Added fleet to kyber GAC...

"Stokat;c-2348371" wrote:

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348361" wrote:

"Stokat;c-2348335" wrote:

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348309" wrote:

"Stokat;c-2348291" wrote:
About time we got more fleets in GAC! With the recent additions we have more than enough capitals and ships to set more defences. This will make the fleet zones more interesting.

9 capital ships + 47 ships = not enough ships. Where are the more than enough that you're referencing?

You don’t have to set full reinforcements to all cap ships. In fact it is beneficial not to do so in some cases to ensure the AI pull the ship you want as reinforcement. You set three cap ships on def and have 6 to attack with, leaving you with plenty of options for clean ups if necessary.

your strategy is to gift your opponent free points? Okay. That's certainly a tactic. Not a good one. Not a competitive one.

I really want to know where are these "more than enough ships to set more defenses" you're talking about? Should I only set 3 ships on D with each cap and gift my opponent 12 points in a tight match? And what happens if the executor needs to be 2 shot? Game over after the first battle fails? If you're going to play the "plenty of ships" card, then you go right ahead and explain EXACTLY how each team comp would work AND give you leftover ships.

Also worth noting you can say you can field 2 empire fleets but fleet counters are a thing and are severely limited.

Where did I say you shouldn’t set any reinforcements? If you leave two spots open You potentially lose like two banners and it allows you to influence what ships get called first which is a bigger advantage in some cases. And as stated, it also frees up more ships to use on offence.

But if you think it’s better to set a full def then you should that. Set three easy fleets on def, set three strong ones, mix it up, do whatever you want. You have the same amount of ships as your opponent so you are not at a disadvantage.

In my opinion it will make for more interesting fleet battles but I see this clearly upsets you. Good luck with you GA fights, I’m confident you will find the best tactic possible to your capability.

I'm not upset. I'm just asking you to prove your argument. You claim we have 9 cap ships with plenty of ships to have more than enough for both offense and defense. Myself and pretty much everyone else can only reach 7 fleets for offense & defense. With 2 cap ships who have no synergized fleets to support them. You see 9 somehow and I'm extremely curious how the last 2 would be viable.

I've done the math, looked at the fleets, I don't see more than 7 viable ones. And no, we don't always have the same ships as our opponents. There are plenty of ppl in K5-K3 who do NOT have executor or one of (maybe both if they didn't go for those GLs) Raddus/Finalizer and will struggle with this new change. I face ppl in K2 who don't have Executor and are missing either Raddus or Finalizer.

"Ravens1113;c-2348338" wrote:

"Gifafi;c-2348202" wrote:
Wait, to be at the top of the heap you need to have the newest toons and a deep roster of ships too? What is gaming coming to??!?

Too bad that even with all the ships in game you can’t have a deep enough roster to put out enough quality fleets.

7 fleets are enough for 3 slots. Not plenty, but enough.

"crzydroid;c-2348374" wrote:

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348361" wrote:

"Stokat;c-2348335" wrote:

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348309" wrote:

"Stokat;c-2348291" wrote:
About time we got more fleets in GAC! With the recent additions we have more than enough capitals and ships to set more defences. This will make the fleet zones more interesting.

9 capital ships + 47 ships = not enough ships. Where are the more than enough that you're referencing?

You don’t have to set full reinforcements to all cap ships. In fact it is beneficial not to do so in some cases to ensure the AI pull the ship you want as reinforcement. You set three cap ships on def and have 6 to attack with, leaving you with plenty of options for clean ups if necessary.

your strategy is to gift your opponent free points? Okay. That's certainly a tactic. Not a good one. Not a competitive one.

I really want to know where are these "more than enough ships to set more defenses" you're talking about? Should I only set 3 ships on D with each cap and gift my opponent 12 points in a tight match? And what happens if the executor needs to be 2 shot? Game over after the first battle fails? If you're going to play the "plenty of ships" card, then you go right ahead and explain EXACTLY how each team comp would work AND give you leftover ships.

Also worth noting you can say you can field 2 empire fleets but fleet counters are a thing and are severely limited.

