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RaxleAlucard199's avatar
3 years ago

Unpopular opinion on the new GAC System

As the title would suggest, I am one of the very few people that finds the new GAC System much more fair. I think the new system is brilliant in terms of fairness of Crystal rewards and in general eve...

About SWGOH General Discussion

Discuss and share your feedback on Star Wars: Galaxy of Heroes with fellow players.78,578 PostsLatest Activity: 8 hours ago
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General Discussion","repliesProperties":{"__typename":"RepliesProperties","sortOrder":"PUBLISH_TIME","repliesFormat":"linear"},"topicsCount":78578,"messageActivity":{"__typename":"MessageActivity","corePropertyChangeTime":"2025-01-22T20:11:59.822Z"},"tagProperties":{"__typename":"TagNodeProperties","tagsEnabled":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":null}},"requireTags":false,"tagType":"PRESET_ONLY"},"User:user:94640":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:94640","uid":94640,"login":"RaxleAlucard199","deleted":false,"avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://forums.ea.com/t5/s/tghpe58374/m_assets/avatars/default/avatar-10.svg"},"rank":null,"email":"","messagesCount":0,"biography":null,"topicsCount":0,"kudosReceivedCount":1,"kudosGivenCount":1,"kudosWeight":1,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2021-01-03T22:33:28.000Z","confirmEmailStatus":null},"followersCount":null,"solutionsCount":0},"ForumTopicMessage:message:4012503":{"__typename":"ForumTopicMessage","uid":4012503,"subject":"Unpopular opinion on the new GAC System","id":"message:4012503","revisionNum":1,"repliesCount":45,"author":{"__ref":"User:user:94640"},"depth":0,"hasGivenKudo":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:swgoh-general-discussion-en"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:4012503"},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:4012503"},"body@stripHtml({\"truncateLength\":200})":"As the title would suggest, I am one of the very few people that finds the new GAC System much more fair. I think the new system is brilliant in terms of fairness of Crystal rewards and in general eve...","body@stringLength":"1793","rawBody":"As the title would suggest, I am one of the very few people that finds the new GAC System much more fair. I think the new system is brilliant in terms of fairness of Crystal rewards and in general everyone outside of Kyber 1 would get roughly 50/50 Win/Loss rate if they participate in GAC regularly.

That said, I do have one minor suggestion that I think would improve the enjoyment aspect of the new System on top of the Improvements it has already made towards Fairness of Rewards.

Currently, I haven't noticed any pattern when it comes to grouping people of the same Skill Rating in a GAC Bracket (The groups of 8 players, that get made three times per GAC Season)

If the developers could add an intermediate step before the grouping - To sort all players of the same Skill rating by GP (Galactic Power). What this will achieve is:

- Skilled players with lower GP would more often get matched with other skilled players with lower GP
- Inactive players with higher GP would more often get matched with other Inactive players with higher GP

In general, I believe this tweak should be quite easy to do for the developers. And it will increase the Fun aspect of GAC, without decreasing the Fairness of Rewards aspect. Let me know what you guys think :smile:

Note: As a developer myself, that intermediate step could be made even better, by a more sophisticated algorithm to sort by a summary of GP of the top *NUMBER OF CHARACTERS BASED ON A DIVISION/LEAGUE*. Thus achieving even better grouping for very skilled players that are very careful with their resource management. But... this improvement will have very minimal effect for the playerbase as whole, so I understand if the developers are too busy for this one.","kudosSumWeight":1,"postTime":"2022-11-23T11:56:18.000Z","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"tags":{"__typename":"TagConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[{"__typename":"TagEdge","cursor":"MjQuMTF8Mi4xfG98MTB8X05WX3wx","node":{"__typename":"Tag","id":"tag:pvp","text":"pvp","time":"2016-05-17T20:58:15.000+01:00","lastActivityTime":null,"messagesCount":null,"followersCount":null}}]},"timeToRead":2,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:4012503_1"},"latestVersion":null,"metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":1910},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","canonicalUrl":null,"seoTitle":null,"seoDescription":null,"isEscalated":null,"placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}},"archivalData":null,"customFields":[],"body":"As the title would suggest, I am one of the very few people that finds the new GAC System much more fair. I think the new system is brilliant in terms of fairness of Crystal rewards and in general everyone outside of Kyber 1 would get roughly 50/50 Win/Loss rate if they participate in GAC regularly.

That said, I do have one minor suggestion that I think would improve the enjoyment aspect of the new System on top of the Improvements it has already made towards Fairness of Rewards.

