Forum Discussion

TheGreenFellow's avatar
7 years ago

Apex Legends' Anti-cheat is too weak. Policy improvements needed.

Just what is going on with EasyAntiCheat? It's apparently not doing much, because every match I am seeing cheaters of a wide variety. The last 2 days has been absolute hell trying to find one match that doesn't involve wallhackers and no-recoil 'soft-lock' players. The reason I'm ranting right now is getting two-tap headshotted by a bloodhound I never even saw, who did the exact same thing to my teammate two seconds later. While we were spectating him, his aim was snapping to random points of the screen - staring at walls - obviously where other 'rectangles' were floating on his screen, while he was trying to loot us.

If you can't prevent these cheats from entering the match to begin with, you've failed.

Now, this particular instance was a low-level player, but I've seen the *exact same behavior* of staring at walls and pinging enemies across the map that don't even have a pixel visible while spectating them from players with 10k+ kills and the Wraith heirloom.

If you can't ban these players before they accumulate kill counters, emblems, and all the "goodies" - the only tangible benefits of doing well at your game, you've failed.

There's clearly far too much control available clientside over the game and being able to manipulate it. I've seen multiple times the idea that the source engine itself is the ultimate weakness here.

Now, I fully understand I can't ask for specific details. I know explaining anything about what you're trying to do would defeat the entire purpose of you trying to do anything about the cheating. But whatever is going on, is not working.

I can't enjoy the game when I'm being headshot lasered, when I'm up against competition that has completely perfect knowledge of all other player positions at all times without fail, when I'm seeing these same players gain all the renown and benefits of "winning" that I'm supposed to be striving for.

I've seen anecdotes of college students making a pasttime out of cheating in Apex and profiting off of it - that's how low the bar has fallen here.

It is my firm belief that these things need to happen if Apex is going to stay around for the long haul, with the recognition that this will likely take the cooperation of EA and other groups external to just Respawn:

  1.  Preventative & early-detection methods need to go up to the highest priority. If you can't stop it before it happens, you really may as well not try at all. Do whatever it takes. Preventing that player from ruining the rest of the match & further matches, and all the other players there, is more important than avoiding giving a cheatmaker incremental feedback on what does & does not work.
  2. Any possible shred of 'client-side' activity needs to be pushed to server-side. The more you leave client-side, the more is exposed to anybody seeking to create an exploit - going right down to the nitty gritty details of bullet travel, recoil, control input, what-have-you. Clearly, there is currently far too much that is being left visible to the client; not only that, but the more that is hooked into server-side, the more you can detect and hit with the banhammer (e.g. server being able to immediately notice when a player has obviously impossibly perfect recoil control - that should result in an instant ban or being forcefully disconnected and sent to "cheating server" purgatory.)
  3. Build much more rigorous account & account-creation control. Require two-factor authentication. Implement better filter algorithms to prevent "asdffj88ffdf9I'manobviouscheater" names from being accepted (thereby throwing a wrench into account creation botting; as an example, more than 7 seemingly-random letters & number sequences would trigger a "name not acceptable" response [admittedly the math for that is beyond my ken, but with all the things modern mathematicians have achieved, it must be possible]). Require regular password changes - not only does it improve security, it makes things a pain for maintaining a cheating account. Make email, password, and account name changes more difficult to do and require verification at every step.
  4. Take every opportunity to pursue legal action and persuade law enforcement to come down on users & creators of cheats alike. The goal here is foremost to send a message, but even small victories in this avenue is likely to pay off huge dividends down the road. Visibly taking this wrongdoing in serious fashion benefits both your players and discourages would-be mischief-makers. Anybody can spend a few hours browsing google and find Apex cheats, so there's plenty of investigative leads that can be taken.


If all else fails, or that seems impractical and insustainable...you could always shift gears, and create a PvE experience in the form of a sequel to a certain cult-classic game series you're known for. Otherwise...you signed up for this dire need to focus so heavily on anti-cheating.

Either way, please pursue the utmost of success. For the time being, I'll be waiting until the June update and hope that improves things.

9 Replies

  • @TheGreenFellow 

    I think that they have been quite open about the challenges the anti-cheat faces and the progress they have made. Some of the numbers involved are colossal. Let's not forget that EA is a video game publisher and Respawn are a game development studio. They use EAC to ensure players have a fair game. But the players themselves keep cheating. So it's a never ending battle.

    • The recently added in-game reporting tool has had a big impact on discovering new cheats, including previously undetectable cheats that are now being found automatically via EAC

    • Total bans are now at 770K players

    • We have blocked over 300K account creations

    • We have banned over 4,000 cheat seller accounts (spammers) in the last 20 days

    • Total affected matches on PC impacted by cheaters or spammers has been reduced by over half in the last month due to recent efforts

    Source.

    Cheating is frustrating for all honest players but until players decide to stop cheating it's always going to be something of a circus.

    There really isn't an awful lot that the forums can do regards cheating other than provide relevant information as most of what the anti-cheat does is secret.

  • I don't mean to step on toes here but I feel like you neglected to actually read the majority of my post, which addresses a large portion of what you point out here.