I don't think he's saying NO reinforcements, he's saying not full, so the AI has limited options to call in and doesn't call in the ones that don't help. Most fleet battles are determined after two reinforcements. There can be some borderline cases where the third is what determines a hold, but otherwise if a hold happens, an easier cleanup doesn't make up for the missing 20. If you never clear it, two banners won't make a difference. If you one shot, you likely would've done so with four reinforcements and gotten the points anyway. You would never give your opponents 12 points; you are confusing it with offense banners. Your opponent would only get 1 each for the missing slots, but they might have to beat it first, I think.

At any rate, I still don't think it helps, because you are still left with a mismatch of your most mediocre ships with no synergy.

You don't have to beat the enemy to get the empty slot points. you can just enter the battle, lose, and still claim them. I know he's not implying not set any reinforcements. but even if you just set 2, that's now 6 points given for free. I don't mind giving my opponent those 2 points on Executor. I know they are negated by that ship eating your banners. How many other fleets can say they're so tough on D sacrificing those 2 points won't matter? Negotiator doesn't take many off the attacker. Malevolence won't take any. Finalizer won't take any. Rebels depend but in general you can nuke them for high banners quite comfortably. Raddus can be a bit of a wild card but her fleet is being shrunk by the reqs since she needs outside ships given res have so few to start with which will hamper her effectiveness. Empire can take some but I've gotten full banners off Empire fleets before. There's no real good options there from what I see.

It doesn’t sound like any of the devs have an idea what the community wants, does it?

Like when they changed conquest from a more fun grind to just plain grinding, with a hint of cash grabbiness

The one saving grace is that everyone is in the same boat, in terms of total possible fleets. It’s if (hopefully when) they bring a bunch of marquees out, that’s when it’s going to really give a big advantage to those who spend and damage free to play crystals for a while.

I suppose it’s like a meta shift in arena used to be. I’ll fall back for a bit. Never mind

How about we all just collectively decide to not use the 3rd defence, unless you're a kraken in Kyber 1 ?... Like it should be

Not realistic ?, well there's a better chance for that, than CG listening to the community and reversing this... Sad, but true :(

Total head in the sand nonsense as usual.

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348391" wrote:

"crzydroid;c-2348374" wrote:

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348361" wrote:

"Stokat;c-2348335" wrote:

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348309" wrote:

"Stokat;c-2348291" wrote:
About time we got more fleets in GAC! With the recent additions we have more than enough capitals and ships to set more defences. This will make the fleet zones more interesting.

9 capital ships + 47 ships = not enough ships. Where are the more than enough that you're referencing?

You don’t have to set full reinforcements to all cap ships. In fact it is beneficial not to do so in some cases to ensure the AI pull the ship you want as reinforcement. You set three cap ships on def and have 6 to attack with, leaving you with plenty of options for clean ups if necessary.

your strategy is to gift your opponent free points? Okay. That's certainly a tactic. Not a good one. Not a competitive one.

I really want to know where are these "more than enough ships to set more defenses" you're talking about? Should I only set 3 ships on D with each cap and gift my opponent 12 points in a tight match? And what happens if the executor needs to be 2 shot? Game over after the first battle fails? If you're going to play the "plenty of ships" card, then you go right ahead and explain EXACTLY how each team comp would work AND give you leftover ships.

Also worth noting you can say you can field 2 empire fleets but fleet counters are a thing and are severely limited.

I don't think he's saying NO reinforcements, he's saying not full, so the AI has limited options to call in and doesn't call in the ones that don't help. Most fleet battles are determined after two reinforcements. There can be some borderline cases where the third is what determines a hold, but otherwise if a hold happens, an easier cleanup doesn't make up for the missing 20. If you never clear it, two banners won't make a difference. If you one shot, you likely would've done so with four reinforcements and gotten the points anyway. You would never give your opponents 12 points; you are confusing it with offense banners. Your opponent would only get 1 each for the missing slots, but they might have to beat it first, I think.

At any rate, I still don't think it helps, because you are still left with a mismatch of your most mediocre ships with no synergy.

You don't have to beat the enemy to get the empty slot points. you can just enter the battle, lose, and still claim them. I know he's not implying not set any reinforcements. but even if you just set 2, that's now 6 points given for free. I don't mind giving my opponent those 2 points on Executor. I know they are negated by that ship eating your banners. How many other fleets can say they're so tough on D sacrificing those 2 points won't matter? Negotiator doesn't take many off the attacker. Malevolence won't take any. Finalizer won't take any. Rebels depend but in general you can nuke them for high banners quite comfortably. Raddus can be a bit of a wild card but her fleet is being shrunk by the reqs since she needs outside ships given res have so few to start with which will hamper her effectiveness. Empire can take some but I've gotten full banners off Empire fleets before. There's no real good options there from what I see.

