Smuggler’s Run: Han doesn’t shoot first! Say what?!

@Kyno do you still need to defend this absurd thing? Description clearly states that bonus turn so it can be simply assumed that without any tm filling activity han should attack with his basic. If you say that this must be done with tm mechanic han does not get %100 tm but %100+ tm calculated by his speed rate. Then when he shots he uses 100 of it and rest will stay on the blue bar. Actually its nothing to worry about that much event can be done even he does not shot first but defending CG this much makes you funny and unreliable.

"Spang;c-1649264" wrote:

"Waqui;c-1649223" wrote:
The receiver appears to be immune to facts.

And also conveniently ignores the remarks about GMY's special ability fail.

If what was reported regarding GMY is a bug and not intended behaviour, then that's a different situation. However, if it's intended, that GMY may not always performs his actions immediately after using his special, then we have the same situation - inconsistency between description and behaviour, and also flaws in Kyno's reasoning.

"Lightsabermon;c-1648981" wrote:

I assume, when he was added to the game, (not a day 1 player), he was the only start of encounter turn, so he would only coin flip against other raid hans.

True. He was the only one with such an ability. The next start of encounter/battle behaviour introduced was the pre-taunt of shoretrooper. However, it may still have been the case back then, that there could be turn meter ties, f.ex. when moving to a new wave in a battle or to a new node in GW with Rex and Han on the same team.

The TM mechanics are unchanged. Han starts an encounter with 100% TM. Anyone else at 100% TM can also go. When Han's special was introduced, there weren't nearly as many TM shenanigans so the likelihood of having multiple toons at 100% at the start of a round was low. Now, with all of the %TM gains (zEP / JTR / etc. etc.), it's commonplace and we noticed it a lot more. I've actually seen an instance where the Tank in P2 didn't take a turn coming out of a topple before it got toppled again.

Is it "right"? Depends on your opinion, but it's accurate. Should the mechanic for "taking the next immediate action", like GMY's, be more broadly applied? I believe so, and it should be applied to Thrawn, CLS, FOO, and any other direct TM manipulators. That explicit action should override passive TM gains from leaderships/uniques, again IMHO, but those are just opinions.

The theorycrafting guild is strong in this thread ;)

But events also do not “have” to follow standard “kit” rules but very noted to the thoughts here

Also big thanks to Kyno as always trying to give community logical background info. Appreciate the respectful disagreements.

"Boov;c-1649376" wrote:
Are you guys really that upset about han not shooting first now, after it has been like this for ages..
I love seeying everyone go in on kyno like this and him easily holding his own. Everyone seems to think he's against them when he's just clarifying something. It's quite entertaining.

You clearly missed my point. I fully support the way Han's ability works. My point is, that the description of the ability is ambiguous in its own, and when relating that description and the behavioyr it describes to the ones of GMY's special ability, there's a very clear inconsistency.

@Boov

Kyno's defense of the behaviour of Han's ability is irrelevant to my own point. He and I agree, that it works as intended. However his defense of the way the ability description is worded is weak and flawed.

"Vampire_X;c-1649525" wrote:
The theorycrafting guild is strong in this thread ;)

But events also do not “have” to follow standard “kit” rules but very noted to the thoughts here

Also big thanks to Kyno as always trying to give community logical background info. Appreciate the respectful disagreements.

If taking a bonus turn means gaining 100% TM (Han's shoot first), then gaining an immediate bonus turn (GMY's Masterstroke) would indicate gaining 100% turn meter immediately. Only it doesn't. According to Kyno, GMY also bypasses all coin flips.

I don't see any logical background (your words) here. Kyno fails to explain the logic behind the wording in the ability descriptions. Maybe you could help him help us all?

Yes, he describes the behaviour of the two abilitirs well. No problem there.

"Waqui;c-1649591" wrote:
@Boov

Kyno's defense of the behaviour of Han's ability is irrelevant to my own point. He and I agree, that it works as intended. However his defense of the way the ability description is worded is weak and flawed.

"BubbaFett;c-1649519" wrote:

"cannonfodder_iv;c-1649486" wrote:
The TM mechanics are unchanged. Han starts an encounter with 100% TM. Anyone else at 100% TM can also go. When Han's special was introduced, there weren't nearly as many TM shenanigans so the likelihood of having multiple toons at 100% at the start of a round was low. Now, with all of the %TM gains (zEP / JTR / etc. etc.), it's commonplace and we noticed it a lot more. I've actually seen an instance where the Tank in P2 didn't take a turn coming out of a topple before it got toppled again.

Is it "right"? Depends on your opinion, but it's accurate. Should the mechanic for "taking the next immediate action", like GMY's, be more broadly applied? I believe so, and it should be applied to Thrawn, CLS, FOO, and any other direct TM manipulators. That explicit action should override passive TM gains from leaderships/uniques, again IMHO, but those are just opinions.

Then they need to change the wording of his kit.....

@BubbaFett @Waqui Is this better? Not that the wording of the ability itself (unchanged) nowhere states that he will be the first to take a turn.

"cannonfodder_iv;c-1649619" wrote:

"Waqui;c-1649591" wrote:
@Boov

Kyno's defense of the behaviour of Han's ability is irrelevant to my own point. He and I agree, that it works as intended. However his defense of the way the ability description is worded is weak and flawed.

"BubbaFett;c-1649519" wrote:

"cannonfodder_iv;c-1649486" wrote:
The TM mechanics are unchanged. Han starts an encounter with 100% TM. Anyone else at 100% TM can also go. When Han's special was introduced, there weren't nearly as many TM shenanigans so the likelihood of having multiple toons at 100% at the start of a round was low. Now, with all of the %TM gains (zEP / JTR / etc. etc.), it's commonplace and we noticed it a lot more. I've actually seen an instance where the Tank in P2 didn't take a turn coming out of a topple before it got toppled again.

Is it "right"? Depends on your opinion, but it's accurate. Should the mechanic for "taking the next immediate action", like GMY's, be more broadly applied? I believe so, and it should be applied to Thrawn, CLS, FOO, and any other direct TM manipulators. That explicit action should override passive TM gains from leaderships/uniques, again IMHO, but those are just opinions.

Then they need to change the wording of his kit.....

@BubbaFett @Waqui Is this better? Not that the wording of the ability itself (unchanged) nowhere states that he will be the first to take a turn.

I never, ever claimed, that Han should be guaranteed to take the first action. What's your point? You clearly missed my point, but please explain yours. It doesn't make sense as a response to me.