Nerf Zeta Barriss without making her much less viable

1) improved Rebel teams can beat Zarriss teams. Even Wiggs can go through it since the straightforward damage is so huge that it isn't covered with that 20% heal. Wiggs can go after GK/Zarriss straightforward, Leia, Han and Co can maneuver and kill all others around GK and Zarriss
2) almost any meta or half-meta team which involves DN can beat Zarriss easily.
3) Zaul lead teams are still good against Zarriss. Maul's double damage for jedi covers that heal, EP's shock is an answer for her heal
4) QGJz teams with Anakin and Ezra. They outspeed Zarriss teams, and Anakin places heal+buff immune on GK then on others, making 'em die very quickly.
I run Zarriss team now (GK, Zarriss, R2, Thrawn, DN). 1st and 3rd options are my shardmates who can beat me reliably, 2nd and 4th are the options I used earlier against Zarriss teams on my shard and had no problems.

"leef;c-1268840" wrote:

"Darklin_Sil;c-1268762" wrote:
it is rather easy to burn her down. as stated above. I believe people are saying she is weak, because she is so easy to burn down, even under a GK lead. G12 has some change to that, but that is only after full upgrade through G12

maybe i'm doing something wrong because i don't think she's easy to burn down. Maybe it's because "easy" is a relative term. I think my win/loss ratio the last ~3 months is 100-1, so one could say everything i face in arena is easy (that includes full g12 teams).
Anyway, Barriss is the 9th most used character by #1 players in the swgoh.gg meta report out of a 100+ characters. You can draw your own conclusions from that fact, but for me that's a clear indication that barriss is far from weak.

Any team that is crit heavy is going to suffer, unless it can out damage the 20% heal. So just go outside the box and instead of relying only on crit and crit damage mods, move to offense mods, or something else of that nature. Unless you are able to do enough damage ( in a single hit ) to get pass the 20% heal.
My FO team that I ran for a very long time had no issues at all with GK+Zarriss teams. Because FOTP could himself, out do any 20% heal that Zarriss put out.
Zylo would put down healing immunity on his counter attacks all the time.
ATF or FAT whichever you want to refer to her as, has HUGE issues with Zarriss, because each of her attacks are counted separately in her big attack. Where as Wedge and Biggs hits are single and large, not multiple and smaller amounts.
There are tons of other options, many have been mentioned already, some have not. But she is weak, in terms of the current meta, because most are moving towards DPS first in G12 builds, but as I did mention above already she does gain surviablity in G12. Maybe I am incorrect terming her as "weak" but weak in anything but her Zeta healing. Do not get me wrong, I understand fully why she is ranked #9, as I use her. In a GK + Zarriss, CLS, R2 and Ezra line up for Arena. There are times I do not get moved at all, and there are times I get moved to the upper teens in a 24hr period.
In a short time I think if the Veterans work out like I think they are going to, it will be an answer to Zarriss anyways. There hits will be large enough to drop pass the 20% by a large margin. The only "nerf" she needed, was the fix they already did back after giving her the Zeta, removing the effect from the rest of the squad, when she dies. Other then that, she is fine IMHO. Not because I use her, but because there are many counters for her out there already in place.

"Darklin_Sil;c-1269015" wrote:

"leef;c-1268840" wrote:

"Darklin_Sil;c-1268762" wrote:
it is rather easy to burn her down. as stated above. I believe people are saying she is weak, because she is so easy to burn down, even under a GK lead. G12 has some change to that, but that is only after full upgrade through G12

maybe i'm doing something wrong because i don't think she's easy to burn down. Maybe it's because "easy" is a relative term. I think my win/loss ratio the last ~3 months is 100-1, so one could say everything i face in arena is easy (that includes full g12 teams).
Anyway, Barriss is the 9th most used character by #1 players in the swgoh.gg meta report out of a 100+ characters. You can draw your own conclusions from that fact, but for me that's a clear indication that barriss is far from weak.

