Given the significant presence of matchmakers in TS2 and the dissemination of the g slur in the game, i was thinking about a retraction of the franchise towards it with a pack (and free items too) bringing a correct and proper representation of the rom ethnicity. But as a gadjo i ask if there are there any romani in this forums who would like to see representation in the game. If yes, what related theme you think it could fit? How do you imagine it?

I'm always for more representation of more cultures, races, religions, ETC. I don't know enough to give any ideas, but I do give my support!

What are the specific items / themes that you would like to see in the game? Any pictures? Here's my two buttons regarding representation:Spoiler (Highlight to read)I always thought the matchmakers and fortune tellers depicted in movies, books and games are fantasy characters, somewhat based on elements that many nomadic people across the world share, which may include clothing, transport, tools and instruments. I don't know much about the Romani people, their descendants nor their customs, but where I'm from some groups within the Traveller community wear the "G" name with pride and have written books about themselves using that name. I don't believe it's a slur everywhere in the world - however- that doesn't mean it should be used in the game. This is also the reason why I'm NOT an advocate of literal representation of social groups in a humorous, silly game like The Sims 4 - it tends to get messy and political when not everyone feels they're being represented accurately, and it often ends with dev teams apologizing to the group whereas instead they could have avoided all that and spend dev time on gameplay only loosely based on real world cultures. Being inspired by a culture is different than taking it literally. That way there is something in the game we can all somewhat recognise, but it'll also allow us to play with it whichever way we want as story tellers. Give everyone that freedom. Although I love learning about different cultures around the world, with the exception of dishes- I personally see the addition of literal representation of real world (sub) cultures in TS4 as a limitation to my game story world: In fact, I'm less likely to play with it because I may not know anything about that culture and I don't want to play my game according to a specific, real world belief system or customs. What's more, I would never ever be able to share my gameplay fun with anyone. Unbeknowst to me, it would possibly be the most offensive thing that was ever shared in the world and then I'd be disciplined and thrown in jail and that's the end of it. :D Take the religious groups in The Sims Medieval for example: Jacobans and Peterans. We may think: "Aahh....and....Hmmmm, aren't they a bit like Catholics and Protestants?" Sure, if that's what someone recognises them as that's fine, but they're not the actual thing, which gives both the developers and the player more freedom to explore. Great way to avoid problems unless someone is actively looking for something to be offended by. That said, I love the fantastical element of the fortuneteller trope & CAS inspired by this would be very welcome. I've seen many vardos (traditional wagons) on display in my country- it's part of the culture - and they're absolutely gorgeous- so yes, I want all the tools and items to build as many as I can for my Fortunetelling Spellcasters. I always thought the matchmakers and fortune tellers depicted in movies, books and games are fantasy characters, somewhat based on elements that many nomadic people across the world share, which may include clothing, transport, tools and instruments. I don't know much about the Romani people, their descendants nor their customs, but where I'm from some groups within the Traveller community wear the "G" name with pride and have written books about themselves using that name. I don't believe it's a slur everywhere in the world - however- that doesn't mean it should be used in the game. This is also the reason why I'm NOT an advocate of literal representation of social groups in a humorous, silly game like The Sims 4 - it tends to get messy and political when not everyone feels they're being represented accurately, and it often ends with dev teams apologizing to the group whereas instead they could have avoided all that and spend dev time on gameplay only loosely based on real world cultures. Being inspired by a culture is different than taking it literally. That way there is something in the game we can all somewhat recognise, but it'll also allow us to play with it whichever way we want as story tellers. Give everyone that freedom. Although I love learning about different cultures around the world, with the exception of dishes- I personally see the addition of literal representation of real world (sub) cultures in TS4 as a limitation to my game story world: In fact, I'm less likely to play with it because I may not know anything about that culture and I don't want to play my game according to a specific, real world belief system or customs. What's more, I would never ever be able to share my gameplay fun with anyone. Unbeknowst to me, it would possibly be the most offensive thing that was ever shared in the world and then I'd be disciplined and thrown in jail and that's the end of it. :D Take the religious groups in The Sims Medieval for example: Jacobans and Peterans. We may think: "Aahh....and....Hmmmm, aren't they a bit like Catholics and Protestants?" Sure, if that's what someone recognises them as that's fine, but they're not the actual thing, which gives both the developers and the player more freedom to explore. Great way to avoid problems unless someone is actively looking for something to be offended by. That said, I love the fantastical element of the fortuneteller trope & CAS inspired by this would be very welcome. I've seen many vardos (traditional wagons) on display in my country- it's part of the culture - and they're absolutely gorgeous- so yes, I want all the tools and items to build as many as I can for my Fortunetelling Spellcasters.

