Smurfing and SBMM are beyond a joke
Adding the option to report smurfing is a step in the right direction but it’s not enough, and half the time it doesn’t let you anyway! I’m not sure if this is because people just set themselves to o...
Forum Discussion
@IdleHandsNo1
Here’s the thing: the majority of your pub lobbies are comprised of players at your skill level. Sometimes you see a masters or pred team. But the majority of these players are not in your lobby— I know this because the majority (over 50%) of my pub lobbies are actually Master and Preds.
So for the most part, you are still indeed being protected from the majority of these players. You have no idea how insane lobbies feel when everyone is a Master or Preds. You make one mistake and you die; it’s not how pubs should play.
Here’s the thing: the majority of your pub lobbies are comprised of players at your skill level. Sometimes you see a masters or pred team. But the majority of these players are not in your lobby— I know this because the majority (over 50%) of my pub lobbies are actually Master and Preds.
So for the most part, you are still indeed being protected from the majority of these players. You have no idea how insane lobbies feel when everyone is a Master or Preds. You make one mistake and you die; it’s not how pubs should play.
@Axs5626Sxa5001 Wouldn’t that be a beautiful thing, but just to clarify...smurfing isn’t just a ranked problem. I’m sure it’s true that my matches aren’t full of preds but I’ve been playing a long time and just watching a handful of pred/master trails out the jump ship is enough to know it’s already over.
Lvl 30 wraith, 4K badge, 20 bomb badge, 100’s of kills.....she’s in my lobby along with plenty of others just like her, every match and let’s play the guessing game as to what her real account looks like? I’m pretty sure I know!
- @IdleHandsNo1
But if we push the algorithm even further and make it so my lobbies aren’t 60% preds, but closer to 100% pred, how is that an enjoyable experience for me?
Because you NEVER want to play against these players, I ONLY have to play against these players? Sure this is exactly how ranked should work— but pubs?
When everyone only plays their doppelgänger, everyone wins at equal ratios— this is called equal outcomes and its kind of a bad thing for pvp activities. Ranked: fine. Unranked: no way.- @Axs5626Sxa5001 I agree with you. I’m not on your level skill wise, I occasionally land in your lobbies. When I am in them, they are definitely difficult and an entirely different game. Some of those players just have insane movement, i’m trying to chase them down and they are shooting me in the back. I’m sitting there going uh I’m so confused!! Lol
- @DarthValtrex Hey at least the game is swinging you between lobbies— this provides you with a bit of variance (sometimes your games are hard and sometimes they are medium difficulty). I find it concerning that people want STRICTER SBMM, which would actually make pubs more consistently difficult than they need to be.
Additionally, asking for stricter SBMM is also like saying “I want to win more and I want more skilled players to lose more.”
And of course, the most extreme argument I keep hearing is “all players should win at the same rates and skill shouldn’t = winning more.” This idea is the most ridiculous to me.
- @Axs5626Sxa5001 I don’t know the exact solution to this and I’m certain it’s not straight forward but I think your missing my point somewhat. It’s not that I NEVER want to play these people it’s that I’m always playing these people and they are so far above my skill lvl it’s sucking every bit of joy out of a game I love to play. Either I’m struggling to win against a lobby filled with smurfs or I’m lucky enough to get a good match then get punished for it with an even bigger spike in high lvl players, as if somehow the SBMM now thinks I’m god tier......which clearly I’m explaining I’m not. I think people who don’t cheat by smurfing and play in the bracket they are meant to be in (I have great respect for that) don’t understand just how crazy the smurfing issue is.
In my smurfing experience, as soon as you hit 100 kills the smurfing element is over. I still use my 'smurf' account to warm up if I've had an extended Apex break, but the lobbies with my 'smurf' account are sweatier than with my normal account.
@Axs5626Sxa5001
The problem is, without a functioning SBMM, a pred, a master or a very good player will "wreck havoc" in any lobby, except for lobbies in which there are other preds master or very good players to contend with.
I believe SBMM to be necessary, but it has to work. A pred should never be placed in a "bronze level" lobby, being that in pubs or ranked --which is currently what happens (MM pairs the pred with 2 weak players in an attempt to nerf him/her). Sure, lobbies are going to be, respectively to any level of skill, more challenging and require some efforts. This is what, IMO, has to be expected from a pvp focused game.
A pred should have a maximum match bracket to be between Diamond and Master. Weaker players should never see a pred, and a pred should never see a bronze, silver, gold, and plat.
I have a .7 (point 7) k/d, yet I get the following (picture) players in the lobbies often enough to be annoying.
This happens because it is not skill based, it is "performance" based matchmaking. It is all artificial and is very relative. The problem is that when the algorithm adjusts, IMO, the jump is out of the sensible. It does what you see below.That is why a match seems easy, and the next 5 or more are insta wipes. The jump is not incremental and conservative, is bold and reckless. I am not sure why that happens, it could be that there are not enough players left to offer a softer increase in difficulty after winning a match, or doing whatever the algorithm thinks supports a player being placed in a higher skill match... (top skill?)
- @Vdstrk
I’m not sold on the “master pred will wreck havoc” on a lobby that’s compromised of all skill levels. Perhaps they have a much higher chance of winning, but it’s not guaranteed. And honestly— no disrespect, skilled players beating lesser skilled players (in a non-ranked setting) isn’t a controversial idea; skilled players should ABSOLUTELY be winning matches more frequently than lesser skilled players.
If you oppose that idea, then that likely means that you support the “everyone should be winning at similar rates” idea— as mentioned earlier, this idea is “forced equal outcomes” and is a ridiculous idea for a pvp activity.
Personally, I think the game ran fine during seasons 1-3. SBMM existed but it wasn’t as strict as it is now. Back then, weaker players won less frequently, average players won at their own consistency, and the skilled players won more frequently. But to appease the desires of weaker players (“I want to win more than I do now”), they increased the SBMM.
I’m all for creating safe spaces for new players— they need an environment where they can learn. But after a certain experience level you should be exposed to opponents of all skill levels (in non-ranked modes). Skill shouldn’t “mean less” simply because weaker players want to win as much as people who practice more than them. I definitely appreciate your previous input though.
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