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AbC8356a5175033's avatar
AbC8356a5175033
New Rookie
20 days ago

The update issue isn't the rewards...

Players on these forums stating that F2P players are getting the same (or better) rewards as pre-update aren't wrong, the maths has been done and (mostly) bears that out - though there may be variance based on GC feats, due to teams like Jawas or Tuskens being needed. The problem with the update isn't the literal rewards, it's psychological.

Before the update, players seeing a progress bar appear - say when they completed the farm for a GL pre-requirement character - would know that they had made real, tangible progress towards their progression within the game, and as a result would feel a sense of accomplishment that pushed them to continue playing.

After the update, a progress bar appearing now gives a feeling of "Is this actual progress, or a paywalled feat?", which in turn results in that player not feeling the sense of accomplishment, and instead subconsciously feeling conflicted - are they making progress, or is this another thing telling them "You should buy [insert latest new thing]."?

Similarly, Galactic Challenges used to be a steady source of positivity - players were rewarded for having a wide roster that allowed them to theory-craft in order to complete trickier feats, but at the very least they could usually rely on being able to obtain some level of rewards from the "Complete the battle." feat. Which in turn gave them the incentive to continue playing - they could see they were going to get some rewards, and if they were clever about how they used their roster, they could get more rewards.

Reaching the red box was a reason for a sense of personal satisfaction - you, the player, had put your roster and brain to the test, and come away victorious. And that feeling of satisfaction led you to want to keep playing - maybe a Conquest battle or two, maybe try your luck in fleet arena, or GAC/TW/TB. The player was psychologically rewarded for completing a task, which lead to the desire for further reward, which led directly to that player spending more time playing the game.

With the new structure, the rewards are the same. Mathematically, I don't dispute that. Objectively, yes they are the same or better for the majority of players. But the cycle of "Complete task -> Get reward" is broken now. Because players are completing the task of GC feats, but are seeing no immediate payoff, or even the promise of one in the near future (for those that completed GCs on day 1). All that we are seeing now, is "Task completed, here is one or two levels of a battlepass, wait 3 days then repeat." Which, yes. That is some level of reward. But it has a vastly different feel to the previous system.

Not only that, but due to the paywalling of 2 out of 4 feats, players are also forced to look at the feats they couldn't complete because they didn't - or couldn't - spend money, which just leaves a sour taste in our mouths. Getting 100% in a GC was cause for celebration, now it's impossible unless we spend hundreds or get extremely lucky with an RNG-based shard pack. And spend $20 on top of that.

The Task -> Reward -> Desire To Do More Tasks cycle was integral to F2P players, and even to whales, krakens, dolphins, minnows, etc.; it was the thing that kept us playing. Breaking that cycle, especially at a time when there is already enormous player displeasure at all spending levels with the state of the game, is not a smart thing to have done.

I am very doubtful - the cynic in me, probably - that CG will really care about F2P quitting as a result of this. I am doubtful they will care if dolphins or minnows quit, either. But when all those players quit, who is left for the whales and krakens to flex their maxed out rosters on? Each other? Maxed roster vs maxed roster, the top-end players will inevitably become angry at the lack of easy wins for having spent money.

Some will, inevitably, double down and spend more, convinced that the next dollar they spend will be the one that puts them on top. A lot more, however, will give it up as a bad investment, and also quit. And that spiral of quitting will continue until there is no one left playing the game except a few spending addicts who are just too deep in the hole to realise the damage, at which point the servers will be unsustainable and the game will shut down.

Because the problem isn't about the rewards. Whether we get the same rewards as before, fewer, or more, is ultimately irrelevant. The problem is the psychological impact of the changes, and those are a net negative here. The game will bleed players because of this, unless things are changed. Whether that bleed is a slow ooze or a gushing haemorrhage is entirely dependent on how CG responds to the feedback - and yes, outrage. Justified outrage, frankly - to this update.