Any team that is crit heavy is going to suffer, unless it can out damage the 20% heal. So just go outside the box and instead of relying only on crit and crit damage mods, move to offense mods, or something else of that nature. Unless you are able to do enough damage ( in a single hit ) to get pass the 20% heal.
My FO team that I ran for a very long time had no issues at all with GK+Zarriss teams. Because FOTP could himself, out do any 20% heal that Zarriss put out.
Zylo would put down healing immunity on his counter attacks all the time.
ATF or FAT whichever you want to refer to her as, has HUGE issues with Zarriss, because each of her attacks are counted separately in her big attack. Where as Wedge and Biggs hits are single and large, not multiple and smaller amounts.
There are tons of other options, many have been mentioned already, some have not. But she is weak, in terms of the current meta, because most are moving towards DPS first in G12 builds, but as I did mention above already she does gain surviablity in G12. Maybe I am incorrect terming her as "weak" but weak in anything but her Zeta healing. Do not get me wrong, I understand fully why she is ranked #9, as I use her. In a GK + Zarriss, CLS, R2 and Ezra line up for Arena. There are times I do not get moved at all, and there are times I get moved to the upper teens in a 24hr period.
In a short time I think if the Veterans work out like I think they are going to, it will be an answer to Zarriss anyways. There hits will be large enough to drop pass the 20% by a large margin. The only "nerf" she needed, was the fix they already did back after giving her the Zeta, removing the effect from the rest of the squad, when she dies. Other then that, she is fine IMHO. Not because I use her, but because there are many counters for her out there already in place.

If she's weak, why on earth do you use her in arena? smh
She is very good in the current meta, as a matter of fact she hasn't been this common in a while in arena. I'm even wiling to go as far as stating kenobi+barriss is the counter to all the luke lead rebel teams out there.
I have no issues defeating teams with barriss. That doesn't change the fact that she doesn't go down easy. It requires some thought and/or some specific toons to beat those teams. One of those gamechanger youtubers even made a vid on how to deal with kenobi barriss teams. If she was weak and those teams were easy to defeat, he would have never made that vid.
I honestly don't know why i need to convince you that a toon you use in arena isn't weak. I never lose vs teams with barriss, nor do i want her nerfed, but calling her weak is beyond rediculous. Are you worried they will nerf her (for the 3rd time lol)? because that's the only reason i can come up with to why people who use barriss call barriss weak. Objectively speaking barriss is well above average.

DN lead, healing immunity, High Damagers, tanks, DN in general etc.

IMO she needs a BUFF, she is 100% worthless other that that zeta which is the only reason anyone runs her. I'm thinking give her a revive or protection heal.

Personally think zBarris is trash but sometimes she is a hassle in GW. Don't think she needs a buff or a nerf. she is what she is.

Leave Barris aloooone!

For petes sake yall... barris has been nerfed twice already... she is just fine as is.

"cannon_fodder;c-1269790" wrote:

"Crazylazyguy;c-1268738" wrote:

"Joost;c-1268731" wrote:

"Crazylazyguy;c-1268729" wrote:

"sneeekypants;c-1268712" wrote:
GK+zarris is only hard for people that can't think beyond straight DPS. No different than people who think Chaze is still op.

This. Fracture/Buff Immune GK, proceed to hit another character -> character gets crit immunity -> have fun killing him.

Or just use CLS that crits for 35k and get rid of her.

Because everyone has Thrawn or Cls...

Can you not read? I explicitly said BUFF IMMUNE on GK OR Fracture. CLS isn't the only hero capable of putting Buff Immunity.

Lots of holes and unnecessary patronizing in this comment. I don't see Bariss in arena. I see her on Node 12, when she's in a team that's much stronger than my best team. For those of use with just a few characters that are close to fully developed (I have one whole zeta - usually see 10-12 per GW including four on Node 12) but not the whole toolbox, the 'special requirement' associated with defeating this team is a bit much. It requires us to have a character with the specified skill set BUFF IMMUNE / FRACTURE - at a competitive level of gear (G10...probably not, G11 ok, G12 - none of those yet either) and mods.

No Thrawn for me, so that means BUFF IMMUNITY (if it lands, these guys also have ridiculous tenacity) or Shock - great I have CLS - unfortunately, since she's G12 and on someone's arena team, she's also really fast, so the passive dispel kicks in before I can apply nearly enough damage to take on GK's massive G12 health pool.

I'm sure it's fine in certain circumstances - everything has a counter, but there are certain places where this specific combination has no business in my opinion.

