Mouse & Keyboard Only Servers Already!

Great math skill @CCbathwater !

I agree with the figures, yet you forgot to mention that 40% of 100 is 40 and that gap can't be closed because without assist in this equation/illustration M&K people get to "just" 100 not 140. Thus you see the huge skill gap appearing between P1 and D4 levels - I call it "welcome to software assist world" - given when spectating my killers I rarely go "wow yeah this player has movement, thinking, game awareness etc.".

In any case, off with the math, this video I found quickly on Youtube clearly shows how aim assist works and if you compare it to streamers or people that kill you in the game you see 1:1 comparison of what is going on: https://youtu.be/ujEtRDiSUV8

From my demos and tracking, I see that these minor discrepancies/misses are all there is between hitting and missing. Sure there are times when I go "wtf did I just do there" when my aiming was nowhere near, but usually my crosshair is 0.5 cm or less (actually just measured it from my demos) on 32" screen off/around target which I am 100% sure would qualify for this "gravitational pull" controller players have.

End of story - there is a clear mechanical (khm khm software) advantage available in the game for certain players and if you ask me for no particular reason - we don't eat soup with the nife or fork right... same should be applicable for games: wanna be top X %, well then you have to have certain hardware given we are not giving people free 240+ hz monitors, GPUs that can pull 190 fps etc etc.

And 100% of a dead cat is just a dead cat. 100% of AA is... yeah. But again, we seem to be back at it's only my game that's busted, as apparently everybody else on controller doesn't have to aim. Dezignful even once claimed on twitter that he didn't have to touch his right stick at all. 😏

Edit - And maybe that video is something when you have sound on, as by the video alone... yeah. Don't see anything interesting?

Anyway, might bother with sound on later, but I have already seen HisandHers test it live, and yes, that just proved my point fine.

Oh boy another one of these threads. I'm just gonna sit here and watch.....

Oh don't mind me, just watching these endless KBM vs controller debates. They usually lead to nothing then the same people would post the same thing after 2 weeks.

I agree that PC players should be able to opt out of crossplay.

I massively disagree that controller aim assist is superior to MnK.

@Cheese9Man
"They usually lead to nothing"
am afraid I have to say that you are wrong.........it always leads to the thread getting locked by a CM XD

@maximas1986  It was actually these threads that inspired me to try no aim assist lol, then I forgot I'd even turned it off,  only noticed again eventually when playing with the advanced settings fairly recently.

I will admit that it is noticeably present in other players play in CQC. It does not however make players unbeatable as some would have you believe lol.

I imagine however if I went into a pc lobby with aim assist off I'd still probably be the source of somebodies aim assist rant if I killed them, but the odds are I'd probably just get battered by kbm in most scenarios lol.

Discussion is always a good thing - the more we talk about the topic the more traction and opinions there are, the more research is done and the closer to a factual conclusion we get.

E.g. from real life - no one used to talk about steroids in sports and people were amazed how can other people be so athletic, good-looking etc. etc. The majority bought a myth that 3L of water combined with white rice and chicken breast + regular training will give you all the results, you just need to put in time and effort.

Now 10-15 years later those pros are openly admitting that steroids did the majority of the work and in many cases even without "such a hard" effort.

The same is happening here as the "steroid" variable is introduced in the system for no apparent reason (or maybe it is so that Respawn gets more users aka revenue streams) and in my opinion, the pointless part of this debate is about "my dad can beat your dad" or more precisely questions/comaprison:

• can newb with AA beat more experienced player
• can more experienced player become top 1% without AA
• are all experienced players better than newbs while worse than top 1%
• etc.

The main focus here should be - why there is even such AA in the game and if there is a reason for it why people can't opt out of playing vs AA if they decide to do so knowing the consequence - less player base, longer matchmaking times, etc.

And questions asked should be something like:

• can the game even distinguish between PC and console player, console player with M&K vs PC player with M&K and same for controller
• seeing top-ranked players revisit how intrusive AA should actually be - discussion of 40, 60 or less percentage, maybe it should be even rank based
• is separation into player pools per input device possible
• etc.

@Eshshshss   The key motivation behind aim assist for control players is essentially that  a kbm setup is inherently faster and more precise than a controller, so obviously aim assist is integrated to compensate for this deficit at controllers end. Or at least that's the general consensus anyway.

Which in of itself is perfectly fair as far as I'm concerned, as removal of aim assist entirely would basically freeze controller users out of any competitive multiplayer game entirely. 

Which boils down to the real question of how is the strength of aim assist determined and settled upon?

I feel understanding why aim assist has been implemented at the strength it has gives room to much more tempered argument and more constructive criticism.

I'm all for debate, it would be nice to just have some solid info on the subject matter from respawn.

You can come up with any argument logic and it would be still debatable - for f sake some people still think the earth is flat :D

But this topic boils down and show that people who play on M&K would like to opt out of playing vs controller players.

Also seeing what is happening in the hack industry aka D4+ lobbies - no matter what would be the default AA setting as long as it would be adjustable (not just on and off) there would be ways to manipulate the value read hard and soft hacking. And comments from respawn or change in AA settings would not prove anything, at least not to me, it would create just a temporary dip in some player skill level and then more profits to hack makers 🙂

@Eshshshss Your posts on this topic, here and in other threads, seem a bit cynical to me, though I'm not criticizing that. You make good points.

@pandareno1999indeed they are and that comes from my experience so far - I have been around FPS gaming since the late 90s/early 2000s, never at the level of competitive play potentially due to my stance on hacking which I did express loudly from day one yet I have been in touch with competitive players in the meantime as well.

And unfortunately, the trend of taking shortcuts is very obvious, present throughout these 20! years no matter the game, region, player base, etc.

In particular to Apex I also don't like the fact that a lot of information has been disclosed from the "general player base" e.g. in Quake 3 you had freely available console and command list and could modify your game to a crazy extent depending on your preferences which all benefited to more competitive gaming as each player showed his best and it felt like a more skill battle.

While in Apex commands are semi-unknown, many do not work/are forced from the server-side, yet you regularly see a clear difference in your game visuals vs say streamers game visuals and it becomes more of an uphill battle where people with better mechanics also has less cluttered interface and in many cases, it just boils down to the fact that you purely don't see an enemy while he/she is already on you.

The especially painful fact is that there is Nvidia inspector which clearly many people are using yet there is no alternative (that I am aware of) for Radeon users - so adding to the above said there is also hardware boundary. But that's another story 🙂

The point is this game has too many ifs buts loopholes and a lack of transparency, customization that in my opinion become obvious when you reach diamond-level lobbies and start facing those people with all the possible ticks thus experiencing a huge skill gap that is not there in any ranks before diamond. Removing controller players would at least filter part of these variables out for M&K players.