"Thornwillow;d-1009051" wrote:Given the significant presence of matchmakers in TS2 and the dissemination of the g slur in the game, i was thinking about a retraction of the franchise towards it with a pack (and free items too) bringing a correct and proper representation of the rom ethnicity. But as a gadjo i ask if there are there any romani in this forums who would like to see representation in the game. If yes, what related theme you think it could fit? How do you imagine it?In my country at least, some call themselves as g word others prefer romani. From what I've noticed it's usually people with higher education that use the romani description, but if given the choice some would rather pass as other ethnicity. They usually run flower shops, and sing at weddings. Some do witchcraft and love spells and prosperity spells and such. When I was younger you could occasionally see those travelling wagons, those people usually crafted and sold pots and pans. Back in the day there also used to be romani ladies who sold sunflower seeds on the street, don't see them anymore, I guess they found something else to do since now we can buy sunflower seeds in the supermarket. In my country nowadays they are quite famous for their palace styled mansion houses, with lots of towers, though not sure I would want those in the sims. :lol: If they bring them back I would like an accordion as new instrument, the colourful wagons and their specific clothes and the matchmaking stuff. You don't see them in wagons anymore, nowadays it's most likely they drive some German made car like Mercedes, but it would be nice if we could make the wagons in the sims.

I think these themes should all exist but separately• Romani rep maybe in a patch that has some Romani clothing and items and such with Romani premade family , similar to the other cultural stuff patches we have had• separate patch that adds + Matchmaker (Fortuneteller) NPC (No use of G word)+ few matchmaker outfit options for all genders from which one resembles ts2 version+ gameplay from ts2 related to this npc+ maybe games table can be used to do some fortunetelling and matchmaking• Magical Travels kit+ adds everything to build gorgeous mystical traveller wagon home

@CAPTAIN_NXR7 Where i live it happens the same with the terms but as i've seen some groups being offended by it and it not being a name they created themselves i tend to choose the autodenomination from their language.as for the representation, i think that we could have a thing like you said. They could get inspired (and educated) and create a new group for the game based on the existing ones.

Roma representation | EA Forums

SuperNerdChick
2 years ago
I'm always for more representation of more cultures, races, religions, ETC. I don't know enough to give any ideas, but I do give my support!
CAPTAIN_NXR7
Seasoned Hotshot
2 years ago

What are the specific items / themes that you would like to see in the game? Any pictures?

Here's my two buttons regarding representation:

Spoiler
I always thought the matchmakers and fortune tellers depicted in movies, books and games are fantasy characters, somewhat based on elements that many nomadic people across the world share, which may include clothing, transport, tools and instruments.

I don't know much about the Romani people, their descendants nor their customs, but where I'm from some groups within the Traveller community wear the "G" name with pride and have written books about themselves using that name.
I don't believe it's a slur everywhere in the world - however- that doesn't mean it should be used in the game.

This is also the reason why I'm NOT an advocate of literal representation of social groups in a humorous, silly game like The Sims 4 - it tends to get messy and political when not everyone feels they're being represented accurately, and it often ends with dev teams apologizing to the group whereas instead they could have avoided all that and spend dev time on gameplay only loosely based on real world cultures.

