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goofylittlerhin's avatar
goofylittlerhin
4 years ago
Solved

What pc specs dictate allowing 200 max recommended sims?

Apologies if posted in the wrong place or if overly informative.

I am certain I've performed over 50 searches each on google and bing in attempts to answer this question. Neither search utility knows what I'm talking about and both keep giving me results chiefly about minimum system requirements, neither ever coming close to answering the question.

Background: I had a less capable PC which I've now replaced. That one recommended 150 sims max. I bought a new one which is light years beyond it. The new one recommends 150 sims max. I can't make sense of this, which led me to ask myself, and then to search (in vain):

What exactly dictates 150 vs 200 in a pc? Somewhere, some decision internal to the game is being made to tell you, the player, that you should have only 150 max or 200 max. What metric, spec or set of specs is used to make that decision? What PC would a person own or would s/he/they have purchased such that, when you open the game, it tells you that you can have 200 max recommended? LOL, I've tried to ask in over a dozen ways and gotten nowhere. Help! 🙂

  • puzzlezaddict's avatar
    puzzlezaddict
    4 years ago

    @goofylittlerhino  Sometimes the spam filter gets a little aggressive, for reasons I at least don't completely understand, but at least I can read your posts now.  (Thanks @EA_Jason for that.)

    You're right that the CPU rating is the reason for the lower recommended sim limit.  The processor itself is more than powerful enough to deserve an uber rating, but the issue is that Sims 4 only uses its base clock speed to rate it, not its turbo.  So as far as the game is concerned, it doesn't matter that the CPU can turbo much higher speeds.

    As far as what happens when you're actually playing, I'd guess the CPU runs well above 3 GHz; how high exactly would depend in large part on how the manufacturer tuned the system.  But the bottom line is that the processor can easily handle 200 sims, or 500, or whatever number you want to use.  So can the other components, so yes, you can go ahead and use whatever setting works for you.

    Sims 4 will slow down on its own from time to time, and it'll happen more often as your saves include more sims that you've actively played, but it won't be the fault of your computer.  The game engine itself just isn't as efficient as we'd like.

    If you have other questions, please do ask, I mean that's the whole point of this site.

9 Replies

  • puzzlezaddict's avatar
    puzzlezaddict
    Hero+
    4 years ago

    @goofylittlerhino  The parameters for that setting are in graphicsrules.sgr, in particular this section:

    seti MaxProtectedSimsUnlimited        3
seti MaxProtectedSimsUnlimitedCount   0
seti MaxProtectedSimsHigh             2
seti MaxProtectedSimsHighCount        200
seti MaxProtectedSimsMedium           1
seti MaxProtectedSimsMediumCount      150
seti MaxProtectedSimsLow              0
seti MaxProtectedSimsLowCount         80
option MaxProtectedSims
    setting $MaxProtectedSimsLow
        prop $ConfigGroup MaxProtectedSimCount $MaxProtectedSimsLowCount
    setting $MaxProtectedSimsMedium
        prop $ConfigGroup MaxProtectedSimCount $MaxProtectedSimsMediumCount
    setting $MaxProtectedSimsHigh
        prop $ConfigGroup MaxProtectedSimCount $MaxProtectedSimsHighCount
    setting $MaxProtectedSimsUnlimited
        prop $ConfigGroup MaxProtectedSimCount $MaxProtectedSimsUnlimitedCount
end
if ((($adjustedMemory >= $ramLevelHigh) and ($cpuLevel >= $cpuLevelUber)) and ($vMemoryLevel >= $vMemoryLevelHigh))
    setProp $ConfigGroup MaxRecommendedProtectedSims $MaxProtectedSimsHigh
    setOption MaxProtectedSims $MaxProtectedSimsMedium
elseif ((($adjustedMemory >= $ramLevelMedium) and ($cpuLevel >= $cpuLevelMedium)) and ($vMemoryLevel >= $vMemoryLevelHigh))
    setProp $ConfigGroup MaxRecommendedProtectedSims $MaxProtectedSimsMedium
    setOption MaxProtectedSims $MaxProtectedSimsLow
else
    setProp $ConfigGroup MaxRecommendedProtectedSims $MaxProtectedSimsLow
    setOption MaxProtectedSims $MaxProtectedSimsLow
endif

    You can see that if your computer's memory (RAM) is rated at least high, your CPU uber, and your graphics card's video memory high, then the max recommended sims will be "high," i.e. 200, although the option itself will be set to "medium" (150) unless you change it.