Currently, I haven't noticed any pattern when it comes to grouping people of the same Skill Rating in a GAC Bracket (The groups of 8 players, that get made three times per GAC Season)

If the developers could add an intermediate step before the grouping - To sort all players of the same Skill rating by GP (Galactic Power). What this will achieve is:

- Skilled players with lower GP would more often get matched with other skilled players with lower GP
- Inactive players with higher GP would more often get matched with other Inactive players with higher GP

In general, I believe this tweak should be quite easy to do for the developers. And it will increase the Fun aspect of GAC, without decreasing the Fairness of Rewards aspect. Let me know what you guys think :smile:

Note: As a developer myself, that intermediate step could be made even better, by a more sophisticated algorithm to sort by a summary of GP of the top *NUMBER OF CHARACTERS BASED ON A DIVISION/LEAGUE*. Thus achieving even better grouping for very skilled players that are very careful with their resource management. But... this improvement will have very minimal effect for the playerbase as whole, so I understand if the developers are too busy for this one."},"Conversation:conversation:4012503":{"__typename":"Conversation","id":"conversation:4012503","solved":false,"topic":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:4012503"},"lastPostingActivityTime":"2022-11-30T00:10:40.000Z","lastPostTime":"2022-11-30T00:10:40.000Z","unreadReplyCount":45,"isSubscribed":false},"ModerationData:moderation_data:4012503":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:4012503","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"Revision:revision:4012503_1":{"__typename":"Revision","id":"revision:4012503_1","lastEditTime":"2022-11-23T11:56:18.000Z"},"ForumReplyMessage:message:4012547":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","id":"message:4012547","conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:4012503"},"author":{"__ref":"User:user:151952"},"revisionNum":1,"uid":4012547,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:swgoh-general-discussion-en"},"subject":"Re: Unpopular opinion on the new GAC System","readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:4012547"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:4012503"},"body":"I think new accounts still start based on GP. I saw some player jump in at Carbonite 3 recently; who had more GP than the average starter.

\"Does it account for the difference of banners in each battle?\"

No, it does not. The issue here would be how difficult a defence your opponent has set. Some set more difficult defences (therefore expect a lower scoring game) than others.

\"What about when players throw the battle or don't show up? Should the \"win\" be as meaningful?\"

You can only play your game. You shouldn't be penalized for another's actions. It is a league system after all. Also the defences are not altered from what you last set (unless you alter them manually). So a player can't actually throw matches.

\"Does punishing players that don't show up make the experience better for those in lower leagues?\"

Yes, this is a big issue. There appears to be a not small proportion of players doing the minimum to collect rewards falling down the leagues and creating unintended match ups. The wins are then determined on whether they play or not.

\"Should a players highest rank (over a period of time) be considered?\"

Hmmmmmmmmmm interesting thought. However, at what period of time do you take that 'highest rank'. If from the start, you're just taking GP into account and basically resetting the leagues. This is unfair on the more casual players that legitimately have fallen leagues/divisions and are now playing more balanced games.

Then what happens to players of lower GP that have risen up the leagues? The leagues/divisions have a set amount of players. So if you move some back up (taking into account their highest rank) you need to move some down. However, that would move them below their highest rank.

So this would cause a 'top heavy' system and not the balanced league numbers CG wish to maintain. So, I don't think this would work.

\"Should a player in Kyber ever be allowed to drop to Bronzium?\"

A sport I like is cycling. Cycling has a 'starter' category. You start in this category and when you leave it, you can never go back into it. I think that would definitely benefit GAC; the low Carbonites should be sacred I think.

However, rewards are based off of your division/league. So by not allowing a Kyber to drop is rewarding them. If a Kyber player doesn't play and doesn't drop and still get good rewards. You're punishing those that try hard.........or rewarding those that don't try hard. It's a difficult issue.

\"If their skill got them that high, could they ever be considered at that low a level?\"

Well 'Skill Rating' is a stupid name. It's more of a 'GAC Power Rating' or actually just your League Position on a perpetually rolling system. Initially your GP was the only factor in making your 'Skill Rating', since then it has solely been based off of success. So initial rankings had nothing to do with skill, just weight. As time has gone on, success has become more of an influence over the initial weight.

So some Kyber players had a lot of weight have legitimately fallen into Aurodium and probably the least skillful into Chromium. However, due to inactivity some have fallen like a stone much further down. Eventually, some 8 million GP accounts have fallen all the way to the bottom of Carbonite apparently. This means a brand new player to GAC could potentially be drawn against an 8 million plus GP account.

