Forum Discussion

Liber109's avatar
Liber109
Seasoned Rookie
1 month ago

What I would do in terms of the roster

Tier one plants

Mostly gonna be writing about new plants

Peas- 3 plants
Peashooter- ya know em ya love em. He’s the pea that shoots peas. And zombies. Don’t have to go into much detail about this guy.
Pea Pod- you’ve got a friend in him- 5 actually. Pea pod’s gimmick in this game will be a high starting cost- I think maybe 150. In return, he will be able to get heads really cheap- once he Evolves, you can gain extra heads by adding the other plant on top (unless it’s the pure fusion, in which you add the tier 1 pea pod/tier 2 pea pod once it’s tier 3). So say you have a pea pod + potato mine- just add another potato mine and you got a new head! Realistically it would evolve with more expensive plants to keep a semblance of balance, but I think stacking up heads would be nice. Tier 1 would likely start with a max of one head (obviously), tier 2s would have a capacity of 3 heads, and tier 3s would have 5 heads max. I saw a suggestion of Dazey Chain being a mix of Stallia and Pea pod- which would be perfect!
Threepeater- Three times the pea but not quite three times the shooter, threepeater has cut its cost to 250, sacrificing the eyes on its other heads as well. To me, this feels like a fun “tier 1” mechanic that it loses when it gets a boost. I think 250 is a good price since it’s basically a 100 cost peashooter and two 75 cost peashooters. In pvz1 and 2 threepeater had the niche of saving space while costing a bit more. In evolved however, you can already stack Gatling peas up every lane while still having the early game consistency of peashooter. Making it cost efficient is key to making threepeater feel different- and not just three peashooters in a trenchcoat. It could be used to make plants like Dandelion, Seashooter, dragon bruit, and more

Sun production- 3 plants
Sunflower- singing, dancing, always lighting up the mood! Uh that’s all I have to say
Sun Bean- in most situations Sun bean is good, other beans are good as well. Spring bean is “good” at stalling single heavy targets, chili bean instakills zombies that aren’t immune to it, zoybean’s spawns can munch up crazy damage as long as they aren’t taking much, etc. I feel like Sun Bean is the most versatile, though, and I want to provide a lot of sun production options anyways. 
Solar Sage- he’s more of a mage than a sage, but he’s still 100% sage! This literate leaf lights up the lawn and zombies alike with stories in a setting where the sun always shines supremely. Captivated zombies turn their un-lives around, producing precious sun to power plants! Evolutions would likely be plants like hypno shroom, zoybean pod, and caulipower

Melee- 3 plants
Bop chop- This lightweight hitter does one thing and one thing only! Hitting! He hits zombies so much, all of his friends do it too! Not much else to say about him. When he Evolves, he gains an extra tile of range, and can usually hit zombies behind as well.
Spikeweed- This sneaky plant has deceivingly low damage, but makes up for it by being completely ignored by most zombies and hitting everything in its range! He also strikes low, ignoring head armor! 
Phat Beats- While he isnt as rad as a radish, his beats beat up every zombie around him. Zombies that get too close get afflicted by critical damage, turning up the hurt to 11! You can also find him at local parties, alongside plants like Cornfetti Popper and Discoball Citron.

Mushrooms- 2-3 plants
Puff shroom- I think a 0 cost "fodder" or "filler" plant would be fun. It still costs a seed slot, you still have to unlock the evolutions, and it would take time to plant and merge. I think even though its always been powerful, theres still nuance. The pure tier 2 and 3 are also important since with 3 tiles range you cant even stack up 4 puff shrooms, and they could get special effects too. Maybe the pure fusion could be spore shroom since it literally is shroomception- feeding on the dead to make more mushrooms is what they do in nature!
Another feature of puff shroom could be sea shroom! We really need another amphibious plant, and I think that sea shroom could have entirely different evolutions than puff shroom, adding strategic diversity to this otherwise simple plant. Of course, I think that would require water in at least the sewers, which I think we need anyways since the amphibious mechanic is already underutilized. It could also be a separate plant that is also able to be put on land, being like puff shroom but like in pvz1 it has a way longer cooldown.
Boom Shroom- We have a lot of exploding mushrooms in previous titles! Ice shroom, doom shroom, perfume shroom, and puffball! Perfume shroom could be a merge with solar sage, enhancing other friendly zombies with an effect that reduces how much damage they take from hostile zombies.

 

 

mostly doing this for fun, what do you think?

