The Sims 4 Cottage Living Expansion Pack

"Amapola76;c-17914227" wrote:
I mean... I wouldn't personally want to work in sales? But I'm also kind of glad that there are people who exist who can sell me the things I want?

Capitalism is capitalism. It has its pros and cons. I think we can be realistic about the latter (which sometimes means being negative), but also acknowledge that this game is a product, we all obviously like playing it and are glad that it's here to one degree or another, and so we are also engaging in the practice of capitalism by purchasing it. So, yeah, manipulation to increase sales is not the most virtuous thing. But it's also not an OH MY GOD SHOCKING thing that EA invented from wholecloth. It is what it is. Manage yourself accordingly.

Ah so you're trying to normalize what they're doing by saying it's all the same and it's just how things work. You sure you don't work in sales?

"Triplis;c-17914361" wrote:

"Amapola76;c-17914227" wrote:
I mean... I wouldn't personally want to work in sales? But I'm also kind of glad that there are people who exist who can sell me the things I want?

Capitalism is capitalism. It has its pros and cons. I think we can be realistic about the latter (which sometimes means being negative), but also acknowledge that this game is a product, we all obviously like playing it and are glad that it's here to one degree or another, and so we are also engaging in the practice of capitalism by purchasing it. So, yeah, manipulation to increase sales is not the most virtuous thing. But it's also not an OH MY GOD SHOCKING thing that EA invented from wholecloth. It is what it is. Manage yourself accordingly.

Ah so you're trying to normalize what they're doing by saying it's all the same and it's just how things work. You sure you don't work in sales?

I don't have to work in sales to observe the world around me; it literally is how things work, regardless of how I feel about it. Preorder bonuses for games have been around for twenty years at least. Good or bad, EA didn't invent them. You don't have to like it, but you also don't have to buy them.

"Amapola76;c-17914398" wrote:
I don't have to work in sales to observe the world around me; it literally is how things work, regardless of how I feel about it. Preorder bonuses for games have been around for twenty years at least. Good or bad, EA didn't invent them. You don't have to like it, but you also don't have to buy them.

Literally just making up a guy to argue with and be dismissive of. Not interested.

> @Triplis said:
> Ah so you're trying to normalize what they're doing by saying it's all the same and it's just how things work. You sure you don't work in sales?

It is normal. And it is not only online... Sale tactics in stores are usually the "buy 3 and get two in discount" or "buy 3 for 1 free". In this way a store ensures more purchases of items by putting a nice promotion behind it. Similarly, for online stores. With games it is more difficult to apply, as the main thing they sell are games. So obviously this was a new way for game developers and studios to sell their product and ensure sales by offering a promotion. It is actually how things work. I mean, just try to envision yourself in a position where you have to market and sell your product. Wouldn't you want to ensure as most purchases as possible?

"ElyssaX;c-17914460" wrote:
It is normal. And it is not only online... Sale tactics in stores are usually the "buy 3 and get two in discount" or "buy 3 for 1 free". In this way a store ensures more purchases of items by putting a nice promotion behind it. Similarly, for online stores. With games it is more difficult to apply, as the main thing they sell are games. So obviously this was a new way for game developers and studios to sell their product and ensure sales by offering a promotion. It is actually how things work. I mean, just try to envision yourself in a position where you have to market and sell your product. Wouldn't you want to ensure as most purchases as possible?

There was a time when the norm for video games was you bought a physical disk in a store and that was the end of the transaction. No DLC, no MTX, no patches, end of story. No amount of weird hypothetical theoretical talk about sales tactics changes that. Don't @ me with that stuff, I'm just not going to engage with it, there is nothing to argue.

"Triplis;c-17914472" wrote:


There was a time when the norm for video games was you bought a physical disk in a store and that was the end of the transaction. No DLC, no MTX, no patches, end of story. No amount of weird hypothetical theoretical talk about sales tactics changes that. Don't @ me with that stuff, I'm just not going to engage with it, there is nothing to argue.

Not true, I'm afraid. I'm old enough to have bought games in store (probably bought my first pc game with my own money 25 years ago). They often came with physical pre-order freebies - mini figures, caps, bonus disc, mini guides and so on. Used to resell them usually for profit on Ebay. Pre-order bonuses are not new to digital. And even before digital purchases of whole games were a thing, physical games got patched from time to time, once the old internet came along.