Being inspired by a culture is different than taking it literally. That way there is something in the game we can all somewhat recognise, but it'll also allow us to play with it whichever way we want as story tellers. Give everyone that freedom.

Although I love learning about different cultures around the world, with the exception of dishes- I personally see the addition of literal representation of real world (sub) cultures in TS4 as a limitation to my game story world: In fact, I'm less likely to play with it because I may not know anything about that culture and I don't want to play my game according to a specific, real world belief system or customs.
What's more, I would never ever be able to share my gameplay fun with anyone. Unbeknowst to me, it would possibly be the most offensive thing that was ever shared in the world and then I'd be disciplined and thrown in jail and that's the end of it. :D

Take the religious groups in The Sims Medieval for example: Jacobans and Peterans. We may think:

"Aahh....and....Hmmmm, aren't they a bit like Catholics and Protestants?"

Sure, if that's what someone recognises them as that's fine, but they're not the actual thing, which gives both the developers and the player more freedom to explore. Great way to avoid problems unless someone is actively looking for something to be offended by.

That said, I love the fantastical element of the fortuneteller trope & CAS inspired by this would be very welcome. I've seen many vardos (traditional wagons) on display in my country- it's part of the culture - and they're absolutely gorgeous- so yes, I want all the tools and items to build as many as I can for my Fortunetelling Spellcasters.
crocobaura
Seasoned Ace
2 years ago
"Thornwillow;d-1009051" wrote:
Given the significant presence of matchmakers in TS2 and the dissemination of the g slur in the game, i was thinking about a retraction of the franchise towards it with a pack (and free items too) bringing a correct and proper representation of the rom ethnicity. But as a gadjo i ask if there are there any romani in this forums who would like to see representation in the game. If yes, what related theme you think it could fit? How do you imagine it?

In my country at least, some call themselves as g word others prefer romani. From what I've noticed it's usually people with higher education that use the romani description, but if given the choice some would rather pass as other ethnicity. They usually run flower shops, and sing at weddings. Some do witchcraft and love spells and prosperity spells and such. When I was younger you could occasionally see those travelling wagons, those people usually crafted and sold pots and pans. Back in the day there also used to be romani ladies who sold sunflower seeds on the street, don't see them anymore, I guess they found something else to do since now we can buy sunflower seeds in the supermarket.
In my country nowadays they are quite famous for their palace styled mansion houses, with lots of towers, though not sure I would want those in the sims. :lol: If they bring them back I would like an accordion as new instrument, the colourful wagons and their specific clothes and the matchmaking stuff. You don't see them in wagons anymore, nowadays it's most likely they drive some German made car like Mercedes, but it would be nice if we could make the wagons in the sims.
Simmingal
Hero
2 years ago
I think these themes should all exist but separately

• Romani rep maybe in a patch that has some Romani clothing and items and such with Romani premade family , similar to the other cultural stuff patches we have had

• separate patch that adds
+ Matchmaker (Fortuneteller) NPC
(No use of G word)
+ few matchmaker outfit options for all genders from which one resembles ts2 version
+ gameplay from ts2 related to this npc
+ maybe games table can be used to do some fortunetelling and matchmaking

• Magical Travels kit
+ adds everything to build gorgeous mystical traveller wagon home
thornwill
Seasoned Newcomer
2 years ago
@CAPTAIN_NXR7 Where i live it happens the same with the terms but as i've seen some groups being offended by it and it not being a name they created themselves i tend to choose the autodenomination from their language.

as for the representation, i think that we could have a thing like you said. They could get inspired (and educated) and create a new group for the game based on the existing ones.
Simmingal
Hero
2 years ago
Idk its kind of like
Spoiler
if you just suddenly decided to call every american person hamburger boy instead of american (as they would prefer probably)

and sure like some people could really identify as being the hamburger boy and be like heck yeah im the hamburger boy but its not the right word to use for the whole group of people

then only rep you would get as american would be that some game adds this dude that eats hamburgers called ham burger

and yeah wouldn't that be tad offensive even if you do have hamburgers in america n its like a thing people do there alongside the other million things they do

also then being always looked at weirdly by everyone in public as if you are going to give everyone you meet a hamburger just because you are american

and the hamburger boy word being used everytime someone says something bad about you or people that are like you all like " man hamburger boys are so weird i met this one guy yesterday and he wasn't wearing t-shirt but it was some weird exotic clothing called hoodie i bet he is criminal" "yo man i saw this one hamburger dude get sick leave yesterday they so lazy"

