Speed, TM, and Turn Order at the Beginning of Battle

"TVF;c-1689841" wrote:
I understand the first part (441 speed), although it sounds different than what I'm finding online.

The second part (192.5) makes no sense to me. JE gets the +50 speed bonus from allies, ok, but then why are you reducing from there?

And then the third part (where everyone gets full tm and the order is random) went right over my head. I have not seen this happen in arena.

It's the only way to accurately calculate effective starting speed. We need to create a formula that is a ratio where this speed at this tm % is equal to blank speed at 100% tm and then solve for x, which is what this formula does.

The 2nd and 3rd part go together.

If jawa Engineer gives all droids and Jawa 45% tm, it happens at the start of his turn. This means that everyone else already has their tm full to varying degrees. Anyone who has over 55% tm at that point will then be at 100% tm and it will be a coin flip to see who goes first. anyone who has more than 192 speed in that example will get over 100% tm. That's what the formula is calculating when you reverse it like that, the breakpoint where tm will be full. You can then get a starting turn order by having people successively 1 less speed than the result.

Back in the day when I ran droids, I had to have my B2 go first to wipe Baze's buff +BI, and K2 go 2nd to daze Chirrut so I had to use this formula every time I got faster mods.

So to simplify this, I could compare BB8's 441 effective speed to Revan's in-panel speed plus his jedi/OR bonuses?

"TVF;c-1689872" wrote:
So to simplify this, I could compare BB8's 441 effective speed to Revan's in-panel speed plus his jedi/OR bonuses?

Correct but just for turn 1.

"TVF;c-1689878" wrote:
Ok thanks. So BB8 is going first. Now how do I determine what JTR's effective speed is?

BB8 goes first and does secret intel. JTR gains 8% TM. So if her in-panel speed is 280, what is her effective speed before she or Revan take a turn?

BB8 goes first and gives himself and another ally secret intel, then gains secret intel one more time for having used a special ability because that's how it spreads.

At this point JTR could be gaining anywhere from 16-24% tm depending on whether or not the person BB8 put secret intel on was resistance.

So if you are running anything other than full resistance it comes down to RNG. With full resistance you would simply plug the 24% tm she will gain in the formula I gave you earlier: Speed *100/(100-tm gain %)

@TVF as far as I know, the bug was never fixed, JTR pretty much always gains 24% TM no matter who gets the buff.

That tmr happens if you are exposed, so if bb8 is going first you don't have to worry about that

and I wanna say the effective speed is 280*1.16, which is 328.4. But I'll admit I don't know

"HK666;c-1689814" wrote:
That tmr happens if you are exposed, so if bb8 is going first you don't have to worry about that

Ah shoot.

and I wanna say the effective speed is 280*1.16, which is 328.4. But I'll admit I don't know

I'm almost positive that is not correct.

So with a little research I think this is what happens. TM is based on a scale of 1000 and you have to reach 1000 to take a turn.. You start with TM equal to your speed, so BB8 starts with 280. He gets 16% of 1000, so his TM at start of battle is 280 + 160 = 440. Revan starts at 320. That's the end of the first "turn." Since no one reached 1000, everyone adds their speed to their TM. So BB8 is now at 440 + 280 = 720. Revan is at 320 + 320 = 640. No one reached 1000, go again. BB8 is now at 720 + 280 = 1000, Revan is at 640 + 320 = 960. BB8 goes first.

Now, assuming this is correct, what happens if neither gets to 1000 that last time. Say BB8 is at 995 and Revan is at 960. Next TM add puts them both over 1000, is that where RNG comes in to determine who goes first? Or do you have BB8 at 995 + 280 = 1275 and Revan at 960 + 320 = 1280 so Revan goes first?

The way to calculate effective starting speed is as follows:

speed in panel * 100/ (100-tm gain %)

So a 300 speed BB8 in a group with 4 droids would have an effective speed of:
300 * 100/ (100-32) = 441.sakfdaodnfoi;

So his effective speed in this instance is a 441.

In order to figure out what speeds will allow you a starting turn order with effects like Sith Assassin or Jawa Engineer, FOO, etc. you would simply reverse the fraction. (note this is only needed when an activated ability gives out the tm. Ones that happen at the start of match like Zaul and BB8 don't have this limitation.)
Speed * (100-tm gain)/100
If my Jawa Engineer is a 300 speed in panel with his +50 speed bonus I use the formula:
350 * (100-45)/100= 192.5

So I can have a starting turn order where one guy is somewhere between 192 and 350, but everyone else would have to be 192 and below to have a starting turn order. Otherwise everyone gets full tm and the order is random.

Well that's that. May be more than you were asking for, idk.

I understand the first part (441 speed), although it sounds different than what I'm finding online.

The second part (192.5) makes no sense to me. JE gets the +50 speed bonus from allies, ok, but then why are you reducing from there?

And then the third part (where everyone gets full tm and the order is random) went right over my head. I have not seen this happen in arena.