Release the dev kit to create worlds

"Cinebar;c-17221124" wrote:

"happyopi;c-17218823" wrote:

"DragonCat159;c-17217584" wrote:
Over exaggerated numbers. Most players include 1 gym, but 3 bars seem kinda realistic in a small town. Who wouldn't want to like expand Forgotten hollow more than five lots? When you have an imagination wild, a good variety of lots than you describe two, you can't really do much than get peeve why the hell there's such restriction. For christ sakes ea, give us 'duplicate' world feature if they're gonna leave us with forgotten hollow.

I'm talking overall, not 10 gyms in one world, but many people probably already have 10 gyms throughout the worlds.
Wild imagination to me means taking advantage of the uniqueness of each world instead of having the same gameplay everywhere.
Kinda reminds me of how people started building boats en masse after Sulani, but a lot of them, while really pretty and realistic on the outside were sized and furnished like a suburban house on the inside.
So maybe I'm weird, but when I'm playing in a boat I want the space to feel cramped and plasticy, and when I'm playing a small town I want to feel like I'm missing out by not playing in a bigger town. If that makes sense.
But then Del Sol Valley is supposed to be a proper city, yet doesn't feel so, so I can see where you are all coming from.

"Cinebar;c-17218342" wrote:
It's not reasonable when TS2 players who also like TS4 need those spaces for their rotational families who they play for many generations. If you play rotationally and have ten households who have kids (most) then yes, you will need more lots and more spaces. Maxis has said TS4 (before it was released) would support Rotational Play again (TS3 does not according to those who understand TS3's mechanics with the codes) so rotational players are getting the short end of the stick, again, if they are going to be limited by how many lots can be in the game.

I understand what you are saying, I played rotational and always will, and right, I only need one gym, but I also play entire neighborhoods with all my Sims in 99% on every lot in every world. Maxis Sims get evicted, and replaced whether I play them all at one time or not. I don't play mulitple saves so if I'm playing thirty households where some of course will have families and their own legacy line of generations of Sims they need places to live, too.

Ok I apologize because this scenario didn't even came to my mind. I play in aging off and mostly in San Myshuno (I have 16 or so households in San Myshuno), and while the TS4 way fits my gameplay, I acknowledge now that it's pretty rigid for other types of players.

I guess it's a glass half full situation, worlds are getting smaller, but they get attached to what I already have, so I don't see it as "only 5 lots" but "5 more lots" because I haven't ran out of space in the first place.

"simmerLella;c-17218481" wrote:
Sims 2 sub-hoods say hello.

I always felt like I wanted more space, never for more base game lots (except a "bar" that I wanted to be something else). I reduced things like gyms, some lot types down to ONE (or even zero!). I built and downloaded unique lots that went way beyond the scope of what Maxis intended. Think of all the shop types a player could try out. I'd probably gladly have 20+ restaurants! :D So many restaurant themes to try! That was fun. I wanted to try SO many different KINDS of community builds (and downloads too - too many interesting gallery lots I couldn't fit). I see Sims 4 as having one world with sub-hoods, best with only one save at a time, or it would feel wrong. It's obviously the same world repeated in everyone's game, in everyone's screenshots.

Unless you played the Megahood, which is made by modders, you couldn't play all main hoods together in TS2. You could add all sub-hoods but you could not play Veronaville and Strangetown together i.e., so TS4 being a megahood by default is an improvement for me who likes playing premades first.

I actually do like you, reduce numbers of uninteresting community lots, and I try to make the most of what's left.
The gameplay has to be different from another of the same type for me to keep a community lot.

The threat of BFBVFS in TS2 days taught me to thread carefully and not get the expansionist virus.
If I could deactivate a few worlds honestly I would. But that's on me, and not every player is me.

The one thing about building and needing space that could help in TS4 is the removal of required lot items. I have never been a fan of TS3 or TS4's limitations put on Simmers of what type of lot a lot was going to have to be deemed. In the older games building multi type lots with many different shops and things to do there worked well for covering what players wanted to do with their Sims. It's possible in TS4 if you hide the required objects underground without stairs, however, we still have to pick what type of lot. I loved the days I could build all sorts of multi lots to cover everything I wanted my Sims to do in one full swoop.