    The formulae for rating your hardware are at the top of graphicsrules, and you can see the results ("rating info") in the first few lines of config.log, in Documents\Electronic Arts\The Sims 4.  If you have a question about how your hardware is being rated, please post the first 40 lines of config.log.  You can delete your user and computer names, about 20 lines down, but leave the rest.

  • goofylittlerhin's avatar
    goofylittlerhin
    4 years ago

    @puzzlezaddict I worked hard to prepare for responding to you, but what took me over 2 hours probably takes you less than 2 minutes, LOL. I'm slow and not very knowledgeable with this stuff.

    There are two graphicsrules.sgr files under C:\Program Files (x86)\Origin Games\The Sims 4\Game, one in Bin and one in Bin_LE. I referenced the former. Studying its lines last night and then again today, I was slowly able to reproduce the decision-making process -- I think? -- that highlights the "culprit" for my 150-sim rating. Below, I have pasted the config.log lines you mentioned, and I continue below them.

    === Application info ===
    Name: Sims4
    Version: 1.81.72.1030
    Build: Release 64 Bit
    === Rating info ===
    GPU: 5 GPU Memory: 4 CPU: 3 RAM: 4 CPU Speed: 2208 Threading: 3
    Adjusted CPU: 3112 RAM: 16146 Adjusted RAM: 15634 Cores: 8
    === Machine info ===
    OS version: Windows 10 10.0.22000
    OS prod type:
    OS major ver: 10
    OS minor ver: 0
    OS SP major ver:
    OS SP minor ver:
    OS is 64Bit: 1
    CPU: GenuineIntel
    Brand: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-10870H CPU @ 2.20GHz
    Family: 6
    Model: 5
    Cores: 8
    HT: 1
    x64: 1
    Memory: 16146MB
    Free memory: 10037MB
    VA space: 134217728MB
    User: 🙂
    Computer: 🙂
    === Graphics device info ===
    Number: 0
    Name (driver): NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU
    Name (database): NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU [Found: 1, Supported: 1]
    Vendor: NVIDIA
    Chipset: Vendor: 10de, Device: 24dd, Board: 0a751028, Chipset: 00a1
    Driver: nvldumdx.dll, Version: 30.0.14.9649, GUID: D7B71E3E-679D-11CF-2956-7B2A0EC2D335
    Driver version: 9649
    Monitor: \\.\DISPLAY1
    Texture memory: 8044MB
    Vertex program: 3.0
    Pixel program: 3.0
    Hardware TnL: 1
    Opt. features: +sab +a8l8 +rgba16f +r32f +bc4 +bc5 -rawz +intz

    If I'm reading right, everything is great/uber/top-of-the-line except for the CPU rating, and my reading/math seems to support this. (And here I was reading up on how to maximize usable RAM! ... if I'm wording that correctly.)

    Then I did a bunch of poking around looking at other laptops because there are additional, unrelated reasons that I thought I might return this one. However, I keep seeing it rated very highly and appearing in "best of" lists. In the final analysis, what I've read anecdotally suggests that I could place a 200-sim limit in my game without a real problem. Is this correct? To be honest, I've already done so. (There is another issue related to this but it's not on the same topic, so I'm holding off or might skip it.)

    And lastly, I want to thank you for responding. While I was searching and searching for solutions to various other issues, I saw your name several times, and to be honest, it feels like an honor that you are taking the time to help me! Even if it sounds silly, I'm very grateful.

    Depending on your patience and willingness, I may have other questions, but part of me thinks they may be moot depending on your reply to this. It seems you have occasional commentary on others' situations and systems, and I'd love to hear it, in part because I've seen you being reassuring in the past, LOL. I've been quite upset about these matters, and just beginning to understand them is already setting me -- if only a bit -- at ease.

  • goofylittlerhin's avatar
    goofylittlerhin
    4 years ago

    @puzzlezaddict

    I am very, very confused. I wrote a reply to you which took some time, and it seems to have vanished. I'll try to reproduce it as best I remember, but I may seriously be forgetting something important in what I had to say or ask.