That's a lot of words of criticism and analysis of the issue, admittedly. So, with that in mind, and in the spirit of "Never criticise without offering a path to improvement.", here are some immediate, fairly easy changes that could help:

1. Change the way feats are set up in Galactic Challenges under the new system. A good method for this was posted on Reddit (apologies, I can't remember who posted it - it might have been egnards?), in which all 4 feats can be completed without any requirement to spend money - so no "Complete the battle with the Episode Pass active" or "Complete the battle with [Newest Marquee] at 7 stars" feats. To ensure that CG's monetisation remains intact, reduce the Episode Track Points for each feat to half the current value, and add an option to claim a second set of those points if the player has an active Episode Pass.

2. Add some small rewards to Galactic Challenges in addition to the ETPs. It doesn't have to break the bank - the majority of rewards being in the new store is fine, since players do get the same rewards on average as before - but some small thing to give that immediate psychological sensation of "I completed this challenge, and now I can see I'm definitely going to be rewarded for it". A few mod slicing mats would do here, just something tangible to return the cycle of "Complete Task -> Get Reward -> Want To Keep Playing".

3. Add a filter option for quest progress - something like "Do not show quests that cannot be completed without an active Episode Pass." or simply "Do not show progress on quests that cannot be claimed." to cover Marquee quests. The endless parade of these pop-ups just feels bad, and reduces the satisfaction of players who are used to pop-ups meaning they have made tangible progress.

And, admittedly not directly related to the issues discussed in this post:

4. Make an honest effort to engage in good faith with the playerbase. By that, I mean implement something like a weekly Q&A blog post, where someone from the team answers questions submitted throughout the course of the week by players on the forums, in a similar vein to the Q&A posts made for new marquee units.

If players feel that they have an actual way to get their questions answered by the team, rather than CG just occasionally yelling "Gardy-loo!" and emptying the **bleep** bucket on the players' heads from the castle windows, then they are more likely to utilise that method, rather than simply yelling (technically typing, but you know what I mean) angrily on the forums. A weekly Q&A post wouldn't solve every issue instantly, but it would provide a way for players to actually see that the team at CG are listening, taking feedback onboard, and working with them.

We play this game because it's fun for us, and because we love Star Wars, and because we've made friends through the game. But if you remove the fun aspect, as this new update seems to be doing, then eventually our love of the IP begins to fade - or worse, become hate - and at that point we're playing for the sake of our guildmates. And when our guildmates are the only thing keeping us playing, all it takes is a couple people getting burnt out and quitting for it to snowball into the collapse of entire guilds.

I hope sincerely that the team will at least consider some of the points I made in this post, but given The State of the Galaxy Game right now, I am unfortunately skeptical of it. But if nothing else, I wanted to at least have put my thoughts and feelings in writing properly, so if it achieves nothing else, at least it was cathartic for me.

Have a great day folks, whether SWGOH is part of it or not, and I hope you achieve something positive that you've been hoping for. ❤️

  • Drogo1's avatar
    Drogo1
    Seasoned Newcomer

    100% agree. I don’t care as much about the rewards, I don’t like how in your face the paywalls are. Before we had the store where you could go check out packs if you were so inclined. Now, you see these paywalls in several game modes and pop up’s constantly. It does take the fun out of things.

    The main thing I liked about this game (besides Star Wars) was the slower pace and sense of accomplishment when unlocking a GL or finishing a Challange. I quit playing Marvel Strike Force when they started pumping out new teams every month that you had to chase to keep up, really hoping swgoh doesn’t get like that but it seems to be trending that way.

  • Well said! I like the (justified) criticism AND the practical solutions, whether they were your idea or someone else's. Kudos for the problem solving solutions.

    There were things I was really looking forward to in this update, and things I was skeptical of. Having seen the implementation of it, I'm left feeling mostly disappointed. I'm not a huge spender, maybe a guppy, maybe a clown fish, but I do invest in the game, mostly because when someone makes a product that I'm enjoying I feel they deserve something for that products development. And hey, it helps me progress in my goals too.