Ummm, it is only "free points" if they are losing to your fleet. If they win, they get the banners anyway. If they are attacking and retreating, they get banners for unoccupied reinforcement slots, but they lose 20 banners for first attempt win.

"Ravens1113;c-2348396" wrote:

This change is too soon. Eventually it could and should be happening but until we get that shipload of content to fill out fleets for all 9 of our capital ships it’s too soon.

If The Road Ahead (or some other forward looking post) showed us what was planned for fleet, then we might be a bit more receptive to this change. Right now, we don't know anything except that this change is going to happen in the next arena season, we don't have enough ships to support it, and we don't know when we will have enough ships to support it.

"Ravens1113;c-2348423" wrote:

"Rokaryn_Mazel;c-2348420" wrote:

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348391" wrote:

"crzydroid;c-2348374" wrote:

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348361" wrote:

"Stokat;c-2348335" wrote:

"InyakSolomon88;c-2348309" wrote:

"Stokat;c-2348291" wrote:
About time we got more fleets in GAC! With the recent additions we have more than enough capitals and ships to set more defences. This will make the fleet zones more interesting.

9 capital ships + 47 ships = not enough ships. Where are the more than enough that you're referencing?

You don’t have to set full reinforcements to all cap ships. In fact it is beneficial not to do so in some cases to ensure the AI pull the ship you want as reinforcement. You set three cap ships on def and have 6 to attack with, leaving you with plenty of options for clean ups if necessary.

your strategy is to gift your opponent free points? Okay. That's certainly a tactic. Not a good one. Not a competitive one.

I really want to know where are these "more than enough ships to set more defenses" you're talking about? Should I only set 3 ships on D with each cap and gift my opponent 12 points in a tight match? And what happens if the executor needs to be 2 shot? Game over after the first battle fails? If you're going to play the "plenty of ships" card, then you go right ahead and explain EXACTLY how each team comp would work AND give you leftover ships.

Also worth noting you can say you can field 2 empire fleets but fleet counters are a thing and are severely limited.

I don't think he's saying NO reinforcements, he's saying not full, so the AI has limited options to call in and doesn't call in the ones that don't help. Most fleet battles are determined after two reinforcements. There can be some borderline cases where the third is what determines a hold, but otherwise if a hold happens, an easier cleanup doesn't make up for the missing 20. If you never clear it, two banners won't make a difference. If you one shot, you likely would've done so with four reinforcements and gotten the points anyway. You would never give your opponents 12 points; you are confusing it with offense banners. Your opponent would only get 1 each for the missing slots, but they might have to beat it first, I think.

At any rate, I still don't think it helps, because you are still left with a mismatch of your most mediocre ships with no synergy.

You don't have to beat the enemy to get the empty slot points. you can just enter the battle, lose, and still claim them. I know he's not implying not set any reinforcements. but even if you just set 2, that's now 6 points given for free. I don't mind giving my opponent those 2 points on Executor. I know they are negated by that ship eating your banners. How many other fleets can say they're so tough on D sacrificing those 2 points won't matter? Negotiator doesn't take many off the attacker. Malevolence won't take any. Finalizer won't take any. Rebels depend but in general you can nuke them for high banners quite comfortably. Raddus can be a bit of a wild card but her fleet is being shrunk by the reqs since she needs outside ships given res have so few to start with which will hamper her effectiveness. Empire can take some but I've gotten full banners off Empire fleets before. There's no real good options there from what I see.

Ummm, it is only "free points" if they are losing to your fleet. If they win, they get the banners anyway. If they are attacking and retreating, they get banners for unoccupied reinforcement slots, but they lose 20 banners for first attempt win.

And his point is that it could mean the difference between a win and a loss by just those select few banners

Sure, it is possible in very corner cases where they arent clearing and you aren't clearing and you set less than max reinforcements and the fight is decided by a handful of banners.

Shrug.

A lot of issues with 3 fleets, but I don't think this extreme corner case will be one.

Many many people set less than 7 ships per fleet now and I've never seen it make the difference in a W/L.
That won't change.