2 Replies

  • Liber109's avatar
    Liber109
    Seasoned Rookie
    22 days ago

    Lobbers- 2 plants
    Cabbage pult- leafy lobbing leaves lasting lashes on lingering lifeforms foreign to the lawn.  Not much to say here other than it can hit flying enemies.
    Seed spitter- seed spitter has three distinct traits- lobbing, area limited multihit, and being a fruit. Many fruit plants have area limited multihit, like melon pult with a 3x3 area of effect, akee being able to hit multiple zombies in its own lane, ghost pepper (which are fruits apparently) have a 1x3 attack range before exploding, bombegranite, pepper pult, solar tomato, theres a lot of limited area multihit fruits (I want to call it that so it can fit the likes of aoe like melon pult and contained bouncing like akee, and if you want to you can consider starfruit and dragon bruit although those just have multiple projectiles). Seed spitter itself would spit a hard seed, allowing it to bounce to another zombie in the same lane. I think the pure tier 3 would be akee, but im not sure what the tier 2 would be. I could also see akee being the tier 2, with apple mortar being a tier 3.

    Support- 5 plants
    Tangle Kelp- A very versatile plant, it stuns on land and deals great damage in the water. I wish this was more reflected in plants like zapture though. I also wish more biomes had water to begin with, like at least sewers. Leaky pipes would be a fun obstacle to temporarily change up the battlefield to power up your amphibious plants.
    Wall Nut- I like wall nut a lot, I really do. I just think he charges too quick. I think walls are important and im glad he costs more now, providing support without directly affecting zombies really makes the game a lot more enjoyable since you can do things that arent just obliterate everything on sight, and its actually strategy instead of just min-maxxing. Strategic depth is very important Thats really all I have to say about him. Maybe he could make kiwi beast, using something like phat beats, maybe incorporating lychee too if it would be a tier 3?
    Blover- Since instant use plants are basically off the table, I think blover could be a staller. Periodically pushing back zombies, especially fliers, is a fun niche I think. It would combo well with other stalling tools like chill, and increase the potency of plants like spikeweed. I don't want to add plantern, at least as a tier 1, because I cant think of a mechanic for its evolutions. Ill mention it here- maybe if plantern is a tier 2 we could get disco plants like disco chomper or a disco ball citron, since plantern both has glass and makes light. I do think I want to come up with some sort of glass plant though, since magnifying grass exists. One thing I do wish though is maybe that blovers could push ambushes/drops forward, like the meteors in the volcanos, so they are less likely to hit plants or take up important backline areas, alongside other future airborne threats.
    Umbrella Leaf- I never would have thought about a counter attack mechanic- its brilliant and fun and makes umbrella leaf fusions fun. I just think there isnt enough triggers for it. Blocking attacks is really cool. Honestly this is probably the number one plant that makes me want to argue for 5 seed slots, maybe 6- I just think support plants like umbrella leaf deserve to be taxing on your seed slots. Of course you can neglect to bring it and replace your plants- so its not a necessity ever, especially if we get something like hot potato to break up those saganaki mounds. Maybe in the sewers we could get zombie goldfish that rain from the sky, since people often flush zombie goldfish down the toilet. I think umbrella leaf could deflect them.
    Grave Buster- Grave buster could deal significant damage over time to graves instead of just destroying them in a set time. This allows it to exist long enough to evolve which I think is fun. Also- its a vine, at least in pvz2, so I want to dual purpose this plant- planting it on a plant provides a thorny vine, akin to pumpkin, which can be evolved to create the vines from pvz2 (or at least some). I think a design like this helps players choose different plants, since you would only evolve one plant at a time- if they want the vines, they have to put plants in them that dont evolve with the same plants the vine does. This isnt even too limiting to the player since they can just wait for the cooldown, but it still provides thoughtful gameplay that might encourage players to switch up what they use from time to time, if they really want to. In a game about making choices matter I think a plant like this is engaging and thought provoking without requiring a challenge. Its also just nice to have ambiguous plants (like tangle kelp being plantable on land) to allow players to use familiar plants and unlocked merges in levels without the plant's main function.

