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phnmn1's avatar
4 years ago

LMGs is really OP for now

   It's easy to control recoil in the apex legends and that's a big problem. This eliminates the difference between different weapons and makes them too similar to use. With a non-critical recoil intensity and a very similar recoil control efficiency, additional weapon features become more significant, and LMGs have no equal in this: they have more bullets in clip, they are easy to control when shooting from the hip (especially rampage), LMGs have high damage per 1 bullet (especially rampage) and high total damage per magazine (especially rampage). In a direct firefight, it is extremely difficult to shoot LMGs - they have much more bullets and dont need to reload as often as assault rifles or SMGs, also LMGs in total need to hit less times than other automatic weapons due to the greater damage per bullet. All these factors make the variety of weapons in the apex legends quite fictitious, because controlling weapons is about equally easy, but in other respects, LMGs are simply better and more effective. Now LMGs, due to their light and easy control recoil (especially in the Rampage) and large clip size, shoot almost all other types of weapons, including weapons for medium - long range, even marksman rifles. This is not a sign of good balance. 

   Weapons should be created in an integrated manner, taking into account the strengths and weaknesses, but when LMGs are strong in everything, this is not a balance. Large damage and clip size must be compensated, for example, by recoil. Moreover, it is logical: big damage - big recoil. In other games (for example, battlefield and others), LMGs are much more difficult to control than any other automatic weapons, but in the apex, more powerful LMGs are even easier to control than assault rifles. That's silly. LMGs as a class, due to their strengths, need to raise the overall recoil level, and quite strongly, so that you can feel the difference in gameplay between machine guns and other automatic weapons, as well as to compensate for the strengths of LMGs as a class and balance them in the general weapon pool. 

   Also, it is necessary to significantly reduce LMG's accuracy when firing from the hip. At close range, even with no scope, the machine guns will shoot any other weapon due to the larger size of mag, as well as the total damage. Machine guns are really big and powerful weapons with a lot of ammo, so it's odd that they're also easy to control. This is not fair from the point of view of balance, since it gives in total to the already existing advantages an additional too strong feature, and it is also unreasonable logically, because these large and uncomfortable weapons simply cant be so accurate when firing from the hip, it's just inconvenient and illogical. Therefore, it is very strange to see how, for example, a rampage (a big and very powerful machine gun) shoots much more accurately from the hip than the r-301.

  All weapons have their own characteristics that make them unique. The peculiarities of LMGs are high power and large clip size, but this must be compensated for, otherwise this class of weapons becomes too powerful and simply uncompromising. And according to this type of weapon, it should have high recoil (due to high power) and poor shooting from the hip (because these are large uncomfortable weapons adapted for prolonged shooting)

9 Replies

  • @phnmn1 Recoil being easy to control is an understatement I started playing mouse and keyboard because I was bored and I have better recoil control than I do on a controller and I’ve been playing controller for 2 years now
  • II-LAZZARUS-II's avatar
    II-LAZZARUS-II
    4 years ago

    I don't understand why we need 10000 different wepons if at the end they all should make the same dmg in the same amount of time. 

    A little bit more reality would be fine in every shooter if you ask me.

    Extreme example, we are not there yet, but in 5 years maybe: Please make the tank more vulnerable, so that I can kill him with my rifle.

    That's the endgame for me of all this: this and that is OP.

  • @phnmn1 This is pretty true tbh. The recoil and rhythm of guns is what really differentiates them in use. The flatline is an awesome midrange gun as long as you are capable of controlling it, but the LSTAR and Rampage are super easy to get a handle on without any penalty. I think generally speaking they need to take a strong look at recoil in game
  • heme725's avatar
    heme725
    4 years ago

    @papahandsoap Slightly disagree with you here. Guns should differ in what advantages they give you to make your choices meaningful. When it comes to the Rampage I'm perfectly happy with it having low recoil so long as it's noticeably weaker in head to head fights. A nerf to the rate of fire is what I'd prefer on the Rampage so that it stays an easy to use mid-range gun that puts you at a disadvantage if you use it up close.

  • @heme725 The door breaking with thermites needs to go as well. Guns should not be able to destroy one of the most important pieces of cover in the game.
  • papahandsoap's avatar
    papahandsoap
    4 years ago

    Every other shooting game has one immediate counter to LMGs and how oppressive they are: recoil/spread.

    These weapons are currently so easy to manage that they make a fair portion of the loot pool a joke. Spitfire is a problem? We can put it in the CP but we can also release the Rampage and make the L-STAR turn you into a one-man tank instead of balancing the spitfire. Why grab a G7 scout when a Rampage can match if not beat that DPS at range, and absolutely dominate close range with a thermite? Why grab a volt when the L-STAR never has to reload (when used properly) and has ridiculous stats like its headshot multiplier and the fact that its projectile sizes are well thrown footballs? 


    I get wanting to cater to casuals in a BR that needs casual players for revenue, but the weapon balancing in this game feels like it's done by a fresh high school graduate. Every season there has been a new major exploit of a gun, and instead of balancing weapons they're just hard nerfed or hard buffed. The longer I play this game the more I feel that it does not reward players who grow their skill and improve, but only seeks to reward players who just installed the game until they get bored of it. 

  • @heme725 I meant that in a general sense, LMGs in Apex are overly oppressive without much drawback period. The rampage can still be used to dominate up close if you keep thermites on you, it's more threatening than the spitfire was up close in that state imo. There is no real penalty when an LMG with 40 (rampage), 48 (devo w mag), or infinite (lstar if used well) has little to no recoil and can be managed as easily as the game's baseline ARs.
  • heme725's avatar
    heme725
    4 years ago

    @papahandsoap I didn't even consider the termite buff so you're probably right about that. I've never feared the Rampage up close but I'm really hating it at range. It may be a bit TOO easy and effective from that distance so I'd be ok with a slight nerf.

    I don't take the devotion seriously outside of close range unless it has a turbocharger since the delay is easy to capitalize on.

    The Lstar is another joke gun to me outside of close range. The bullets can blind me but its the only gun with bullets big and slow enough to actually dodge.

    @TinyTim6991 Back when the Spitfire was considered weak some players suggested giving it the ability to blast through doors. I'm not saying your wrong just that this is something they community actually asked for. If I saw it happen even once I'd likely agree with you though.

  • @heme725 Honestly it is much easier to find turbos this season and I consider that to be like a "soft buff" for devo. It is incredibly threatening with or without one when you're facing a good player that either keeps it kitted or knows how to time the prefire.

    Rampage just has too much to be good at right now. The thermite charge isn't the broken part of the gun, it's the little-to-no range drop and the lack of damage falloff. It basically functions as a G7 or repeater with a giant mag until you drop a thermite in it.

    L-STAR is just belligerently overtuned right now. The gun was already capable as hell before, but it was simply not picked up a lot. I think it's ridiculous that they shelved the spitfire just to make the L-STAR worse and drop a super overtuned (at range) rampage.

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