Maxis also built multi type lots for TS2, where some would be playing pool (where are the pool tables after five years) some would be shopping for clothes, some for groceries, some watching movies etc. I really enjoy building multi lots without limiting me of what type it has to be. But it seems TS4 is like robots, they won't know what to do I guess unless the lot tells them what to do. Where as in older games it is more likely they use the most fun objects, the most fun things they enjoy (shopping being one of them) and the most things that fill motives. That doesn't seem to be the case in TS4 if we build that sort of lot, they are drawn to the designation of the lot, and ignore all other objects sometimes. And everything is overrode by talking and more talking instead of using the objects. And in some cases such as parks in TS4, they totally don't even show up if you add particular things to a park.

I remember the Multi type lots from Sims 2 and I do miss them.

"Sk8rblaze;c-17213708" wrote:
Didn't they say they started making worlds smaller because TS4 could no longer support additional, larger worlds to the scale of Windenburg? Definitely makes me wonder what the purpose of starting a whole new base game was with it being so extremely limited at every front.

My wallet and self are ready for TS5 when you are, EA. It's been closed for this generation, and won't be opening any time soon with the poor quality of these packs.

Yes they did.

I don't even think a world kit is an option because they outsource their world map art and they have stated that it is pretty expensive to make.

Most people wouldn't even be able to make their own worlds because they have no skills on photoshop and you'd still need to make the UI for the world and stuff. Which are things you don't need in TS2 or TS3 since there's only one big 3d world, not multiple worlds locked behind loading screens.

I'm another that misses te TS2 style multi-purpose community lots here. The closest I've been able to come to that is my 'Ladybird Landing'. Flagged as a restaurant, it also has a small gym, bar (with dart board, table game, & elec. piano) quiet room for reading & chess, and 4 rooms for staying overnight. When I take a sim there it's usually a busy place, including the subsidiary areas.

"simmerLella;c-17218481" wrote:
Sims 2 sub-hoods say hello.

Those sub neighborhoods were bigger than some of Sims 4's full neighborhoods. You could easily fit around 20 to 30 lots in some of them, like Downtown or Bluewater Village (I think that's what it was called). It makes Forgotten Hollow with its 5 lots look pretty weak.

I don't see a Sims 4 world building tool being able to do the something on the same level somehow, considering what's been said about places like Windenburg and such.

"happyopi;c-17216446" wrote:
Worlds in previous games were separated, that's why they could be big, as they were standalone.

I already have no idea where any of my sims are invited, too many lots I don't recognize the names of.

I'm not attacking people wanting bigger worlds, you should always ask your money worth, and tbh I could have used one more community lot in Strangerville but I'm struggling to understand: what are you gonna need space for, your 10th gym ? Your 20th bar ?
Do you only play one world in a new save and never visit anywhere else ?

The small worlds wouldn't be too bad if so many lots (especially the nice, big ones) didn't tend to be already occupied by pre-made families or empty pre-made houses that are too expensive for your sim to afford with their starting funds. The free real-estate cheat has always been frustrating for me to figure out when I'm supposed to plug it in, and I've never been able to get it to work when just starting a save. I also prefer larger lots, because I like to build up to big houses. When I open up a new world and see that the big lots are mostly occupied by starter-unfriendly homes and pre-made sims, it's really frustrating. Newcrest is alright...but we need more blank worlds like that with different environments (desert, urban, tropical, etc.). For me, it's about the freedom to place my sims wherever the heck I want at the beginning of a save. For others, it's about housing multiple branches from their family lineages, or just being able to go into a save exclusively meant for building and not having to evict all the pre-made sims and demolish all the pre-built buildings just to have the spots they want to make the builds they want. That's why people are bothered by how tiny the worlds have been, not because of a reluctance to travel or the desire for 10 gyms or 20 bars.

EA/Maxis could easily change the real estate issue if they allowed multi-use lots. Better yet, code the game so that the Sims will use whatever activities are places on the lot, not simply what the venue tells them that they may use.