    Gonna cover some elemental plants here- gonna try to do one permanent attacker and one "instant use" plant
    Electric- 2 plants
    Zaptail- I still think they should be amphibious. They're reeds. Reeds grow in the water! Other than that I think its cool. Zapture is goofy though I already suggested a rework in another thread. 
    E.M.P.each- I might have mentioned it in the robots/elements rework forum? E.M.Peach is a charge plant that unleashes a large burst of electric damage when a zombie approaches it. The more charge levels it has the bigger the area and the higher the damage. E.M.Peach serves to stun mechs using the electrical system, and is fully charged when planted. This hopefully emulates its ability from pvz2 while providing diverse usage for it and not making it an instant use. To avoid players emptying the charge and evolving just to get full charge on a higher tier plant, E.M.Peach and its evolutions can only evolve while fully charged. EMPeach (for short, I guess) can evolve into plants like citron.
    Cold- 2 plants
    Snowdrop- I want to get this plant in as a tier 1, since we know this game and heroes take place around the same time since both have the meteor Z plot point. I think a redesigned bellflower is in the files too, and the plant heroes as t4s. I have no idea what it would do without just copying gardendless. Im trying to think of it getting more powerful when chilled zombies are near, maybe creating a snowstorm. Maybe it harnesses power from chilled/frozen zombies and plants, creating snowstorms that get more intense the closer the nearest chilled zombie is. Think about it like the void spell from clash royale, which can hit everything in a wide area, but has less damage if its hitting more things. Likewise, snowdrop would create a weak but large snowstorm when the closest chilled zombie is far, but the closer it gets the more concentrated the snow is, eventually chilling by itself with the snowstorm. Higher forms would be able to target further zombies while still retaining strength relative to the closest chilled zombie. Im not sure how versatile this mechanic is, maybe this is just its own tier 2 and thats it, and some other t1 snow attacker would be added instead.
    Iceberg Lettuce- It feels really weak honestly, especially with how many zombies there are. I think its fine because it encourages you to merge it but I really do think that if youre bringing an entire seed slot for an "instant" use staller that costs sun it should be able to hold at least one zombie permanently if replaced. I also feel like snow pea and cold slaw are really just not very unique. At least numbing cabbage and iceweed are unique since numbing cabbage has more range and damage, while iceweed can hit more zombies at once. I suggested in another thread that cabbage evolutions make bigger cabbages instead of just throwing more, which would allow the cabbage to deal splash damage similar to melon pult, or in this case, winter melon. Going back to iceberg lettuce though, its also currently the only elemental to only be 25% (or 1/4th) a part of its families (whereas gremonade and lightning reed are 50% or 1/2 of their tier 3 elemental families) which I find strange, although I assume they wanted to make it different since dangerine inherits splash soley from gremonade's extra area and not as a base effect of any of its t1s, so using winter greens instead of blockwood as the pure fusion for the cold t3 family just makes every elemental t3 do splash damage. Going back to the plant itself though it would be cool if it could freeze water like the ice monkey in btd6. I know this is like the 4th amphibious plant i'd be suggesting at this point but- cmon- if youre gonna remove lily pad at least let us freeze the water 
    Poison- 2 plants
    Poison ivy- I honestly a second groundcover plant like spikeweed would be interesting to see. It would most likely inflict a damage over time debuff too, so it wouldn't need to be paired with a wall to be most efficient. It could make other poisonous plants like shadow shroom, and also provide us with other pvzh plants like poison oak.
    Lime bomb- I really hope this thing ends up making dragon bruit. Maybe as a tier 3 between like, seed spitter, threepeater, and whatever shadow tier 1 we get if we do get one? I know they want to keep tier 3s down to consisting of 3 tier 1s at most so they can have some semblance of identity and they cant just roll a random 4 plants and make weird garbage that doesnt work, which I applaud. Maybe remove seed spitter at that point or just use it being a tier 3 as an excuse to have 3 heads without threepeater. Alongside dragon bruit I cant wait for kill lime pie, I think everyone has been waiting for it. Definite posterboy of promising design. My only issue is that as a trap plant its just so dang similar to iceberg lettuce and potato mine- its really just mimics them in its pure fusions and uh... has nothing else except dangerine so its really hard to say anything, especially when potato mine really doesnt have many evolutions to differentiate itself from the other two. I think lime bomb could also be used to make lava guava, and maybe be more similar to it by leaving an acid puddle on defeat, that way it can be more unique and appealing. I also came up with the name "Lemonition" which is kinda similar to gremonade, maybe that could be a different tier 2 for lime bomb.
    Fire- 2 plants
    Cinderwood- From what we know, cinderwood isnt going to focus entirely on boosting peas but moreso on its special abilities from pvz2, those being its incredible health, melee damage, and jalapeno explosion on death. While I feel like a wall with a mild melee chip damage is just a weird endurian/lychee it is interesting and unique. I just think as a wall it should at least have the creative freedom to focus on its tree traits, and not just the fire traits. Im glad its doing more than just boosting pure peas which right now is just one tier 1 and you cant even evolve it with other plants. I did make more t1 peas to make torchwood more interesting but it may not even need that. 
    Hot Potato- When you level up hot potato in pvz2 it gains the ability to break more obstacle types. I think, regardless of level, it should be able to break more obstacles, notably saganaki blasts. Allowing it to "live" longer on higher hp obstacles allows it to be evolved. Giving it a proper lifespan and not making it an instant use is perfect for what pvz3e is aiming for

