I love. If they made a sims game I would be in heaven!
The sims 4 on the other hand like you say has went a different road from the previous games and as much as it likes to be denied by some there is no doubt a lot of players are not impressed with this offering. When I play the Sims 2 its so obvious how much love was put into this game, the amount of detail is astounding. It did continue in sims 3 but not in quite the same way but again the amount of gameplay and little details we got are amazing. Now look at the sims 4, cut out so many little details and vital game play and instead we get a half baked version of previous features. Look at the elevators, look at the boat for travel. Actually scratch that I refuse to call the boat a form of transport when the reality is its a cut screen the second your sims get halfway to it. Not to mention the tone had changed. The creativity has gone and its more "play our way or the high way"
Oddly Grant also worked on Sims 2 and in fact used to be one of the more popular devs. LOL.
It wasn’t as a producer though so not in the same capacity as he is now and for the sims 3. I didn’t know he had anything to do with the sims 2 and when I check the credits in the game itself the only thing I can see he is credited for is a “special thanks to...” for the sims 2 apartment life which doesn’t indicate their role or contribution. I don’t care for popularity per se, although I am continuously surprised at remarks he makes in interviews that seem to insult the players intelligence not to mention live streams he doesn’t do himself any favours.
Actually it was Associate Producer and Game Designer for Sims 2 and 3 - and Lead Producer for Sims 4. Well after seeing him in live plays, E3;s, and Gamescom for the last 12 plus years - I guess I am just used to it, because I have never felt insulted by anything he says myself. It's just Grant being his quirky self. LOL. I even find him funny at times. He was real funny in some of the earlier Sims games he worked on - often quite animated. LOL.
Weird. He isn’t credited as that when I looked at the in game credits.
Amy Kalson is credited as the associate producer. http://imdb.com/title/tt0386040/fullcredits - MidnightAura86New Spectator
"Erpe;c-16241728" wrote:
Grant was an associate producer in EA. He left in 2010 but returned in 2011. What he does when he doesn’t work as a producer for EA you can see on https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgamedesigner/50231/grant-rodiek
That is correct and he is credited as such in all the sims 3 games and he was heavily involved with the series.
I don’t have any evidence going by the sims 2 credits he was in that position and had that much influence over the game the way he did with the more recent games.
mobygames.com/game/windows/sims-2-ultimate-collection/credits "MidnightAura;c-16241741" wrote:
"Erpe;c-16241728" wrote:
Grant was an associate producer in EA. He left in 2010 but returned in 2011. What he does when he doesn’t work as a producer for EA you can see on https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgamedesigner/50231/grant-rodiek
That is correct and he is credited as such in all the sims 3 games and he was heavily involved with the series.
I don’t have any evidence going by the sims 2 credits he was in that position and had that much influence over the game the way he did with the more recent games.
http://mobygames.com/game/windows/sims-2-ultimate-collection/credits
Your link doesn’t work. But you are right that Grant doesn’t seem to have been one of the producers for TS2. Also his preferred game type seems to be board games and not the Sims games.
Anyway most simmers seem to think that the producers have much more influence than they actually have. An associate producer’s main task seems instead just to be to manage a small part of the game, make sure that it progresses according to plans and that its development suits the other parts of the game. But they have other tasks too. See https://www.sokanu.com/careers/video-game-producer/- MidnightAura86New Spectator
"Erpe;c-16241760" wrote:
"MidnightAura;c-16241741" wrote:
"Erpe;c-16241728" wrote:
Grant was an associate producer in EA. He left in 2010 but returned in 2011. What he does when he doesn’t work as a producer for EA you can see on https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgamedesigner/50231/grant-rodiek
That is correct and he is credited as such in all the sims 3 games and he was heavily involved with the series.
I don’t have any evidence going by the sims 2 credits he was in that position and had that much influence over the game the way he did with the more recent games.
http://mobygames.com/game/windows/sims-2-ultimate-collection/credits
Your link doesn’t work. But you are right that Grant doesn’t seem to have been one of the producers for TS2. Also his preferred game type seems to be board games and not the Sims games.
Anyway most simmers seem to think that the producers have much more influence than they actually have. An associate producer’s main task seems instead just to be to manage a small part of the game, make sure that it progresses according to plans and that its development suits the other parts of the game. But they have other tasks too. See https://www.sokanu.com/careers/video-game-producer/
Fixed the link now. :) "MidnightAura;c-16240302" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240107" wrote:
"simgirl1010;c-16239723" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16239685" wrote:
@rudy8292 Missed your post (was typing while you posted), lol, yeah, we’re kidding about it but I must admit if anything it actually makes me angry. Leaving essential things out and then acting like simmers should be greatful? I realize not everything in predecessors is automatically in a successor, I don’t even expect that, but toddlers, pools, ghosts, family tree? And then selling it as a generous gesture those things were added later and for free? I even think that’s kind of rude.