    Bottom line, the numbers and sympathizing with faced challenges is neither here nor there. Success or failure is what I'm discussing. Right now, it is not succeeding. I've detailed why, and detailed on how I believe it needs improvement.

    Just waving it off as a neverending circus that won't end unless "players decide to stop cheating" is not and never can be the answer. You might as well claim that a roof can't be stopped from leaking because there will always be rain in the future.

    Lastly, "there isn't a lot the forums can do"? These forums exist precisely to provide this kind of feedback for the developers and EA to read. I'm using the forums for their explicit purpose. Nowhere did I ask fellow forum users to somehow step in and solve the cheating problem.

    To sum up, I don't feel your response was, on the whole, appropriate.
  • warslag's avatar
    warslag
    7 years ago

    The facts that we know are what we have from the updates and check ins from Respawn.

    Statistics that have been shared with us show that the anti-cheat does work and is very successful.

    The best thing to do is to report any cheats you encounter using the in game report feature or along with any evidence to EAC here.

  • From lurking cheat forums I've read a lot of people are getting banned with the free cheats.  From what they said they get banned about a day or 2 later.  So that still gives a day or 2 of cheating that effects the normal players.

    Paid cheats are still rampant and undetected as these people make cheats as a full time job.  I am seeing less aimbots on the asia servers recently... maybe it is just RNG from matchmaking. 


    I would personally hire these very talented cheat creators to work on the anti cheats,  I'm pretty sure a lot of these programmers don't have a steady jobs that's why they are in the cheat business.  If they are talented at creating cheats I'm sure they will be just as good at preventing them. 

    Another thing that has been said before is high level accounts should be match made with higher levels so new cheating accounts do not effect steady player base. 

  • @warslag  the facts they have shared - just some raw numbers - are not meaningful. It's understandable that they cannot say or share much, and they have plainly explained as much, but it doesn't matter how many have been banned. It's not a sign of success, it is only a statistic. That is not remotely the same thing.

    What matters is whether or not Apex's anti-cheat & the policies for it are effective, and currently, they are not.

    Reporting cheats ingame or through the online EAC reporting ticket system is all well and good, but that doesn't have anything to do with the policies of Respawn & EA at the decision-making level on how to proceed and what goals to pursue.

    And as you'd have noticed at the very start of my first post, I've intimated that it does not feel like Easy Anti-Cheat is accomplishing much of anything, which means that performing this reporting action feels like a futile placebo effect. Again, I've also already attempted to explain the particulars of why it feels this way.

    The lack of active response server-side to boot cheaters is a significant factor in this feeling. This is why I've recommended a focus on pre-emptiveness, as well as pushing the game to be as server-side as can be made feasible, and ensuring the server can "see" and react to cheating when it occurs in an automatic on-the-fly fashion.

    Unless the people at the decision-making level for Apex Legends can see and understand this message, it's quite likely nothing is going to change from the current status quo, which is not ideal in the slightest and likely will result in me and many others walking away from the game primarily because of this.

  • Vdstrk's avatar
    Vdstrk
    Seasoned Ace
    7 years ago
    Just a thought.
    What if those cheat makers are in fact devs from competing games, and their only purpose is to hinder the success of other games?
    I do believe that there could be the random talent out of luck that turns "criminal" due to necessity. Romantic and sad story. Possible, but quite uncommon -imo.
  • Heh, it's a fun conspiracy, but I rather doubt it's intentional sabotage so much as individual entrepreneurship (so to speak).

    There's certainly plenty of 'talent' out there as regards doing nefarious things by whatever means necessary, that's for sure. Just means there needs to be attractive incentives for more talent to be applied to ensuring those nefarious things can't take place.
  • Bumping this thread because the June patch has not improved matters - in fact, it's gotten worse. The number of cheaters I've encountered has gone up since the patch, probably due to the nature of ranked queue.

    It's very quickly spoiling the fun of the game to constantly encounter these cheaters of every variety - "wallhackers", "soft-lockers", or the less clever ones that just blatantly tick all the options on for perfect instant-snapping headshot laser beam mode.

    They've been present in nearly every single match I've played (which statistically is not that surprising, 60 players to a match and all). The most common to encounter is, of course, the hardest to detect - those that only toggle on the 'wallhack' option and thus have 100% perfect knowledge of player locations at all times.

    Preventative policy against cheating is a necessity for this game's future.
    __

    Compounding this problem is the lackluster ingame reporting options.

    Why is there no kill-cam?

    Why can we not switch between members of the squad we're viewing in deathcam in order to report the correct player?

    Why can we not report *our* teammates for cheating if we catch them doing it? (If you try to click on "Cheating" it sends you to a different menu for essentially them being rude.)

    I'm having to basically keep the Easyanticheat report link open in my web browser for the entire duration of time that I play Apex Legends. And even then, there's no reason for me to believe it's going to accomplish anything, because there is this dire lack of preventative anticheat policy.

    I strongly believe it's mistaken to believe the idea that you can't ban cheaters immediately because it gives cheat-makers feedback on what doesn't work. That's mis-prioritising what matters to us players, and frankly speaking, they'll get that feedback regardless one way or another.

    Very annoyed. The game experience is otherwise better than ever and I want to enjoy it more, but I cannot unless I can see cheating immediately and tangibly stopped when I encounter it.

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