  • Liber109's avatar
    Liber109
    Seasoned Rookie
    18 days ago

    Melee Instas- 5 plants
    Buttercup- Buttercup feels too similar to wall nut so I want to make it one time use. As compensation, it will be completely free. I know people dont like free plants, but I think the cost of a seed slot is very relevant here, especially since it will have a decently long recharge. I dont want to make kernel pult a tier 1 either because its frankly just cabbage pult but slightly different, and I have another lobber in mind and I find 3 good for now. It can evolve into plants like kernel pult, butternut squash, cob cannon, cornfetti popper, buddah boom, and more.
    Squish- I really don't think squash should be a tier 1. It's always been just profoundly outstanding and I think making it a tier 2 removes the design philosophy of just increasing the area of effect for each subsequent tier which I find lame. Squish can evolve into plants like winter squash, butternut squash, smashing pumpkin, and hammer shroom.
    Devour Bloom- Devour Bloom is capable of instantly defeating a limited number of zombies on one tile before disappearing. Devour bloom will evolve into chomper at tier 2 of course, alongside other plants like snap pea (which I think should be made with pea pod, if possible), olive pit, and toadstool.
    Stallia- a tier 1 instant use plant that starts with a 3x3 area of effect- stallia is a more "watered down" insta, not being as strong but still having a good area of effect. I could see it evolving into shrinking violet, dazey chain, stunion, tomb tangler, and maybe vamporcini. I also want to mention shrinking violet since it was a contender earlier as a t1 but it felt awkward so I move it to Stallia's tier 2. I think keeping the 3x3 area gives stallia an identity, and shrinking violet is a purple flower just like stallia, and slows zombies down while also reducing their damage. Double stall! Shrinking violet could evolve into plants like hocus crocus, thyme warp, gold leaf, and, it could be used to create growing plants, like Strawburst, Kiwi Beast, and maybe even Ultomato. Maybe that could be a family- shrinking violet + a mixed tier 2 with seed spewer, since theyre all fruits, and theres 3 of them which is how big families like that usually are. The mixed tier 2 for kiwi beast could be called "stall nut"- I think that has a nice ring to it!
    Gripevine- gripevine represents ill tempered grapes- when a zombie approaches it it will launch a piercing grape from the vine, having a total of 3 before expiring. It evolves into plants like grapeshot, sour grapes, grapes of wrath, and blastberry vine.

    Now going back to some plants I want to add to previous categories ive covered- rounding out pults and all of the elementals to 3 plants a piece.

    Pults- 1 new, 3 total
    Blast Bush- Blast Bush is a tap to use tier 1 that launches berries at zombies. Blash Bush evolves into plants like Strawburst, Banana Launcher, Boom Balloon Flower, Missile Toe, Holly Barrier, and more. 

    Electric- 1 new, 3 total
    Zapricot- Zapricot targets the zombie closest to your house with a lightning strike. Evolutions include meteor flower, electric blueberry, homing thistle, laser cattail, and more

    Cold- 1 new, 3 total
    Pointsettia- pointsettia uses its sharp petals to attack nearby zombies. It has a heavy attack, meaning it works best when it can kill zombies in one hit, like bonk choy's uppercut. However, it also pierces and freezes, and can only hit very close zombies, so it wont be hitting zombies eating a wall nut. It will still hit the whole group afterwards, so its not uncommon to use them together either. Pointsettia can evolve into plants like holly barrier, jolly holly, and chard guard.

    Poison- 1 new, 3 total
    Tarlic- Tarlic is not quite your regular garlic- tarlic glues zombies mouths shut after being bitten. If nobody told zombies eating tar is bad, well, they're gonna figure it out shortly after due to the damage over time they take from this effect as well. Despite tarlic being a wall, its got as much health as your regular plants, meaning that too many zombies can take it out easily. Evolutions would likely include gumnut, olive pit, and cran jelly.

    Fire- 1 new, 3 total
    Burnsai- another tree, but burnsai is different. Actually, its going to directly steal all of cinderwood's current abilities, so I'll explain the new cinderwood here since burnsai is explained where I previously explained cinderwood. Now, cinderwood buffs projectiles again. I think its fine since when you get cinderwood, you already have peashooter, repeater, and gatling pea guaranteed. I guess it also buffs the other tier 1 peas too. However, evolutions will increase the types of projectiles it can boost, or what effect the boost causes. For example, the tier 3 of cinderwood will be able to boost Dangerine, despite it being a fruity mushroom. I think this is fun because it allows you to mix up your strategy mid level based on how many cinderwoods you can afford, starting with pure peas and getting your other plants in on the action later. If that isnt enough incentive to evolve them, I think maybe cinderwood could have a limit to how many peas it can light up via a fuel generation/limit system, say the tier 1 has a capacity of 5 peas lit and generates new fire every o.4 seconds. Back to burnsai- it could evolve into plants like inferno, gravitree, wasabi whip, and maybe even plantern. 

     

    10 new tier ones for a total of 36 tier one plants so far. Did I miss any you want to see in the game?