@MidnightAura Yes, by Grant and also by Rachel Franklin. It’s just not professional. You can say “we’ve tried to improve this”, but you’re just not going to downplay your previous work. It’s beyond me why anyone in any business would consider that a good idea. I know I’d really get in trouble at work if I’d do something like that and I work in a non profit organisation. And above all, it’s so not true that it makes things even sadder. Hoping nobody would notice, lol, yeah, well, you won’t get away with that with us hardcore casual players :p Maybe the ‘real gamers’ will buy it.
So what exactly do you think will be the fallout from those comments? How are they "not going to get away with it?"
That nobody would notice (my comment was a reaction to that assumption). I think non simmers may not notice and believe it blindly (hey, if an expert says so), but simmers - their cursomers - do. I’ve had a feeling before by the way Grant isn’t a simmer himself, often doesn’t know what he’s talking about and doesn’t get at all what it’s about. I truely think this is just his job, but that from a gamer’s perspective his interests lie elsewhere. That’s bad because as a result (he’s not the only one, Rachel Franklin didn’t get it either) they’ve turned this franchise into something many simmers don’t want and though others do, I see them expressing criticism that in my opinion is very justified (like the thread about instructions falling out of queue, and the lack of options, openness and customizability).
I think that is a huge problem with the sims 4. The people making it don't play it. Or at best don't play it a lot. Watch a live stream and its obvious by the amount of information that is given out that is not correct. For example in one of the recent live streams one of the guru's said teens can't live on their own. But they can because they themselves gave us that option. Very weird thing to state with such confidence that teens can't live on their own. You think they would know that. Perhaps it was a mistake and people are only human but its a weird thing to not know about your own game.
My husband works in game development. When he is working on a project he eat, sleeps and breathes it and he can tell you all kinds of weird and random facts about it. But then he plays the games he develops even if he left the company tomorrow he would continue to play the games.
Colossal Order who make Cities Skylines are another example. Their developers play their games and it shows. They have a passion for their games and they actually listen to and engage with their players in a very open way which I love. If they made a sims game I would be in heaven!
The sims 4 on the other hand like you say has went a different road from the previous games and as much as it likes to be denied by some there is no doubt a lot of players are not impressed with this offering. When I play the Sims 2 its so obvious how much love was put into this game, the amount of detail is astounding. It did continue in sims 3 but not in quite the same way but again the amount of gameplay and little details we got are amazing. Now look at the sims 4, cut out so many little details and vital game play and instead we get a half baked version of previous features. Look at the elevators, look at the boat for travel. Actually scratch that I refuse to call the boat a form of transport when the reality is its a cut screen the second your sims get halfway to it. Not to mention the tone had changed. The creativity has gone and its more "play our way or the high way"
Exactly! Everything you say here. I remember when Sims 3 was still running there was some sort of a 'peek' what developers loved doing in the game, mind you, referring to Sims 3. And one guru went on about removing the ladders in a pool being favourite. I felt very disconnected at that moment *rolleye* Because it became quite clear he or she hadn't touched the game for years (and maybe never, maybe they were just echoing a popular thing among simmers)."Erpe;c-16240425" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240287" wrote:
"Erpe;c-16240176" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240153" wrote:
"Erpe;c-16240134" wrote:
"TheHavocado;c-16240016" wrote:
Well if anything, The Sims 5 should be the new era Sims 2 or a lot of people are going to be dissapointed, especially if they did the lackluster release day again. The Sims 4 Ratings shot down faster than an F-15 during it's first week release, especially when (according to wiki) you consider the fact that "...This was the most successful PC game launch the company had ever had to date".
The Sims games have always had low ratings in the reviews and among other gamers who never have understood why this game got high sales numbers at all when it in their eyes isn’t even a real game but more like a toy for mainly young girls (or a virtual dollhouse).
EA also clearly hadn’t expected TS1 to become successful at all. Therefore the budget for TS1 was very low which meant that its game world became very small and its graphics looked very simple and outdated too. The reasons was that EA only expected a part of the SimCity gamers to buy it. But what EA hadn’t foreseen was that TS1 suddenly attracted millions of young girls who never had played a game before.
TS3 may have had the most successful launch (most copies sold on its release day). But TS1 still sold almost twice as many copies. So TS1 must clearly be the most successful game that EA ever launched.
The high sales numbers for TS3 on day one was caused by the open seamless world. But EA can’t ever get a similar success just by advertising the next Sims game as ”The return of the open world” anyway because the simmers who loved it then most likely will just stay with TS3 instead. So EA needs something new to use in the advertising instead. Maybe it will be something about ”the option to play and cooperate with your friends in the game”.