\"I hope CG is looking at the data and considering how changes in the algorithm can make the skill rating better.\"


Well for a lot of issues, is there a consensus agreement? I think everybody would agree a lower league player shouldn't have to face a high GP player that only plays once or twice a season. The win determined on whether the higher GP player decides to play for the win or not.

Other issues...........do players agree, or/and do CG think it's an issue? Kyber is shrinking significantly. Is this an issue? Is it being done on purpose? Is there really a need for squish? Why can't promotions/relegations be more transparent? Why skill points on diminishing returns as the season goes on? Why are we using 1 ranking for 2 different formats (3v3/5v5)? Why are players caught in a whirlpool/magnet system? Why are league promotions/relegations treated differently to divisions?

All issues for me, but probably not for CG or other players.","body@stringLength":"4662","rawBody":"I think new accounts still start based on GP. I saw some player jump in at Carbonite 3 recently; who had more GP than the average starter.

\"Does it account for the difference of banners in each battle?\"

No, it does not. The issue here would be how difficult a defence your opponent has set. Some set more difficult defences (therefore expect a lower scoring game) than others.

\"What about when players throw the battle or don't show up? Should the \"win\" be as meaningful?\"

You can only play your game. You shouldn't be penalized for another's actions. It is a league system after all. Also the defences are not altered from what you last set (unless you alter them manually). So a player can't actually throw matches.

\"Does punishing players that don't show up make the experience better for those in lower leagues?\"

Yes, this is a big issue. There appears to be a not small proportion of players doing the minimum to collect rewards falling down the leagues and creating unintended match ups. The wins are then determined on whether they play or not.

\"Should a players highest rank (over a period of time) be considered?\"

Hmmmmmmmmmm interesting thought. However, at what period of time do you take that 'highest rank'. If from the start, you're just taking GP into account and basically resetting the leagues. This is unfair on the more casual players that legitimately have fallen leagues/divisions and are now playing more balanced games.

Then what happens to players of lower GP that have risen up the leagues? The leagues/divisions have a set amount of players. So if you move some back up (taking into account their highest rank) you need to move some down. However, that would move them below their highest rank.

So this would cause a 'top heavy' system and not the balanced league numbers CG wish to maintain. So, I don't think this would work.

\"Should a player in Kyber ever be allowed to drop to Bronzium?\"

A sport I like is cycling. Cycling has a 'starter' category. You start in this category and when you leave it, you can never go back into it. I think that would definitely benefit GAC; the low Carbonites should be sacred I think.

However, rewards are based off of your division/league. So by not allowing a Kyber to drop is rewarding them. If a Kyber player doesn't play and doesn't drop and still get good rewards. You're punishing those that try hard.........or rewarding those that don't try hard. It's a difficult issue.

\"If their skill got them that high, could they ever be considered at that low a level?\"

Well 'Skill Rating' is a stupid name. It's more of a 'GAC Power Rating' or actually just your League Position on a perpetually rolling system. Initially your GP was the only factor in making your 'Skill Rating', since then it has solely been based off of success. So initial rankings had nothing to do with skill, just weight. As time has gone on, success has become more of an influence over the initial weight.

So some Kyber players had a lot of weight have legitimately fallen into Aurodium and probably the least skillful into Chromium. However, due to inactivity some have fallen like a stone much further down. Eventually, some 8 million GP accounts have fallen all the way to the bottom of Carbonite apparently. This means a brand new player to GAC could potentially be drawn against an 8 million plus GP account.

\"I hope CG is looking at the data and considering how changes in the algorithm can make the skill rating better.\"


Well for a lot of issues, is there a consensus agreement? I think everybody would agree a lower league player shouldn't have to face a high GP player that only plays once or twice a season. The win determined on whether the higher GP player decides to play for the win or not.

Other issues...........do players agree, or/and do CG think it's an issue? Kyber is shrinking significantly. Is this an issue? Is it being done on purpose? Is there really a need for squish? Why can't promotions/relegations be more transparent? Why skill points on diminishing returns as the season goes on? Why are we using 1 ranking for 2 different formats (3v3/5v5)? Why are players caught in a whirlpool/magnet system? Why are league promotions/relegations treated differently to divisions?

All issues for me, but probably not for CG or other players.","kudosSumWeight":1,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2022-11-29T03:05:28.000Z","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"timeToRead":3,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:4012547_1"},"latestVersion":null,"metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":0},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","isEscalated":null,"placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}},"customFields":[]},"CachedAsset:theme:customTheme1-1737542912997":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"theme:customTheme1-1737542912997","value":{"id":"customTheme1","animation":{"fast":"150ms","normal":"250ms","slow":"500ms","slowest":"750ms","function":"cubic-bezier(0.07, 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