Should Ash Keep Her Dash?

From my experience as MNK player I welcomed all mobility abilities:
- Octane jumppad with directional change
- Revs charged jump
- Vantage as a new character
- Ash dash
- Pathfinder's double grapple perk and previously long zipline edition
- Sparrow with double jump

Why? Because in many cases due to linear movement speed and lack of strafing (unless you abuse scripts and do those crazy bunny hops left to right without losing speed) if I got caught "out in the open" I had experience that people especially with aim assist just locked onto me and never missed.
Now when I "feel" I am getting locked on, I have ability to get out of that situation.
In that regards I would want Octane to take a bit less damage from stimming, I view that nerf as one that made him irrelevant - stimming in seconds drains your health and it is no longer viable, I would like to see a balance where you can stim at least twice per 30 seconds and not drain more than half of the health.

At the same time in all of the above + Horizon gravity lift (maybe I am missing something else) I have had my biggest complaint - shot accuracy during those mobility movements.
Back in season 9? Horizon's lift was nerfed introducing "wobble" and decreased accuracy / increased recoil while in it AND I think that was THE RIGHT move, as mobility should be at the cost of accuracy as it is (or was) in Apex initially and is true for other games including extreme cases like Valorant or especially CS where you can't hit basically anything while moving with automatic weapons.

Unfortunately people still praise streamers (can't share names for sure because forum rules) that managed to be pinpoint accurate from Horizon's lift and all fanboys say "omg what a recoil control" while normal humans can't do even 1/10 of that accuracy which makes me wonder.
Same goes with any combination of the above mentioned mobility ability + super accurate shooting while moving much faster or much higher vertically.

Given Respawn has not stated (ever) details on how which mechanics in the game should work, we can only wonder is it hacks + abilities that make them OP or is it intended OP combination...

I would be totally fine if mobility gave opportunity to relocate, potentially heal during the process (using cells or battery during Horizon's lift or going into bunny hopping after other abilities and healing while still moving decently fast / going behind cover) BUT I AM TOTALLY AGAINST the combination where you can pull off relocation in combination with 90 hit Mastiff shots or now more often case of beaming people with Devotion or R-99 even before speed burst is over, that is too unfair.

I would set recoil / accuracy to basically "you can't hit s#$@ even being aimgod" while any of the abilities are in use, speed exceeds hipfire running speed.

This is a horrible take. People make mistakes. No one is perfect even if you think developers should be. You become a developer and let me know how it goes for you because I felt no empathy.

Eshshshss​ 

Thank you for your Reply.

points of agreement:

I agree that Aim Assist provides an advantage in sudden close-quarters combat.

I agree that shooting accuracy during high-speed movement is currently too high.

Points of Disagreement:

I am cautious about further enhancing the mobility of Skirmisher class character.

reasons for disagreement:

・Apex Legends is a battle royale with 20 teams of 3 players. Significantly widening the gap in mobility among characters could increase the likelihood of internal squad coordination errors.

・While inducing opponent errors is part of the game's appeal, I believe current mobility levels are sufficient.

・A recent team-wide movement speed buff was added to the Skirmisher class. Enhancing individual character mobility through abilities or ultimates would undermine the purpose of that recent countermeasure.

・I oppose both excessive buffs and excessive nerfs. If overpowered (OP) characters become prevalent, it creates a situation where players must pick OP characters to compete, narrowing strategic diversity and preventing players from using their preferred characters.

・If pick rates become skewed, it will negatively impact the sales of cosmetic items for less-used characters, which could in turn affect the game's player base and revenue. This is a detrimental outcome for us players as well.

conclusion:

・I oppose excessive character buffs and nerfs as they lead to the stagnation of strategic options and limit players' ability to choose their preferred characters.

・I agree that shooting accuracy during high-speed movement is too high.

・While I understand concerns about Aim Assist, I cannot agree that enhancing mobility is the correct solution, as it could create other problems.

my proposals:

・Ash should be reverted to her previous state. If buffs are deemed necessary, they should focus on assisting her existing performance rather than adding new features.

・If the goal is to introduce blink (dash) abilities into the game, they should be assigned to a Skirmisher class character rather than Ash. I recommend creating a new character for this purpose.

・If players feel there is a lack of mobility for Skirmisher characters, perhaps easing skill activation conditions would be better than simply increasing their mobility stats.