Why on earth should I continue playing Sims 3 when there would be a new great Sims game with new content and improvements and open world? I’d jump over to that new game immediately. It’s not open world (or CASt) that keeps me playing Sims 3. It’s the lack of a better alternative. I’ve tried the alternative and then returned. There was only one reason for that: while Sims 4 made me constantly go ‘what shal I do now..., oh what shall I do next’, then closing the game after two hours tops, my Sims 3 game sort of plays itself and I only quit because I have to go to bed. If they’d deliver a new game that does that, open world or not, Sims 3 could retire.
I didn’t write that to you and you seem to have misunderstood me.
The reason that I don’t play TS4 isn’t about the missing open world either and we seem to agree about what is wrong with TS4. That wasn’t my point.
But if TS5 is marketed as “a new Sims game similar to Sims 3 and with the open world returning” then it will get low sales numbers and especially if the EPs are just repetions too. Not because you won’t buy it because I am sure that you actually would :) But because most young teens would reject the game. Partly because they won’t like an attempt from EA to revive an old game - and partly because they would have wanted something new instead and think that EA must have run out of ideas :)
For us here in the forum such things aren’t really so important because we are the hardcore fans who most likely will buy almost anything. But for new young simmers without much money and with a lot of other interests too in their lives things are different. They won’t just throw out their sparce money on a game that doesn’t seem to have anything new to offer to them.
I know you didn't directly adress me but regardless, the statement
"But EA can’t ever get a similar success just by advertising the next Sims game as ”The return of the open world” anyway because the simmers who loved it then most likely will just stay with TS3 instead. So EA needs something new to use in the advertising instead."
begged for a reaction, because any simmer who's playing Sims 3 right now will probably confirm what I said. It's your theory EA has to have a brand new selling point to be able to sell the game and heck, for all we know EA agrees with you and thinks so too. I don't agree with that theory though, I don't think that's how it works for simmers. As long as they give us an immersive game that allows us to play with little people in a creative way, we're happy. In fact one of Sims 4's most popular selling claims among fans was 'back to its roots'.
Your theory (and who knows EA's theory) denies the fact that a community and sharing is highly important for simmers. The TS3 section is great, with lovely/sweet people sharing both information and experiences, but we're also sharing history. There is the occasional "Did you know that..." - "No, I didn't! Wow, got to try that!" but for the rest we're all stuck in the past. It's a beautiful past, I love that past, but that doesn't mean I - or anyone else - wouldn't rather move on. Playing Sims 3 has become a shelter, a place to turn to in absence of something better. Suggesting people who play the old games (regardless the version) do so out of lack of a will to move on/adjust/change, means you're shortchanging them and don't understand what they're coming from and it even denies their actual issues in a way.
And that's us oldies. When they'll announce Sims 5 it will be like 2020 earliest. Those young teens you're referring to will be kids who never played Sims 3, nor know the game. Open world will be a brand new concept for them.
The reason why we see things differently is mainly that you concentrate on what the forum here thinks. But by doing this you completely ignore the fact that if only the forum (or even 10 times as many simmers) bought the game then EA wouldn’t be able to support the game anymore without losing hundreds of millions of dollars.
So what EA concentrates about is of course instead the about 6 million other simmers all over the world. Most of those simmers aren’t hardcore simmers at all but instead mostly young experimenting new simmers who just bought the game because they found something in the advertising interesting. They usually play much less then people here do and they only buy something if it looks interesting.
Those simmers are also the reason why EA now regularly releases new content in the free updates because the reason for this clearly is to get lost simmers back to playing the game (and hopefully also buy a little more expansions). EA surely doesn’t use money on such things just to be kind to the few hardcore simmers in this forum ;)
We can guess about the the release day of TS5 all we want. Simmers have always thought that the next Sims game was many years out in the future and become very surprised when EA announced it years before they expected. The reason of course is that simmers always want the current Sims game to be “complete” before EA moves on. But EA has never agreed with this idea and instead just announced the next big Sims game to avoid that sales numbers for new expansion become too low and then released the new game 15 months after the announcement. So I expect EA to announce TS5 in the middle of this year and then release it next year anyway. But you are welcome to believe that EA just will go on releasing 4 SPs, 2 GPs and an EP each year forever until new simmers will have to buy hundreds of such expansions just to get a “complete” Sims 4 game :)
No, I'm concentrating on what I, a Sims 3 player, think ;) You were speaking for a group of simmers you don't belong to (people who love and play Sims 3), filling in for them what they would do. I'm one of those players and I can assure you, you are mistaken with your analysis of us. And we may differ in our expectation of the release of the next title, I sure hope you are right and I am not."JoAnne65;c-16241861" wrote:
"MidnightAura;c-16240302" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240107" wrote:
"simgirl1010;c-16239723" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16239685" wrote:
@rudy8292 Missed your post (was typing while you posted), lol, yeah, we’re kidding about it but I must admit if anything it actually makes me angry. Leaving essential things out and then acting like simmers should be greatful? I realize not everything in predecessors is automatically in a successor, I don’t even expect that, but toddlers, pools, ghosts, family tree? And then selling it as a generous gesture those things were added later and for free? I even think that’s kind of rude.