"MissElpheba;c-17914613" wrote:

"Triplis;c-17914472" wrote:


There was a time when the norm for video games was you bought a physical disk in a store and that was the end of the transaction. No DLC, no MTX, no patches, end of story. No amount of weird hypothetical theoretical talk about sales tactics changes that. Don't @ me with that stuff, I'm just not going to engage with it, there is nothing to argue.

Not true, I'm afraid. I'm old enough to have bought games in store (probably bought my first pc game with my own money 25 years ago). They often came with physical pre-order freebies - mini figures, caps, bonus disc, mini guides and so on. Used to resell them usually for profit on Ebay. Pre-order bonuses are not new to digital. And even before digital purchases of whole games were a thing, physical games got patched from time to time, once the old internet came along.

The monetization tactics for video games are objectively far worse than they were then across the board. No amount of hedging on the details changes that and I will note, I made a distinction in my original criticism in this thread between digital pre-order items and physical ones. I don't know where the determination from regular people comes from to normalize worse forms of monetization as always there, but it's just not true.

The attempts to exploit are not new, sure, but the forms they take and the extent they push it is definitely worse than it was 25 years ago. I will concede, if it helps put into perspective my understanding of this, that before the mass adoption of PC/console, there were arcades. And kids dropping coins at arcades, essentially renting time on a game, was pretty predatory in its own right. These things can be observed going through cycles because the underlying system is the same and a change in medium that is slow enough leaves some room for temporary improvement before the same institutions get a foothold in it (like what happened with streaming services) and right now, with video games, we are in the part of the cycle where they are dug in and there are games with mechanics that are basically like digital casinos (lootboxes).

So frankly, I have to just scratch my head at the level of interest I keep encountering in this thread, in being dismissive of the reality of it, or rewriting the history by underplaying how things have changed with attempted corrections on surface level details. I am happy to leave it well enough alone, but people keep coming at me specifically about it and they are not going to get an argument if that's what they want, just more information about the reality of what things are, as best I understand it. Or more likely, they'll just get nothing, as I've about exhausted my energy to continue the conversation at this point, what with continuously having people make up a guy to argue with.

I think I'm going to throw in one more post on the topic before I move on. I haven't really kept up too well with the thread so I'll just say this and be done.

Sometimes game incentives also come at the request/demand of the customer. I've seen, many times, people ask on here if they get anything extra for preordering. I've also seen, many times, people saying they wished they got something extra for preordering because they know they will purchase that product and want something for the loyalty of giving their money up front.

In some cases, it's like the customer saying to the business, "I know you want me to purchase this right away so you can make your quarterly financials and I'm a loyal customer, so what's in it for me?" Then EA says, "Here. I'll offer a bicycle, a gnome and a tree." Now the customer gets a choice. You can say, "Sounds fair," and throw it into your budget, or you can say, "Pssh. I've already got a bicycle, a gnome and a tree. You can't hook me. I'll wait for that sale."

If we're going to speak the ugly truth, well, let's be honest, nobody "needs" the extras they're offering. But people don't like being told they can't have something when they want it. This is also a case of First World Problems. One can hardly put the entirety of the blame on capitalism (though it's definitely an ugly thing these days,) when there's a constant maelstrom of mass consumerism and an endless sea of rabid customers who fight each other for superficial happiness and the entitlement to hoard more than they need. (I'm speaking of general wealthy societies and cultural behavior, not picking on anyone here.)

But while most of us probably see those ugly insights of capitalism/consumerism and could argue and debate about them all week, I, for one, don't really like to live my life focusing and stressing over it and prefer to simplify the ugliness down to a realistic basic choice: Do I want the pack and the extras enough to buy it by September, and be happy to have it? Or does it make me feel better being a smart consumer and only buying on sale, thus forfeiting 3 "free" items that I technically already have? Or does the pack even interest me at all? Or maybe I don't care either way right now and I'll just wait until I see more? Or maybe I'm okay with getting it on sale and not getting the extra items and still enjoying it when I get it.

I know it's stating the obvious, but we each have our own perspectives, which often come from what we learn in life along the way. And we each make our own decisions based on our own unique experiences and learning. And we are all free to voice our perspectives and what we've learned and if we see something differently from someone else. There is no "right" or "wrong" or single "only" way to see it. There is just discussion.

Very well said, LiELF! I agree with all you said 100%!

Amen to that. :)