・Close-quarters combat tends to favor Aim Assist. To protect MNK users, instead of increasing mobility, consider revisiting skill activation conditions and effective durations for relevant abilities.

SnapCracklePop94​ 

Thank you for your feedback.

If my feedback came across as dismissing the hard work of the developers or the difficulty of achieving perfect balance, that was not my intention.

My feedback is by no means meant to deny the development team's efforts; rather, it's an expression of my concerns about the current state and my hope for a better game.

I strongly wish for Apex Legends to be a healthier and more enjoyable experience.

The best developers were fired or left themselves.

Now we have what we have. It's sad to see what they've done to this game.

Best regards.

Blekerodo​ 

Thank you for your feedback.

Your words,  convey a deep sense of disappointment and anxiety about the game. I deeply empathize with your complex feelings about the current situation.

It's natural for us players to feel uncertain about whether our sincere feedback reaches the developers and if it's being properly considered, no matter how much we continue to provide it. I, too, have recently felt disheartened each time I've sensed things are 'back to how they were.' This very disappointment is what compelled me to post my feedback.

I'm not looking for agreement. I just want to know. What are the developers thinking, and what decisions have led to the game's current state? Precisely because I love this game, I can't give up on it. Is this voice reaching them?

Not sure why you are bringing up different classes and their perks. Imo Ash dash has nothing to do with that. Imo and experience dash is used only to throw off enemy's aim / tracking mostly in close range fights, secondly I would assume if caught out in the open area. Dash is basically useless in longer range fights.

Same goes for in team coordination - you can't gain "that much" distance with dash e.g. in comparison to Rev's leap, Path's grapple, Octane stim etc. Coordination suffers imo mostly / only because people inability to communicate and/or process information during stressful situations - your "I can only run and gun, not IGL" type of players which are basically majority especially ones that use controller.

Finally I would not base many decisions based on pickrate - there are too many "brainless fanboys/fangirls" that would play "meta" just for sake of playing most popular legends, at the same time having 0 clue how to play them.
People in higher ranks still play quite random comps, just example from yesterday from games that went well for me following legends were present in my team / enemy teams:
- Pathfinder especially on Worlds edge
- Meggie
- Wattson
- Lifeline (personally best results on her for me, even went on like 500 RP+ streak at one point playing her, Ballistic and Alter)
- Mirage
- Loba especially on Worlds edge
- Rev
- Newcastle
- Wraith
- Rampart
- to a certain extent Crypto

Given I was playing a lot of Ash since her arrival (liked the passive that helped track enemy movements - very useful when soloqing) I already liked her and the snare = free to stop enemy in its tracks and kill ability. When buff of double snare or tripple time came around = amazing, maybe a bit OP. Then they also fixed the Ult placement mechanics = now it is more reliable.
I think the game changer is not so much dash rather dash + AA / hacks combination. As before you could close the distance with many Legends but they were linear, predictable (except Path's grapple and abuse of Octane jump pad and tapstrafing). Now with addition of dash most will use Ult -> Dash  -> enemy wifs half-mag+ -> AA / hack and one-mag him back. In combination with rising number of hackers Ash pickrate increase is imo clear outcome. Before it was legends like Octane, Path, Rev = highly mobile, very useful for hackers to run towards their next pray, close distance instantly, make tracking them much harder for legit players. Now Ash is just the same + has snare = you will often see that if hackers fail at mobile part they will switch to tactics of snaring you and then "magically" throwing perfect or **bleep** near perfect skynades. Most Preds just automatically do that and you can't avoid it and it is more lethal than dash if you ask me.

And the fact that Ash was less popular before just meant that there were other OP legends like support meta (people could re-heal faster than being downed) or Rev+Crypto ult (doing damage or buffing yourself for significant advantage and basically 100% 1v1 win if combined with hacks) before that.  Otherwise snare + skynade + aimbot was always present tactics for highest rank players - you can check Season 22 or prior top Preds and there were already then many Ash "mains".

Eshshshss​ Thank you for your reply.

I am not singling out Ash's dash alone as being problematic. I believe that the combination of Ash's "dash" ability and her characteristics as an Assault class character is what makes her dangerous. Indeed, the fact that her previous abilities were targeted for nerfs after her rework indicates the threat this combination poses.