Before someone says that this is not possible, TS3 started out with restrictive venues and requirements, exactly like TS4. Somewhere along the way, the Devs got rid of the infernal list of requirements for each venue. (You still need two more park benches!) The Sims were able to use whatever activity they wished, without restriction.

Why don't the Devs open up play in TS4? In that way, there could be bars, nightclubs, movie theaters, shopping, etc., all on one lot, freeing up the other lots for other things. Also, take away the unnecessary restrictions on bartenders and shop attendants. Make them spawn automatically. A mall-type venue would be fabulous. One-stop activities, the rest of the town could be used for parks and residential areas.

"PrincipleOfEntropy;c-17213517" wrote:
They've said that releasing it is an option at some point, and I'm willing to bet that will be the end of 4's run when no more official content is being released. If they released tools now then players would be able to make their own worlds instead of having to buy new packs for new locations.

If this is really EA's line of thinking then it's already been disproven. TS3 made a killing selling overpriced worlds as DLC well after Create-a-World was released. TS4 never even had a "sell the world only" model. There's nothing to lose I'm sorry!

"Cynna;c-17222952" wrote:
EA/Maxis could easily change the real estate issue if they allowed multi-use lots. Better yet, code the game so that the Sims will use whatever activities are places on the lot, not simply what the venue tells them that they may use.

Agree 100%. It would be so much nicer if you could take any lot and add a bar, a stereo and a bowling alley and - BAM! - a bartender arrives and people order drinks, listen/dance to music and go bowling. I hate the way people crowd around a TV that I'm forced to put in my bar because Maxis says it's necessary (I've taken to hiding unwanted lot requirements in inaccessible basements).

On top of that, why not unlock lot types? What if I want to put a rental house in Windenburg so my San Myshuno sims can stay for a few nights? Why does my hospital have to be a huge building in a Willow Creek-style world, instead of a tiny doctor's office in Strangerville?

If they won't let players create their own worlds, they need to make in-game world editing a possibility. Make the worlds more flexible.

I'll add my voice to this request/plea/letter to Santa for a CAW-like tool/feature. It's not that I don't have enough worlds, it's just that I really hate the layout of quite a few of them... they just don't gel the way I'd like them to. I would love to be able to add or change some of the lots even if we were stuck with the given sizes (which we aren't - I've had a look at the base and expac code and I've already changed Sylvan Glade plot size to 55 x 48...) and to rearrange some of the surrounding landscape. It's not about amounts, it's about aesthetics, in my opinion.

In my opinion, I think they hurt the franchise and the reputation of The Sims and their own purse by not releasing such tools. One, instead of having to give away seven million basegames this past May, they could have had seven million sells of basegame by releasing a world editor, CAW. There are all types of players and Maxis is missing and wouldn't have to chase new players who have no idea what this franchise was about, by just supporting the base/core fanbase. Many modders won't even touch TS4, who worked on all others. There is that section of players/consumers.

Besides those who play a game to actually play it as intended with all it's levels, aspirations, skill learning etc. I'll call them achievers who play exactly how it's laid out without detering into story but trying to complete everything there are players who never play that way or may do some of it but their play is on the story in their head and the journey their Sim is on, or their towns. Then there are those who must play a legacy, and never move out of one house after ten genarations of Sims. Maxis misses out on creators of worlds who could boost sales for other content.

Besides those who just use this game to do a live play session, which rarely actually play, there are those who play this franchise just to edit and make machinima and or screen shots to tell a made up story which may or may not even be possible and most things edit to seem those things happened, or used to cheats to get the look or action to seem like it happened.

But Maxis chases those who have never played and overlook the one group they no longer have. The World Builders who inspire other players to try it, buy it, use it, (the game) and inspired thousands to stay engaged while they waited on new world from a world builder. If Maxis was so smart they would have included this type of 'player' from the get go and wouldn't have had to have so many sales and or give away a base for free. Because modders and world builders would buy and do stuff for the community of Simmers, even if they don't like a game, as long as they can create. And Maxis should have learned that lesson by now.