Re: SMOKE GRENADES AS GROUND LOOT

@XxColdFangxX Smoke grenades would require a scanning legend or attachment to work around while thermites can be simply avoided. Such a change wouldn't break the game but it would irritate more of the community than it would help.

We already have options to counter/minimize third parties that never work because nobody communicates. Adding smoke grenades would just be adding one more counter that 90% don't use properly.

@heme725Again we already have scanning attachments and legends that can do this. Digital threat. Bloodhound, seer.
Scans don't need to be permanent. If they are it's too op and ruins the game.
Sure I can agree that things don't work as intended in the game, but that's the players issues for not knowing how to work together. Still doesn't mean it's a bad idea.
In all honesty they probably wouldn't be used nearly as much as termites or frags, but the excuses of team work or needing work arounds for it to fit into the game is a poor one at best.

Your team isn't always going to have a Bangalore on it to provide a smokey cover for a get away or a rez, but you know what teams have on them a majority of the time? A scanning legend, and there really isn't much of a work around for that other than reposition yourself when it wears off or hope you're good enough to hold your own when the enemy team comes. 

I can imagine if someone did have a smoke grenade, if they pop it too soon, scan legends can just pick them up through it. However if the scan goes first then the grenade it could be a helpful escape. 

It really doesn't seem that big an issue to me like yourself and helper are trying to make it out to be.

@XxColdFangxX Yes we have a Scan meta problem already and that's my point. I'm slightly concerned that equipment that necessitates more scans would make the community dig into such Legends more. I'd definitely switch to Bloodhound if every enemy team I fought tried to smoke their way away from me. It's simply common sense.

I'm also not making it out to be a big deal. My stance is that the change wouldn't break the game but it may irritate more players than it benefits. I personally dislike it and I'm making an amateur attempt to predict how players will adapt to such a change. My viewpoint is negative but I obviously can't be sure how things will play out.

@heme725
Guess it really depends on how you like to play.
I'm not going to opt to a scan legends over a legend I'm more comfortable playing on the off chance the team I encounter is going to have smokes.
Even with out smokes, how often do you come across teams with scan legends? I really don't think the addition of a grenade is going to impact that number so much more than it already is.
I also highly doubt that every team you encounter would use just smokes as a way to escape.
People escape without them as is. It's just part of the game play.
Just about every fps game has a smoke grenade additive and they don't even have scan things to bypass it. It's a logical item to have in a battleground setting.
There's also the fact that people will probably still prefer damaging with frags or thermite, or the Arc shield damage over a means of escape.
You can't accurately predict how the players will react to such an addition when there are so many different ways that people play the game.

When you come out of the gate biasing your opinion with inaccuracies, it looks like making mountains out of mole hills.
For the people who'd want to use a smoke grenade, I'm not about to say it's a 'bad idea' because of inability to predict how it will turn out or because of how the already bad scan meta might be affected.

Your prediction could also be right, but we won't know until it's an actual thing. 

Notice how I said it wasn't a bad idea. Not that it was a great one. I'm not 100% on board with a smoke grenade. A smaller consumable version of what Bangalore does is feasible, but because of the scan meta, I don't see it getting much use. If given the option I'd take a thermite over a smoke, but if that's the only thing around I'd grab it and perhaps use it if needed. 

Both you and helper argued that to have smoke grenades then you need a legend to counter it and I just don't find that true. There are other ways to counter a smoke besides seeing through it. Throw a frag or thermite in there. Shoot randomly, charge in yourself and hope for the best or predict where the enemy will go. It's not a brick wall.

There was also a lot of other opinions I just don't  see the logic behind and I voiced my own explanations for them. 

Imo the scan legends need to go. Maybe not entirely but their scanning shouldn't be finding people. I'm all for legends that have unique abilities, but when it comes to things like wall hacks they should be limited to an in game item like the digital threat where not almost every team is going to have one. 

Maybe a heart beat sensor that's either consumed on use or has a very limited time frame with a cool down period.

Having legends with the abilities like bloodhound and seer makes legends like Bangalore pointless. I hardly ever see her in game. 

But I can already imagine the player outcry if they were taken away now.

I also don't think legends should be made to counter another. Their abilities are supposed to be unique so when you have one that can just flip the switch on another's abilities it kind of defeats the purpose. Being able to handle it outside the ability is fine. I.e shooting caustic traps, rampart barriers, or killing an opponent being rez by LL drone. Those are balanced obstacles to over come, but if you need another legend to get the job done, like how Valk could get to certain places no other legend could and you were screwed unless you had top notch sniper aim or a Valk yourself, then something's wrong.

@XxColdFangxX 

I mean, the Thermite existed long before these legends.

Fuse's kit is based around grenades.

Maggie? Well I mean, her ability doesn't really replicate the thermite in a literal sense, it's IMO way different.

I think it's fine taking an already existing thing from ground loot and making a stronger ability of it, though personally not a fan of taking abilities and downscaling them into ground loot.

Legend picks determine how well your squad will function, this is part of strategy and the team synergy with the abilities in question.

It's quite important for good team work, I can tell you that, it's not something we should just start disregarding.

@XHelperZwasn't fuse one of the og legends?
While yes Maggie did come after the thermite it just doesn't make much sense to me to say an item would be useless because a legend already does it in a better way.
A simple smoke grenade wouldn't be nearly as good as what Bangalore does, but it could be handy in a pinch.
And sure I can understand how legend picks can affect team out come, but if it were more important than the actual team work, we would see the same legends winning every game.
With certain metas going around we see more legends in the winner circle than others, but I've won with legends I don't pick for the sake of being tactical and I'm sure there's plenty of others that don't pick legends based off predicting how the game will go.

@XxColdFangxX 

IIRC, Fuse released in S8, so that's definitely not one of the OG lege.ds

Yeah you are correct, Bangalore won't become useless.

Though typically when smoking, you don't need those 3 smokes to just close off a spot to rotate.

So for smoking off certain doors or spots, it's just something that a smoke nade can do.

Honestly, we could try it, though I personally think it wouldn't really go well.

Legend picks are pretty important in general, we can already see that certain legends have a higher pickrate than others.

Though we typically see a good combination of this, making it easier to combine certain tacticals/ults.

Whilst every legend can be quite universal, I think it's still important to divide users with certain jobs, meaning that legend picks should have a great synergy with each other.

@XHelperZAh though he was og for some reason. I played very briefly in s5, don't remember which legends were out then. Came back for a bit in season 10. Played on and off until these last two seasons. I want to see the new map, but with MM I'd probably only play for a week or so before getting annoying with it.
As I mentioned in another post, while I think they could be handy, I don't see them getting much use due to the scan meta. I don't think they're a horrible idea, but not a great one either.
Maybe for more experienced players that have an actual team synergy would be an important factor as for a casual solo like me, it really plays no difference in how the matches turn out.
Generally I main LL. My job as to say would be to keep the team alive. My teammates don't have any rhyme or reason to their choices of picks. Some of the match up would be legends that would work out well together but it doesn't play out because the lack of team work in a solo que environment.
I'm not going to say synergy doesn't play a part in team success, I just don't think it's bigger than team work or your ability to play a certain legend.
Some teams make up for lack of synergy because of their experience and how well they know their legends.
If I were to try to synergies with my team and took a legend I didn't really know how to play, it would not go well. The synergy would be non existent due to my lack of experience.

Also no offense, but being ok with ground loot being turned into an ability, but not the reverse, sounds hypocritical