    Having seen the implementation of the update, I can honestly say that at this moment the only thing I appreciate about it now is the fact that all energy counts towards tickets. As an officer, I appreciate not worrying about people getting their tickets. If CG fulfills their promise of the Simmable events, that will be another thing that I'll be extremely grateful for.. but since Contraband Cargo wasn't simmable, I have no confidence in the others being so, and this leads towards that disappointed.

    CG said this update was developed with F2P in mind. As such, I decided to play this ET as a F2P player. The results I'm left feeling is that of complete disappointment in my progress. I've accomplished everything I can towards the ET, but having only hit a few early milestones so far, it just feels like I'm not making progress, not getting the same rewards. I get it, the math says I will by the end. But the daily/weekly progression we've been so used to for 9 years isn't there anymore. Instead I have glaring accomplished feats waiting to be claimed locked behind a pay wall that stares at you every time you open your Quests menu. Again it could be psychological, but it feels like you're losing rewards you've gotten for free in the past. And not only does it feel like I'm not getting the rewards I used to get for free, but now I have to keep a close eye on the ET store to buy the remaining rewards that used to just be rewarded or delivered to my inbox. This is not a good feeling!

    Another thing, it's minor, I know, but I used to like collecting my energies individually instead of collectively at once. I used to keep an eye on my timers and collect so as not to waste minutes if I was collecting energy that would put me over 144. Also, something that SHOULD be adjusted; when bonus energy is available, we should see how much time we have left to collect it before it expires. We used to have that before the update. We don't now. If I'm busy (at work or watching the kids), I should be able to see how much time I have left to collect instead of trying to mentally count or remember when it's going to end. That was a poor decision to take that out of the game.

    All-in-all, this has been a disappointing update. I wanted to be hopeful for it with the promise of all energy counting towards tickets and simmable events, but the overall implementation of this update just feels bad. Everyday feels like if I didn't pay for the ET then I'm quickly falling behind. I like the solutions that the OP offered and I think it would go a long way in making progress and possibly redirecting this wayward ship. I hope CG is taking input from their player base...

  • Now I've had time to go through and do the maths I'm OK with the update mostly. This part is what I would like to see fixed ASAP: 

    3. Add a filter option for quest progress - something like "Do not show quests that cannot be completed without an active Episode Pass." or simply "Do not show progress on quests that cannot be claimed." to cover Marquee quests. The endless parade of these pop-ups just feels bad, and reduces the satisfaction of players who are used to pop-ups meaning they have made tangible progress.

  • Jopun11's avatar
    Jopun11
    Seasoned Newcomer

    But now 2 of 4 tasks in gc are behind pay wall. So now i have no reason to do most of gc anyway bcs i have no teams to go with it ruins lots fun for me

  • This is excellently summarized and the possible solutions well thought-out. I really hope they consider these. 

  • 1amoutofideas's avatar
    1amoutofideas
    Seasoned Newcomer

    I agree here on most points. 

    I like the progression track idea, and the revamp. I think the feats need to be redone, as it stiffs out a majority of the playerbase. I've been playing for 3 years now, and I don't have a rebel fighter team up high enough to beat the 2 feats of this GC, where previously, I could always get 3 of 4. 

     The pass already has enough of a motivation/"value added" to buy it, the extra feats taking away from f2p enjoyment is bad. Just add  the rewards to the huyang 7star quests, and upon purchase of the pass. 

    It's also really annoying to me that the kyro quantity is only 2. I know mathematically it works out, but could you make that shop refresh monthly or something, so I don't have to look once a week to buy 4% of a single gear piece lmao? Or maybe just keep the weekly refresh, and up the quantity of kryos to 10. It's just such a small number, it feels like a chore comparatively to a reward.