Forum Discussion

Re: Explaining how the matchmaking works

@Cheese9Man

Matchmaking remains the topic of most interest to me. Like others, I have conducted tests and data pulls using a multitude of accounts (ranging from high to low ELO). Even though I’m conducting hundreds of test matches, my sample sizes are relatively small (in comparison to how big the community is). So ultimately I consider my findings “suggestive” and not solid proof. All of my tests were for non-ranked. I am confident in the following:

-Queuing with a full squad tends to put you in lobbies that are mostly full squad teams.

-Playing with friends will place you against opponents based on your highest skilled teammate. So a Masters-level teammate with two new players will be dropped into a lobby of other high ELO players. This is bad and deters people from playing with friends.

-Matchmaking is using values such as KD, average damage per game, placement, and possibly accuracy to construct lobbies.

-Matchmaking will look at your performance over your last games and drop you into lower difficulty lobbies. But there is a caveat here. If you have a lot of data on your account (my main has 61,000 kills), this effect takes FAR FAR longer. I can lose 150-200 consecutive games (with little to no damage) and not get dropped into easier lobbies. However, on several occasions I noticed that losing many matches with low performance results in me getting another high ELO player as a teammate— sometimes two, as the game pairs me with two pre-made players. This suggests that the game is acknowledging your struggle and trying to adjust for it by giving you strong teammates. Conversely, I feel like my teammates are noticeably worse after winning a match. More attention needs to be spent exploring this.

-Matchmaking prioritizes fast matching in BR ONLY. It will make high ELO players wait in Arenas and LTMs like Winter Express. I ran a test last summer that saw me waiting an average of 7 minutes for an Arenas game over 100 games. And because the system is being very strict with who I play with, this often resulted in games that weren’t the most fluid to play (lag was noticeable).

-It’s entirely possible (and in my opinion likely) that the SBMM is dialed up or down intentionally around key times, to make the experience slightly better for the largest player group (casual players). The reason for this is to increase the likelihood that these players make purchases.

16 Replies

  • BlairNines's avatar
    BlairNines
    4 years ago

    There's genuinely nothing that makes sense about the matchmaking.

    Every single game I'm killed by Master/Predator players with their 4k & 20 bomb badges.

    I average 300 damage per match, I have less than a 1.0 K/D, I have a 0.6% win rate for games played, and I've never made it out of Silver.

    It feels like this game WANTS me to quit playing and tell everyone how terrible it is.

  • @BlairNines Why aren’t you playing ranked exclusively?

    Will you see some high skilled players there? Yes. Some

    But this will be infinitely better than only playing 4k 20 Master/Preds like you are in pubs.
  • @hayhor You know, I cringe when I see someone try to type out the name, LMAO. I don’t even know why I stayed with this name— I didn’t pick it, its the auto generated name that the forum gave me. So random lol
  • HappyHourSumwur's avatar
    HappyHourSumwur
    Seasoned Ace
    4 years ago

    @BlairNinesYour experience is the same as mine. I seriously doubt that any type of personal measurement of "skill" is used in Apex's matchmaking. Otherwise, a trash can like me wouldn't get insta-melted as often as I do. Nothing makes me rage more than dying instantly to squads or solos with perfect aim and coordination.
    They always know exactly where I am and never seem to miss shots no matter what I do. Why TF is a solo like me in a match with these guys? No possible answer will be satisfactory to me when I'm on the wrong end of it 90% of the time.

  • BlairNines's avatar
    BlairNines
    4 years ago
    @Axs5626Sxa5001
    The reason I don't play ranked exclusively is because every single match gets dominated by a Plat, Diamond, Master, or Predator TEAM that for some reason is in Bronze. They have their ranked badges, they have tens of thousands of kills, but for some reason they're in Bronze.

    It doesn't matter what game mode I play. I will find extremely experienced players every single game. I either get * on by a Plat/Diamond 4k 20 bomb team in Bronze ranked or I get * on by a Master/Pred 4k 20 bomb team in pubs.
  • @hayhor Playing ranked doesn't do anything. I just get dominated by a level 44 Wraith with 900 kills.

    There's no way to get away.
  • RockDokRock's avatar
    RockDokRock
    Seasoned Ace
    4 years ago

    @Axs5626Sxa5001 wrote:
    @BlairNinesWhy aren’t you playing ranked exclusively?

    Will you see some high skilled players there? Yes. Some

    But this will be infinitely better than only playing 4k 20 Master/Preds like you are in pubs.