    I began by saying that it took me much longer than it probably takes you (lol) to understand how the coding rates for 150 vs 200 sims, but that over a period of time last night and today, I was able (I think) to reproduce the math. I then posted the config.log stats that you mention, and continued below them. Here they are:

    === Application info ===
    Name: Sims4
    Version: 1.81.72.1030
    Build: Release 64 Bit
    === Rating info ===
    GPU: 5 GPU Memory: 4 CPU: 3 RAM: 4 CPU Speed: 2208 Threading: 3
    Adjusted CPU: 3112 RAM: 16146 Adjusted RAM: 15634 Cores: 8
    === Machine info ===
    OS version: Windows 10 10.0.22000
    OS prod type:
    OS major ver: 10
    OS minor ver: 0
    OS SP major ver:
    OS SP minor ver:
    OS is 64Bit: 1
    CPU: GenuineIntel
    Brand: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-10870H CPU @ 2.20GHz
    Family: 6
    Model: 5
    Cores: 8
    HT: 1
    x64: 1
    Memory: 16146MB
    Free memory: 11000MB
    VA space: 134217728MB
    User: 🙂
    Computer: 🙂
    === Graphics device info ===
    Number: 0
    Name (driver): NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU
    Name (database): NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU [Found: 1, Supported: 1]
    Vendor: NVIDIA
    Chipset: Vendor: 10de, Device: 24dd, Board: 0a751028, Chipset: 00a1
    Driver: nvldumdx.dll, Version: 30.0.14.9649, GUID: D7B71E3E-679D-11CF-2956-7B2A0EC2D335
    Driver version: 9649
    Monitor: \\.\DISPLAY1
    Texture memory: 8044MB
    Vertex program: 3.0
    Pixel program: 3.0
    Hardware TnL: 1
    Opt. features: +sab +a8l8 +rgba16f +r32f +bc4 +bc5 -rawz +intz

    I then said it appears my CPU rating is the "culprit," and said I was able to reproduce the math that leads to this conclusion in the programming.

    I said that what I've seen while poking around online suggests I can keep a 200-sim limit anyway, and asked for your opinion on this. I also asked for your opinions generally, as I've seen your name about the internet and have noticed that you are very kind in offering occasional commentary regarding others' systems, or in answer to their questions.

    I also thanked you for taking the time to reply to me specifically because I've seen your name here and there; I said I thought I sounded silly, but that it was an honor. I finished, I think, by implying that I might have further questions or commentary but that it'll depend on your reply here and on your willingness. 🙂

  • goofylittlerhin's avatar
    goofylittlerhin
    4 years ago

    @puzzlezaddict 

    I have twice attempted to respond to you. The response is vanishing moments after I post it. By the second occurrence, I figured something about the nature of the response is getting it removed. I reviewed all rules and have zero clue -- absolutely none. How do I respond to you or get my information to you? I am extremely confused and have no idea in the world how to proceed.

  • puzzlezaddict's avatar
    puzzlezaddict
    Hero+
    4 years ago

    @goofylittlerhino  Sometimes the spam filter gets a little aggressive, for reasons I at least don't completely understand, but at least I can read your posts now.  (Thanks @EA_Jason for that.)

    You're right that the CPU rating is the reason for the lower recommended sim limit.  The processor itself is more than powerful enough to deserve an uber rating, but the issue is that Sims 4 only uses its base clock speed to rate it, not its turbo.  So as far as the game is concerned, it doesn't matter that the CPU can turbo much higher speeds.

    As far as what happens when you're actually playing, I'd guess the CPU runs well above 3 GHz; how high exactly would depend in large part on how the manufacturer tuned the system.  But the bottom line is that the processor can easily handle 200 sims, or 500, or whatever number you want to use.  So can the other components, so yes, you can go ahead and use whatever setting works for you.

    Sims 4 will slow down on its own from time to time, and it'll happen more often as your saves include more sims that you've actively played, but it won't be the fault of your computer.  The game engine itself just isn't as efficient as we'd like.

    If you have other questions, please do ask, I mean that's the whole point of this site.

  • goofylittlerhin's avatar
    goofylittlerhin
    4 years ago

    @EA_Jason 

    Ha!  You are so kind.  I won't feel bad if you delete the second; I believe it's mostly a repeat of the first.  And I do apologize for the trouble.

  • goofylittlerhin's avatar
    goofylittlerhin
    4 years ago

    (heads up to @EA_Jason if this post actually SHOULD be removed, lol)

    @puzzlezaddict 

    I was having enormous lag problems, and I am now using the mod that (so I've read in two spots ... is this really true?) EA itself recommends for lag. It's actually great. It doesn't eliminate the lag, but reduces the amount of dead time where my sims are standing around; in addition, time-designated events are smoother and actually happen at the designated time. I only forgo mentioning the mod in case we're supposed to minimize our talk of that stuff.

    You've really answered everything I wanted to know right here, and I'm glad you've got the designation "Hero" as that is what you've just been to me. This has also been a great experience generally, and makes me more comfortable about coming here to ask questions. I've done a few bug reports but I was very, very uncomfortable coming here for this. I've been set at ease and I have you and, in a sense, EA_Jason to thank for that.

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