So basically, just restating what @NightfallsCurse said.

If you have CLS and run him in arena, that's pretty much the reason you're seeing her in GW. GK/Zarriss is the counter to the high crit damage rebel meta. As far as GW if you only have your arena team then you need to diversify and make it so when you get to nodes 9+ you have some teams. Loading all of your teams up with TM in the early nodes can help a team that is less geared in later nodes.

If anybody here calling for a nerf on Barriss uses CLS or any of the reworked rebels, then shame on you! The power creep has a very situational counter, and even then its not a great counter. Get over it or work on ways to beat it...

"leef;c-1269134" wrote:

"Darklin_Sil;c-1269015" wrote:

"leef;c-1268840" wrote:

"Darklin_Sil;c-1268762" wrote:
it is rather easy to burn her down. as stated above. I believe people are saying she is weak, because she is so easy to burn down, even under a GK lead. G12 has some change to that, but that is only after full upgrade through G12

maybe i'm doing something wrong because i don't think she's easy to burn down. Maybe it's because "easy" is a relative term. I think my win/loss ratio the last ~3 months is 100-1, so one could say everything i face in arena is easy (that includes full g12 teams).
Anyway, Barriss is the 9th most used character by #1 players in the swgoh.gg meta report out of a 100+ characters. You can draw your own conclusions from that fact, but for me that's a clear indication that barriss is far from weak.

Any team that is crit heavy is going to suffer, unless it can out damage the 20% heal. So just go outside the box and instead of relying only on crit and crit damage mods, move to offense mods, or something else of that nature. Unless you are able to do enough damage ( in a single hit ) to get pass the 20% heal.
My FO team that I ran for a very long time had no issues at all with GK+Zarriss teams. Because FOTP could himself, out do any 20% heal that Zarriss put out.
Zylo would put down healing immunity on his counter attacks all the time.
ATF or FAT whichever you want to refer to her as, has HUGE issues with Zarriss, because each of her attacks are counted separately in her big attack. Where as Wedge and Biggs hits are single and large, not multiple and smaller amounts.
There are tons of other options, many have been mentioned already, some have not. But she is weak, in terms of the current meta, because most are moving towards DPS first in G12 builds, but as I did mention above already she does gain surviablity in G12. Maybe I am incorrect terming her as "weak" but weak in anything but her Zeta healing. Do not get me wrong, I understand fully why she is ranked #9, as I use her. In a GK + Zarriss, CLS, R2 and Ezra line up for Arena. There are times I do not get moved at all, and there are times I get moved to the upper teens in a 24hr period.
In a short time I think if the Veterans work out like I think they are going to, it will be an answer to Zarriss anyways. There hits will be large enough to drop pass the 20% by a large margin. The only "nerf" she needed, was the fix they already did back after giving her the Zeta, removing the effect from the rest of the squad, when she dies. Other then that, she is fine IMHO. Not because I use her, but because there are many counters for her out there already in place.

If she's weak, why on earth do you use her in arena? smh
She is very good in the current meta, as a matter of fact she hasn't been this common in a while in arena. I'm even wiling to go as far as stating kenobi+barriss is the counter to all the luke lead rebel teams out there.
I have no issues defeating teams with barriss. That doesn't change the fact that she doesn't go down easy. It requires some thought and/or some specific toons to beat those teams. One of those gamechanger youtubers even made a vid on how to deal with kenobi barriss teams. If she was weak and those teams were easy to defeat, he would have never made that vid.
I honestly don't know why i need to convince you that a toon you use in arena isn't weak. I never lose vs teams with barriss, nor do i want her nerfed, but calling her weak is beyond rediculous. Are you worried they will nerf her (for the 3rd time lol)? because that's the only reason i can come up with to why people who use barriss call barriss weak. Objectively speaking barriss is well above average.

Zarris may be above average, but that's not saying much. Imo, She doesn't need a nerf, but I do think she needs a buff. I used to run her but dropped too much for my taste. I realize shards are relative, and what doesn't work for me, may in turn work for others. On offense, I just plow gk down with FF (I can do enough Dmg), then I'll FF Barris, then dn - who never gets an annihilate off lately. Now if I couldn't do the Dmg I do, I'd have to change my strategy because it will be a lot tougher.