    @Axs5626Sxa5001 Strongly disagree with this.  My KD dropped to 20% of what it is normally and I was constantly stomped in Ranked.  I got to Bronze II before I quit.

    My team mates were always super-green.  Sometimes totally new.  I've mentioned this before but i'll say it again, I literally had team mates where I would ping better body armour and they would show no interest and I'd have to EXPLAIN why this is a good idea.  In ranked

    Then we get steam-rollered by the first squad we encounter.  I'm always last guy standing.  Looking at death report these are not new playeres.

    I have over 12,000 games logged and about 3,500 kills on my main.  It seems to intentionally over skewing my team mates to poor players.  Other squads may be pre-made, I don't know but I found it extremely difficult and frustrating.  I only play pubs now.  I've given up on ranked, horrible experience.

    Match making in pubs isn't great either.  I generally only play with friends now.  I used to play for an hour or two a few times a week on my own but i have not done that in a month because I was just tired of getting constantly stomped.  Doesn't seem to be much point and isn't alot of fun.

  • @BlairNinesHear me out, as I am NOT trying to discredit your experience.

    But scenario 1 (your entire lobby being comprised of Masters and Preds) is NOT the same as scenario 2 (playing bronze ranked lobbies and occasionally fighting a 4k 20 bomb).

    Is scenario 1 really happening to you every match? I’m in those lobbies that are all Diamond and up and I’m not stomping any low level players. Those lobbies are literally all 4k 20 bomb players. Meanwhile my low ELO test account consistently drops me into very weak lobbies, so I know for a fact those lobbies exist. Perhaps there are a few high ELO players in your lobby and you have bad luck running into them? But the entire lobby?

    And again, no offense, but Bronze lobbies aren’t all 4k 20 bomb players either. I definitely want to acknowledge that you will see them from time to time, but it’s almost statistically impossible that your entire lobby every match are these players in bronze lobbies.

    So really, scenario 2 is the far better option for you. I’d say the average/median skill in the game is somewhere between Gold and Plat. If YOU want to win at rates similar to those players, you must work on pushing your personal skill above that average/median threshold. It’s not fair to want average outcomes without being average yourself. Any player who is legitimately below average should have a very hard time winning games.This isn’t a bad thing— this is a good thing. It means you have the power to practice and improve your outcomes. Good luck man.

  • hayhor's avatar
    hayhor
    Hero
    4 years ago
    @BlairNines You have to get out of bronze. I totally agree with that. It is a mess of smurfs and self relegators.
  • hayhor's avatar
    hayhor
    Hero
    4 years ago
    @Axs5626Sxa5001 In the other users defense the last time I went into bronze ranked I'd estimate 75% of my deaths were to smurfs or people with masters and pred badges so it feels like those lobbies are full of them. As you say tho, you do see plenty of noobs but you go in thinking it's bronze and I should be able to kill everyone but then run into super players.
  • @RockDokRock So you’re telling me that Bronze lobbies are harder than your pubs, and your getting stomped by every team you see.

    I’m curious— where do you put yourself in terms of skill, regarding the entirety of the playerbase?

    Are you average? Below average? Above?

    I’m also curious what you think below, average, and above average stats look like?
  • @hayhorOk, so then Silver would be the best place to be I guess. Although I’m still confident that if he loses enough pubs he will enter the lobbies that are SUBSTANTIALLY easier than the Diamond/Master/Pred lobbies.

    Personally, my account has a difficult time being dropped into these lobbies but that’s because there is a ton of data on my main, so it takes far more losses to impact my ratios.

  • hayhor's avatar
    hayhor
    Hero
    4 years ago
    @Axs5626Sxa5001 I think on your account it takes instant deaths on the drop. I know a former pred who said he notices a difference after 10 of them. I'm talking dropping and doing basically no damage. I assume this is why I see people flying off the map to start games.
  • CCbathwater's avatar
    CCbathwater
    Seasoned Ace
    4 years ago

    I had this (Xbox) player yesterday on Winter Express. How it's possible to do that amount of dmg on Winter Express over the course of 7 1/2 minutes, escapes me. And second: How on earth did sbmm think he belonged on my team? Was he having fun? Doubt it. Luckily it's easier to carry on Winter Express due to the other two teams also fight among each other.

    Sadly it's too much of the above with the current sbmm. And too few games like this where you get a team and opponents. As you can see on "survival time" we didn't just steamroll a bot Winter Express lobby, we had to fight hard for that.

  • hayhor's avatar
    hayhor
    Hero
    4 years ago
    @CCbathwater I had a game like your 2nd with E9 before I left for vacation. We didn't win and the team had close to 9k damage haha.

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