It's a shared understanding between you and me that highly mobile characters, not just Ash, are favored by cheaters. Furthermore, it's only natural that Ash is popular among cheaters, given her excellent Assault-like abilities combined with her superior mobility.

The skewed pick rates are a serious problem.

I disagree with the notion that pick rates are not biased in high-ranked lobbies. Even in Predator/Master tiers, Ash stands out significantly at 34.6%, followed by Ballistic at 16.5%, Alter at 12.3%, Pathfinder at 8.6%, and Sparrow at 6.2%. Meanwhile, nearly half of the entire roster, 12 characters, have less than 1% pick rate. This clearly demonstrates a severe imbalance, regardless of rank tier.

If you watch this video on youtube called "Apex Legends | Legend Pick Rates 2021-2024 | MUSICAL BATTLE" you will see that similar situation was present pretty much always:
1 legend that is basically must have because overbuffed
2-4 legends being in battle for close 2nd place
1-3 legends that are like "fan favorites" - your soloq Wraith picks no matter how nerfed she was, Wattson fanboys/fangirls, ADHD Octane kids etc.
1 legend "short rise to top" when released followed by crypto like slumps shortly after as hype wears away or legend is hardly reworked.

And in Apex this tendency is actually not that bad even if I compare it to Valorant where people literary will take timeout penalties if their "main" is picked by someone else or team does not pick certain legend combo / meta.

Also many believe (I am not one of them) in strategy that you better get really good at playing one legend vs being good/average with most = people just can't play to its average best level all legends most of time, don't feel comfortable, in many cases even mess up teamwork because bad timing of ability uses - just yesterday one Ash fanboy wanting to "save me" ported me into Lava and then followed up by trying to pick me up there...and that's D3/D2 level player who probably started playing Ash just this split.

Discord is no exception - especially NA side LFG posts very often contain texts to play meta, play certain legends = forcing people to do that or sit idle.

Finally it takes less effort to play X legends vs all of them and given many even ranked players are "casuals" they don't bother investing time in training multiple tricks vs they just copy/paste game after game same tactics, now it is = knock someone -> ashport -> dash -> devotion / r99 s#$@ out of the rest standing. Or vice versa when on receiving end = get knocked -> take Alter portal back -> reset -> repeat.
You can add here also legends that are highly MNK oriented (require looking around, loads of crosshair movement, directional changes) - Path, Valk, Bang to certain extent, Sparrow - which are not picked a lot more because most play on controllers. As well as legends that thrive in good teamwork but are pain to play when team does not function well - Gibi (with sad lonely bubble death), Newcastle, Rampart, Catalyst, Wattson (to a degree), Caustic (even old version), Conduit. And again those are not picked / picked only on higher ranks, because even up until high Masters people can't teamwork in this game and relay 90%+ on running and gunning, outshooting enemies rather than outsmarting them / outplaying with numbers.

Eshshshss​ 

Thank you for your reply.

I understand your point that, based on YouTube videos and past trends, there has always been a "must-pick" legend and a tendency for pick rates to be skewed. However, is an "always skewed" state truly healthy for the game?

Regarding your opinion that "random compositions are seen in higher ranks," I respectfully disagree. I presented pick rate data from mid-June for both Predator and Master tiers, which shows Ash significantly standing out at 34.6%, with a few top legends dominating the majority of picks. Meanwhile, 12 legends—nearly half of the entire roster of 27—remain below a 1% pick rate. This situation clearly indicates a severe lack of strategic diversity, not just for specific player segments, but even within high-level play environments like Predator and Master.

You mentioned factors like "players preferring easy wins," "specializing in one skill," and "lack of teamwork." These certainly exist as player-side factors. However, doesn't the developers' inaction regarding excessively overpowered legends contribute to and encourage such player behavior? If a particular legend offers an "easy path to victory," players naturally choose it as an effort to adapt to the environment. This can be seen as a direct result of the environment created by the developers. 

We players desire a game environment where more legends are viable, allowing us to choose our favorite characters and enjoy diverse strategies. The current pick rate imbalance is not merely a result of player choice; I believe it's an indication that the game's design is strongly guiding those choices towards specific legends.(In fact, a recolored version of Pathfinder's gloves was released around the same time as his re-buff.)

As you said, I agree that the "dash + AA/hack combination" amplifies Ash's threat. But precisely because of this, shouldn't we reconsider the balance of Ash's dash ability itself, which forms the foundation of that combination?