@MidnightAura Yes, by Grant and also by Rachel Franklin. It’s just not professional. You can say “we’ve tried to improve this”, but you’re just not going to downplay your previous work. It’s beyond me why anyone in any business would consider that a good idea. I know I’d really get in trouble at work if I’d do something like that and I work in a non profit organisation. And above all, it’s so not true that it makes things even sadder. Hoping nobody would notice, lol, yeah, well, you won’t get away with that with us hardcore casual players :p Maybe the ‘real gamers’ will buy it.
So what exactly do you think will be the fallout from those comments? How are they "not going to get away with it?"
That nobody would notice (my comment was a reaction to that assumption). I think non simmers may not notice and believe it blindly (hey, if an expert says so), but simmers - their cursomers - do. I’ve had a feeling before by the way Grant isn’t a simmer himself, often doesn’t know what he’s talking about and doesn’t get at all what it’s about. I truely think this is just his job, but that from a gamer’s perspective his interests lie elsewhere. That’s bad because as a result (he’s not the only one, Rachel Franklin didn’t get it either) they’ve turned this franchise into something many simmers don’t want and though others do, I see them expressing criticism that in my opinion is very justified (like the thread about instructions falling out of queue, and the lack of options, openness and customizability).
I think that is a huge problem with the sims 4. The people making it don't play it. Or at best don't play it a lot. Watch a live stream and its obvious by the amount of information that is given out that is not correct. For example in one of the recent live streams one of the guru's said teens can't live on their own. But they can because they themselves gave us that option. Very weird thing to state with such confidence that teens can't live on their own. You think they would know that. Perhaps it was a mistake and people are only human but its a weird thing to not know about your own game.
My husband works in game development. When he is working on a project he eat, sleeps and breathes it and he can tell you all kinds of weird and random facts about it. But then he plays the games he develops even if he left the company tomorrow he would continue to play the games.
Colossal Order who make Cities Skylines are another example. Their developers play their games and it shows. They have a passion for their games and they actually listen to and engage with their players in a very open way which I love. If they made a sims game I would be in heaven!
The sims 4 on the other hand like you say has went a different road from the previous games and as much as it likes to be denied by some there is no doubt a lot of players are not impressed with this offering. When I play the Sims 2 its so obvious how much love was put into this game, the amount of detail is astounding. It did continue in sims 3 but not in quite the same way but again the amount of gameplay and little details we got are amazing. Now look at the sims 4, cut out so many little details and vital game play and instead we get a half baked version of previous features. Look at the elevators, look at the boat for travel. Actually scratch that I refuse to call the boat a form of transport when the reality is its a cut screen the second your sims get halfway to it. Not to mention the tone had changed. The creativity has gone and its more "play our way or the high way"
Exactly! Everything you say here. I remember when Sims 3 was still running there was some sort of a 'peek' what developers loved doing in the game, mind you, referring to Sims 3. And one guru went on about removing the ladders in a pool being favourite. I felt very disconnected at that moment *rolleye* Because it became quite clear he or she hadn't touched the game for years (and maybe never, maybe they were just echoing a popular thing among simmers).
People who go to work will almost always say that they love their work and especially if it is a job that requires some level of education. But very often they don’t mind to leave that job and do something very different anyway. So they say it mostly because people expect it and because their company likes it.
Game developers have different educations and do very different jobs. But most of them only work on a small part of the game and rarely know much about the rest of the game. The exception is the producers who coordinates the work of the other developers and especially the executive producer who is responsible for coordination the work of all the other producers where ordinary producers still only are responsible for a certain part of the game. But those producers of course also know something about the other parts of the game from meetings for producers where the executive producer attempt to coordinate their work.
But game developers aren’t educated just to make a certain type of game. Instead their education is general such that they can make all kinds of games and for all platforms. The reason of course is that nobody knows which type of game their future employer will tell them to make. So they just chose their education because they like to work with all kinds of games.
Therefore I personally don’t take it too serious when they talk about their “love” for the game they work on right now because they say it mostly just because their current game company expects it (and maybe have sent them to a certain conference just to talk about it) ;)
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