"ImYourHuckleberry;c-1271858" wrote:

"leef;c-1269134" wrote:

"Darklin_Sil;c-1269015" wrote:

"leef;c-1268840" wrote:

"Darklin_Sil;c-1268762" wrote:
it is rather easy to burn her down. as stated above. I believe people are saying she is weak, because she is so easy to burn down, even under a GK lead. G12 has some change to that, but that is only after full upgrade through G12

maybe i'm doing something wrong because i don't think she's easy to burn down. Maybe it's because "easy" is a relative term. I think my win/loss ratio the last ~3 months is 100-1, so one could say everything i face in arena is easy (that includes full g12 teams).
Anyway, Barriss is the 9th most used character by #1 players in the swgoh.gg meta report out of a 100+ characters. You can draw your own conclusions from that fact, but for me that's a clear indication that barriss is far from weak.

Any team that is crit heavy is going to suffer, unless it can out damage the 20% heal. So just go outside the box and instead of relying only on crit and crit damage mods, move to offense mods, or something else of that nature. Unless you are able to do enough damage ( in a single hit ) to get pass the 20% heal.
My FO team that I ran for a very long time had no issues at all with GK+Zarriss teams. Because FOTP could himself, out do any 20% heal that Zarriss put out.
Zylo would put down healing immunity on his counter attacks all the time.
ATF or FAT whichever you want to refer to her as, has HUGE issues with Zarriss, because each of her attacks are counted separately in her big attack. Where as Wedge and Biggs hits are single and large, not multiple and smaller amounts.
There are tons of other options, many have been mentioned already, some have not. But she is weak, in terms of the current meta, because most are moving towards DPS first in G12 builds, but as I did mention above already she does gain surviablity in G12. Maybe I am incorrect terming her as "weak" but weak in anything but her Zeta healing. Do not get me wrong, I understand fully why she is ranked #9, as I use her. In a GK + Zarriss, CLS, R2 and Ezra line up for Arena. There are times I do not get moved at all, and there are times I get moved to the upper teens in a 24hr period.
In a short time I think if the Veterans work out like I think they are going to, it will be an answer to Zarriss anyways. There hits will be large enough to drop pass the 20% by a large margin. The only "nerf" she needed, was the fix they already did back after giving her the Zeta, removing the effect from the rest of the squad, when she dies. Other then that, she is fine IMHO. Not because I use her, but because there are many counters for her out there already in place.

If she's weak, why on earth do you use her in arena? smh
She is very good in the current meta, as a matter of fact she hasn't been this common in a while in arena. I'm even wiling to go as far as stating kenobi+barriss is the counter to all the luke lead rebel teams out there.
I have no issues defeating teams with barriss. That doesn't change the fact that she doesn't go down easy. It requires some thought and/or some specific toons to beat those teams. One of those gamechanger youtubers even made a vid on how to deal with kenobi barriss teams. If she was weak and those teams were easy to defeat, he would have never made that vid.
I honestly don't know why i need to convince you that a toon you use in arena isn't weak. I never lose vs teams with barriss, nor do i want her nerfed, but calling her weak is beyond rediculous. Are you worried they will nerf her (for the 3rd time lol)? because that's the only reason i can come up with to why people who use barriss call barriss weak. Objectively speaking barriss is well above average.

Zarris may be above average, but that's not saying much. Imo, She doesn't need a nerf, but I do think she needs a buff. I used to run her but dropped too much for my taste. I realize shards are relative, and what doesn't work for me, may in turn work for others. On offense, I just plow gk down with FF (I can do enough Dmg), then I'll FF Barris, then dn - who never gets an annihilate off lately. Now if I couldn't do the Dmg I do, I'd have to change my strategy because it will be a lot tougher.

I'm with you all the way except for barriss needing a buff. I mean, really? She's one of the better characters in the game currently. 8th most used character on swgoh #1 squads.
Also, i think i can't plow GK down when zeta barriss is active, probably can't even plow barriss herself down. I'm reasonably sure just FF isn't enough for alot of other players either when facing kenobi+zeta barriss, wich is probably why she's so popular. Well, that and because AI can't FF so I assume she makes winning on offence a cake walk vs those pesky luke lead rebels.