6 years ago

5% Nerf too Generalized

The top three Legends season 1 were Pathfinder, Wraith, and Lifeline. I understand why the characters needed nerfs as, at the time, none of the other legend's kits came close to matching the utility of having a small hitbox and a viable kit. However I don't understand the broad brush policy of a 5% damage increase on each of these legends that ignores the actual size of their hitboxes and how useful their unique abilities are in the current meta. I made a quick list below on how I believe the 5% nerf effects each of the legends after playing them.

Pathfinder: Medium sized hitbox with a small profile and the best mobility kit in the game. 5% damage increase is unnecessary for a medium hitbox character. Insane tactical and ultimate charge speed unaddressed and, in my opinion, is what should have been the actual focus of the nerf instead of the damage increase.

Wraith: Has the smallest hitbox in the game, a unique low profile weaboo run, and a great kit for detecting and escaping third parties as well as facilitating third partying for your team. 5% nerf seems appropriate but doesn't actually matter, as that 5% is not going to make up for the amount of shots you will probably miss on a strafing, slide jumping, bunny hopping Wraith player that you would hit on any other legend.

Lifeline: This is my main. I am actually ok with having a 5% nerf on my character despite the fact that she doesn't have the benefit of having the smallest hitbox like Wraith, or the best disengage tactical like Pathfinder. Having the medic be a bit squishier then the rest of the cast seems appropriate to me, but her kit currently doesn't make up for it, as she has a terrible tactical and ultimate, and very little synergy with other legends' abilities.

legends

14 Replies

Anlbrd
6 years ago
@NNeil6991 I personally think that increasing/decreasing damage taken to balance other things like hitbox size instead of actually balancing the things causing issues is a really, REALLY strange design decision. It smacks of them not having the resources to allocate to fixing this particular problem because it would interfere with their roadmap : but it's one of the most complained about things with Apex at the minute.

They ought to do the work to normalise the size of the characters, remove any artefacts from the models so what you see - you can shoot. If they did this then the balancing between the legends becomes infinitely simpler to work through.
NNeil6991
6 years ago
@AnlbrdIt would have been infinitely better if they had brought Lifeline and Wraith up to a midsized hitbox and gotten rid of the weeb run and perma-hunch Wraith has. I believe they just went with the general damage increase because it was far easier (and wouldn't take time away from their roadmap like you said), they wanted people to use other legends, and they especially wanted people to play Wattson, who has a Lifeline sized body and Pathfinder's visual fluff. It's a short term non-solution that doesn't even take into account what makes each of these characters strong...As a side note, I don't think you can normalize the hitboxes with Gibby and Caustic in the game. You can bring Lifeline and Wraith up to a medium sized hitbox, but bringing those guys down to medium would create Pathfinder legendary skin problems all over again.
Anlbrd
6 years ago
@NNeil6991 I meant that it would take a total re-design of the models mate. That's why i don't think they can devote the resources to it and why i don't think they ever will. It's a shame but someone let the art department have enough rope to almost hang the game with.
NNeil6991
6 years ago
@Anlbrd Damn that is a depressing way to look at it. Especially if you're a Gibby main lol.
WoahItsTea
6 years ago
@Anlbrd You really do heavily push for hitbox remodels for every issue in every thread don't you? hahaha
WoahItsTea
6 years ago
@NNeil6991 I don't play much of Pathfinder, Wraith or Lifeline. I currently main Caustic with my second and third picks being Octane and Wattson.
I've found that Pathfinder's hitbox has been improved and I am hitting him more consistently when in game. I think the 5% damage increase is more significant than people give it credit for and the extra damage does add up obviously when you deal higher amounts of DPS to a single target. A punch that would have done 30 damage now does 31 damage. However, an entire clip that would have done say 180 damage now does 189 damage. I'd say that this nerf makes up for the fact that these legends are more difficult to hit during a fight. I think it's less about their abilities and more about their hitbox sizes. However, I do think Lifeline needs a buff to her tactical drone - I'd like to see it's cooldown lowered a bit. Wraith and Pathfinder are practically the same legend with similar tactical and ultimate abilities. I'd say Pathfinder is just more useful to teams in most situations and Wraith is more useful to herself. Neither really need heavy nerfs to their kits.
EA_Blueberry
Community Manager
6 years ago
@WoahItsTea wrote:

I've found that Pathfinder's hitbox has been improved and I am hitting him more consistently when in game.

Via Season 2 patch notes:

Pathfinder

Updated the hit box to better conform with the base model.

We are also planning to make adjustments so hitbox better reflects Legendary Skins as well for cases where it’s not matching up.
NNeil6991
6 years ago
@WoahItsTea I wasn't advocating heavy nerfs to their kits. I believe the "heaviest" nerf I advocated was for Pathfinder's cooldowns to be increased in exchange for dropping the low profile nerf.
WoahItsTea
6 years ago
@NNeil6991 Bad word choice from me, I also don't believe in any 'heavy' nerfs to any of the legends. Thinking about it a little more, I agree with you that Pathfinder may not need low-profile since he's quite noticeable and, as I mentioned before, has a more consistent hitbox from my own gameplay fighting him. Not too sure if his abilities need any nerfs at all either - maybe his zipline ability could be on a 2 second longer cooldown? I rarely play Path so I'm not really the best to comment on him haha
sireladio
Rising Adventurer
6 years ago
@NNeil6991
Pathfinder - Pathfinder had one of the smaller hitboxs until recently addressed by Respawn. The tactical and ultimate speed is a requirment for the character to be viable. By increasing the time these actions take you will make pathfinder very static and create a character who will sit in the background camping most of the game as his current set up allows him mobility. As some one that mained him in season 1 I can say while you may think his ability is fast when in a gun fight its not as easy to pull off the his tactical as people think. The amount of pathfinders I see who cant even Slingshot is terrible.

Lifeline - ? The fact your saying she has a terrible tactical and ultimate is honestly showing your lack of ability and skill. Also to say the only medic in the game who can provide drops that can contain high value loot has no synergy with other legends is honestly ridiculous. Maybe you just dont know how to play her correctly. Also you failed to speak abount her passive ability to pretty much have a buffed heal speed. That passive ability alone is one of the strongest in the game