Re: Two suggestions to instantly improve game balance

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@iLikeToSnipe21 wrote:

@XPlayerJ  We can both agree that certain maps favor certain decks. So if you're in a league with three maps that each favor a different deck... What happens if you randomly get a map that doesn't favor your deck (rather than the one that would favor your deck) and your opponent has the deck that is favorable to this map?

Do you not see how having maps within the same league that favor different decks adds luck as a component of victory? I am all in favor of having different maps to encourage different decks. But having this requires the ability to choose one of your three decks upon seeing the map selected. There are literally no downsides to choosing a deck after seeing the map. It adds another layer of strategy and removes another factor of luck from the game.

Not a single, successful RTS has had this problem in its ranked mode. If you were to have a desktop RTS with these random variables in its ranked mode, it would not be taken seriously and would fail. Honestly, I can't think of a single game with a ranked mode in any genre that does this.

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Yes, the different maps add an element of luck, but it doesn’t mean I agree with you in allowing players to see maps pre-fight.

The favor of terrain can be against you, but you could be lucky as well and get it to benefit you.

This means both players share the same luck chance going into the fight.

In addition, I think the luck will statically balance out.

I believe you will have tons of chances to play in all the maps equally.

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@XPlayerJ wrote:

In addition, I think the luck will statically balance out.

I believe you will have tons of chances to play in all the maps equally.

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At its core, what is C&C Rivals?

It is a simulation of warfare.

Now, it is not a 100% realistic simulation of warfare, and it does not have to be. Still, I agree with the people who say that luck/randomness is playing a too heavy role in this game. An RTS game should not be a crap shoot. C&C Rivals however is a crap shoot in many regards.

@XPlayerJ 

I don't know how much experience you have in the RTS genre, why/how you play this game, etc; so I won't make any assumptions and just start at the basics.

The average player wants to win. That's their goal. They are going to do whatever they can to improve their odds at winning. Let's say you're in Tib league, that means you have EIGHT DIFFERENT MAPS that can be randomly selected. There are simply too many variables to build a deck around. The only variable you can count on is that you won't have a deck optimized for the map you're playing.

So if you want to win you have to focus on that one variable. You will want to build a deck that's balanced and has strategic/tactical options on any of the maps. This actually leads to a very stale meta. Tech units are not a good pick at all for a balanced deck. So they get left out and players end up focusing on the units you get from the war factory. Yes, you can run into some players who don't play that way. But if you're of equal skill and have a balanced deck you are most likely going to win. Your chances of losing go up when they get lucky and the map favors their deck over yours.

Having an option to pick from one of three decks you've built after seeing a map increases the variety of units that you can competitively use. The way maps affect deck choices goes beyond "aggro vs tech". Even as GDI there are some maps in Tib league that favor MG squads over snipers, and others that favor snipers over MGs.

Let me break this out into a list:

1. The majority of players play to win
2. In order to win, you must have a deck that isn't crippled by the map you're playing on
3. There is a large pool of maps that are randomly chosen
4. Relying on a less than 50% chance that your specialized deck won't be crippled is a losing strategy
5. Players will gravitate towards a singular meta leading to stale, boring gameplay

I hope this makes it clearer, but it's really simple. Random maps lead to choosing between a stale meta or relying on luck.

Besides, what's more entertaining? Immediately having the upper hand because you got lucky or pitting your skill against an opponent on a level playing field?

Don’t b fool by some of the comments here. They are either EA staff or aligned to them in some way. This game is obviously not going to improve any better. Only thing would be to suck more money from you but do not deliver the best gaming experience. I hv made it my daily job to spread the news that this game is not worth your money. Take recently the resource challenge...cheats in majority of the matches. And the cheats is not from the players but from EA itself. What kind of cheats u may ask. Cheating u of your money by almost always matching you against players who always hv a deck that is superior to whatever deck you have. Outcome is to frustrate you enough hoping u will pay more to buy more decks. So all those commenters here who * about how to play and what strategy to win bla bla bla....my feedback is...if u can * pls allow me to feedback too. I hv played many EA games before....mostly C&C titles....this is by far the worse. If I am EA owner, this Rival team is the first I will sack for making many of your customers feel dissatisfied. My final advice...DO NOT SPEND ON THIS GAME. ITS NOT WORTH IT...ITS CHEATING YOU.

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@iLikeToSnipe21 wrote:

@XPlayerJ 

I don't know how much experience you have in the RTS genre, why/how you play this game, etc; so I won't make any assumptions and just start at the basics.

The average player wants to win. That's their goal. They are going to do whatever they can to improve their odds at winning. Let's say you're in Tib league, that means you have EIGHT DIFFERENT MAPS that can be randomly selected. There are simply too many variables to build a deck around. The only variable you can count on is that you won't have a deck optimized for the map you're playing.

So if you want to win you have to focus on that one variable. You will want to build a deck that's balanced and has strategic/tactical options on any of the maps. This actually leads to a very stale meta. Tech units are not a good pick at all for a balanced deck. So they get left out and players end up focusing on the units you get from the war factory. Yes, you can run into some players who don't play that way. But if you're of equal skill and have a balanced deck you are most likely going to win. Your chances of losing go up when they get lucky and the map favors their deck over yours.

Having an option to pick from one of three decks you've built after seeing a map increases the variety of units that you can competitively use. The way maps affect deck choices goes beyond "aggro vs tech". Even as GDI there are some maps in Tib league that favor MG squads over snipers, and others that favor snipers over MGs.

Let me break this out into a list:

1. The majority of players play to win
2. In order to win, you must have a deck that isn't crippled by the map you're playing on
3. There is a large pool of maps that are randomly chosen
4. Relying on a less than 50% chance that your specialized deck won't be crippled is a losing strategy
5. Players will gravitate towards a singular meta leading to stale, boring gameplay

I hope this makes it clearer, but it's really simple. Random maps lead to choosing between a stale meta or relying on luck.

Besides, what's more entertaining? Immediately having the upper hand because you got lucky or pitting your skill against an opponent on a level playing field?

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I don’t agree for dozens of reasons.

I simply don’t feel like listing them all out.

Letting people see the map they play on before going into the battle removes lucky from the game.

I think having luck in the game is a good thing.

You think having luck in the game is a bad thing because it can cause disadvantages.

I think disadvantages lead to opportunities for both skill & unskillful players.

I have played games with no luck involved at all.

Chess for example has no luck.

A very skillful player will always beat an unskillful player.

The result is the unskilled player will either improve or quit.

Most people end up quitting.

The elemental of luck allows the unskillful player the chance to win even if he is outplayed in the fight.

This helps the game as a whole.

This is why games like Poker are extremely popular vs. games like Chess or Checker.

You add more deck slots.

You show players maps before the fight.

You remove luck from the game.

The superior players will micro skills, deck design, & deck crafting will be number 1.

Everyone else will be number 2.

If you actually love playing this game, you shouldn’t want the game to be like that.