Yeah. i think thats probably about how one would feel about G word too in some places

it doesn't matter what the word is it will get offensive pretty quick like that

Spoiler
also yes people would still eat hamburgers while saying all that stuff in this alternate dystopian universe and love the hamburgers just not the people

they'd probably have fake shein "exotic dancer hoodies" too that are missing the pockets and are actually crop hoodies not hoodies and they would make shein so rich while all the real hoodies would be barely noted for existing

okay too intense world building Simmingal you gotta stop

anyway yeah point being i try to not use any words that people might find grinding their ears like that because you never know how much bs people get for just existing and what is small hamburger boy to one might be big hamburger boy to someone else
CAPTAIN_NXR7
Seasoned Hotshot
2 years ago
"Thornwillow;c-18273281" wrote:
@CAPTAIN_NXR7 Where i live it happens the same with the terms but as i've seen some groups being offended by it and it not being a name they created themselves i tend to choose the autodenomination from their language.

This makes sense.
Plenty of ethnic slurs are used against my people on a regular basis, and although most individuals that I know couldn't care less (we'd call each other worse) it is certainly not recommended to describe folks using degoratory terms.

To be honest, I wasn't aware of the G-slur until someone pointed it out on these very forums about 2 or 3 years ago. I'd still be using it in the most "innocent" way possible if they hadn't mentioned it. Innocent (ignorant) in that I never heard anyone talk about it until then. The more you know.

When I was a younger lad I used to perform as a (not very skilled-but ~~extremely funny~~) fire twirler at medieval fairs (which are quite common around these parts) and dress up in a "traditional" Romani outfit, except everyone would use the G-word.
Would I be able to get away with that now without backlash? I dunno. Apparently I've got the right "look" and so did my lovely friend, "Esmeralda" ...still, I'd be too scared to find out now, mainly because there's a good chance I'd set my own hair on fire and with that, the rest of the medieval faire village.

"Simmingal;c-18273254" wrote:
I think these themes should all exist but separately

• Romani rep maybe in a patch that has some Romani clothing and items and such with Romani premade family , similar to the other cultural stuff patches we have had

• separate patch that adds
+ Matchmaker (Fortuneteller) NPC
(No use of G word)
+ few matchmaker outfit options for all genders from which one resembles ts2 version
+ gameplay from ts2 related to this npc
+ maybe games table can be used to do some fortunetelling and matchmaking

• Magical Travels kit
+ adds everything to build gorgeous mystical traveller wagon home

I'd love all this. ????
SEREFRAS
Rising Hotshot
2 years ago
I've actually heard of a lady named G Y P S Y Rose. I don't believe it was her fault that it was her name. People shouldn't be extremely disliked because of their name. There needs to be kindness & forgiveness in the world.
Isharell
New Spectator
2 years ago
We used to have a dog named G y p s y. It's a pretty word; I like the sound of it. Yes we knew about the people it represented but we did not use the name in a derogatory fashion. She was spritely, beautiful, and confident, and we felt it suited her perfectly. I only recently discovered I shouldn't use that word anymore (learned it on these forums, actually - seems to be a very educational place, the Sims forums LOL).
Simmingal
Hero
2 years ago
Yeah well its really rather subjective what people think of words
I feel like as long as you listen to people
when they tell you they don't like you using x word for them
and mean no ill will
then its all okay in the end

like for instance calling me witch is all lit bestie
unless you are saying that to burn me at stake later this evening
for my supposed witchcraft :sunglasses:

depends on context, gravely.